How to respond to men "helping" when I've said no

[noraheggerty]

This happens to me a fair bit. A man will ask if he can help, often it's to carry something for me, or lift a bag onto the luggage rack etc. If I would actually like some help then I'll say yes. But usually I don't, so I say no. They ask a second time; I say, again, politely, "No, thank you".

Then they literally manhandle my property, taking it off me, pulling on the bag straps to wrest it from my grasp!

Is this normal? I am a fair bit stronger than the average woman, so perhaps with some things I might be carrying or doing, they just can't believe I don't need help? But the other day someone did this with my violin case! Which is not in any sense a heavy item. So it's not always that. Not that it makes any difference why they are doing it, it's still crap but I'm just wondering if I get it more than other women.

Do you all experience this and if so, what do you say to them? Until now I've tended to just let them do it because I don't want to be rude. But I've decided I'm not going to put up with it any more, so I could use some advice on how to respond.

Bloody hell!

Yes, this happens to me same as you OP, every 2 weeks (public transport and airports).

In your case and the violin -
palm outstretched - say “please stop”
then smile - say “I appreciate your kindness” as you carry on.

Though I'm now getting to an age where I sometimes do appreciate a hand…
(random man at Stansted grabbed and hefted my 22 Kg bag up onto an eye-level shelf - which I couldn’t then physically lift down 🤣)

I travel by train all the time - I'm on one now! And usually with a heavy suitcase. But I can honestly say it's very rare for anyone to offer to help me. I've certainly never had someone wrestle my stuff out of my hands.

I did once find myself on a busy train sat next to a man who I realised was masturbating with his hand down his trackies. That was really horrible. But that's the only thing that's happened in many decades of train travel.

If men were constantly grabbing my stuff I would be yelling at them to fuck off!

To be fair I work on a checkout, I’m a woman, and a lot of people say they’re fine and don’t need help getting eg something into a trolley/ lifting/ handling something and sometimes I kind of nearly have to ignore them/ half help or something because they’ve just done something that makes me think actually it’s really going to hurt them if someone doesn’t help a bit. I wish people would take help more, I’m only working there a year and I’ve heard of/ seen people buckle/ nearly fall over etc etc

Interesting. I’ve been offered but then I say “No thank you” and get on with it myself, so no chance for a protracted conversation or for them to grab anything out of my hands. But you mentioned about appearances which is interesting. I’m 5’ 7’’ (not tall, but not short) and I am a curvy, but stocky size 12 (still have some of my rugby build). I suppose I don’t look like what might be termed a typical ‘Damsel in Distress’ look (if you see what I mean - not trying to offend anyone here l) and I wonder if people offer to be polite but know that I’m more than capable. Ironically, I have a mallet splint on a broken thumb at the moment which has made life a bit tricky and not one person has volunteered to help me with anything! But I’ve not been on public transport since it happened - just around and about town in the normal way. I think it’s fine to ponder on these questions OP. Reminds me of my Dad - he’s 80 this year and hates being offered help… apart from when he wants ME to do everything for him!!

I wouldn't describe it as physical force no, but each time proceeded to take my cases to 'help' after I'd said no thanks I can manage. I didn't resist at that point, just accepted the help, but after I'd said no I'm fine thanks.

Sounds bloody annoying.

Instead of saying no thank you or im ok or I can manage, try saying I don't want any help thank you. Say it a bit loud and very clear. Or please leave it, i don't want help.

I say that because there's the social dance that people do in a lot of things and this is one of them
Do you want help.
No I can manage
Are you sure
Yes I dont want to trouble you.
Its no bother...

Whereas stating clearly in a firm voice that you do not want any help , emphasis on the want, makes it clear that this isn't one of those refusing out of politeness when actually you would quite like the help.

That's in relation to genuine social dance cases not the bloody arrogant ones like grabbing your stuff off you and walking away with it of course.

But the good thing is that loudly stating you don't want help covers both.

As does will you just fuck right off, to be fair.

Trolls? I can honestly say this has never happened to me in my life! I’m just over 5’ so there have been times when I’d have been delighted if someone helped my with my bags on an overhead rack. I’ve also never seen it happen to anyone else. I have seen a woman struggling with a pushchair on the underground refusing help from a bloke because she ‘can manage myself thanks’ nearly lose her child down the steps when she clearly couldn’t manage the pushchair, her rucksack and wet steps. Luckily another bloke coming up towards her managed to stop it clattering down the remaining steps.

Get yourself a Sodastream - game changer!

Yup, this is it.

I'm quite angry that I was promised invisibility in middle age, when in fact they can see me all too well and are resentful that I even exist.

Are you young and pretty? This problem tends to lessen as you age.

I’ve genuinely never had this happen once in my life. As previous posters have commented, are your “no”s a definite, firm, fully audible “no”? I can imagine a situation where someone offering to help on a loud platform might not hear what your answer was, and carry on trying to assist because they feel it’s ruder to suddenly stop if the answer was “yes” and they misheard, than continuing if the answer was no.

Not saying that there aren’t entitled tossers out there who think they know better than you, but I’m bemused this seems to happen so regularly when I’ve not heard of it happening or ever had it happen to me!

I hear you, op. I used the trains a lot at one point for work, and would have to actually nearly tug back my wheely bag with my work laptop and paperwork in it. I wasn't letting that go.

I'm older now and don't really notice so much, as if I do get an offer of help it's usually because I actually need it. 😂

I did see a very attractive young woman in short denim shorts and a messy up do hairstyle nearly get trampled by the rush of 'helpful' men trying to put her case in the luggage rack recently though.

I'm 47 and usually look like I've been dragged through a hedge backwards! When it happened the other day I had a nice low cut dress on, but I can't remember how I looked the other times

Really interesting that some pp are saying yes it happens a lot, and others are saying absolutely never seen it in their lives.

It isn't always trains. The one a couple of days ago was a guy at a recording studio. He left with us to open the gate, and as I picked up my violin on the way out he insisted on carrying it, grabbed it off me after I said no twice. This despite me having told him I'd cycled with it on my back for 9 miles to get there and would be doing so to get back! So I dunno how he thought I would manage that if I was to weak to carry it for a few yards.

In cases like that it really can't be helpfulness that drives them. God knows what it is but it isn't that.

Get fat and they won’t even notice you exist?

It's possible I'm being too polite. I tend to smile when I'm nervous or when someone is behaving in a way I don't like. Classic female socialisation I guess. Comes straight from my mother - when I do that smile it feels like my mother is smiling out of my face. She would be embarrassed if I said no firmly. She'd say something like "Oh Nora, don't be funny with him, he's trying to be helpful". So maybe I don't make myself clear. Maybe I need to be myself rather than my mother, if that makes any sense!

What is your physical frame like, OP? Whilst I am not "strapping", I am 5' 8" and fairly broad shouldered. Nobody would care about helping with my violin, if I had one.

Are you perhaps shorter? Some kind of male protection thing, maybe.

The only time I can remember a guy insisting on helping me with my luggage was an old guy in Albania in a run down bed and breakfast place. I said no several times but he took it any way. When I got to my room I thanked him and he stood there. I thanked him.again and he had his hand by his side and wiggling his fingers and doing an odd whistle. It clicked, he was angling for a tip!

@noraheggerty this is a bit bizarre to me and not sure I’m understanding your post correctly. You are saying that men on the street just grab your possessions of your hand after they heard you say no thank you? Is this in the UK? Not once has this happened to me and I am short and a woman and often travelled in central London with prams and kids

I like it because men are stronger. 😊

I’m female and it’s never happened to me. If I really don’t want help (usually I just graciously accept help from anyone - male or female- who offers) I just smile and say ‘that’s so kind but I’m fine’ and they carry on as they were.

if it’s happening repeatedly to you, i think you could possibly try to reflect on what you might be doing to cause this?

Try being assertive WHILST smiling - it’s SO effective. Put a hand on their arm with a winning smile - ‘oh you are SO kind but I’m fine. Thanks again for the offer’. Little squeeze on the arm, turn away. Works a charm.

I'm 5'4" and on the larger end of size 14