Duty sex

[Superlambaanana]

Interesting article in the Irish Times. You need a subscription but it works to use the archiver at archive.ph.

https://www.irishtimes.com/health/your-wellness/2024/08/04/after-years-of-consenting-to-sex-i-didnt-want-i-want-to-take-a-break-from-it-how-do-i-tell-my-husband/?fbclid=IwZXh0bgNhZW0CMTEAAR2OPQDps9jVjvdOiwcIJba87GkBcVah3V49cGfNQVmQXcXKBiDda69YkMMaem0Ttx-PrfCPijpgdwzLhcCw

“consent that is given because of internalised pressure to be nice, to be liked, out of a sense of duty, or a desire to connect in some way, even if we don’t necessarily want that connection to be sexual….

“…the societal and cultural sense of duty that is often placed on women to have sex with men or male partners, noting that men’s sexual desire and pleasure is often prioritised over women’s boundaries in a culture that “grooms women from a young age for a life of sexual and emotional sacrifice”.

No this is a recent belief.

For centuries women were thought to have higher libidos than men.

Men needed to be 'protected' from horny women!

I feel like probs the libido gap would close quite a lot if women got proper menopause treatment, weren't overstressed and tired, and felt their partner was pulling their weight equally.
Stereotypes have some truth but they don't allow for complexity. As has been suggested on this thread and others I've seen, women in some cases may have lost desire for their partner rather than men in general. Is this less of a problem for men? You might think it would make more evolutionary sense for this to happen to men, if it benefits them to have more sexual partners and not stick with one person.
I've been thinking about this recently after reading Bitch: a Revolutionary Guide to Sex, Evolution and the Female Animal. The author gave lots of examples of female birds etc having multiple sex partners as a way of not 'putting all their eggs in one nest.'

Lower libidos? Well I must be odd, then. When I got bored at work (office job) I used to drift off into sexy fantasies and have to disappear into the loo to masturbate or I couldn't concentrate at all 😉.
Also I suppose I do do duty sex, in that DH mostly seems to get turned on by getting me all excited until I orgasm... But then he's still worked up so I feel it's only fair to "do my duty" when all I want is to drift off to sleep!

This, my exH didn't work or do anything round the house or garden and was unpleasant and sullen to boot, then was amazed when I refused sex with him,.
If he'd pulled his weight, had been someone to rely on, washed and brushed his teeth occasionally, behaved like a man instead of a surly teenager and didn't totally ignore me on my birthday and christmas I would have felt more inclined.

I certainly don't have duty sex.
No doubt some women might do but I don't think it's either normal or healthy.

Can you imagine men having duty sex? I don't think so.

Men definitely do, it's not as if it's only men who are ever in the mood, there will be times when the woman initiates and the man goes along with it, even though he's tired or distracted, or just not that horny

...Or already had a wank that day, but wants to make sure wife isn't left hanging

I am interested if any of you took the route that I took. I felt that some of our love-making was becoming duty sex so I asked my partner to stop initiating, and that I would take that role. It improved matters for me for a while, but I found the odd rejection hard to take, especially if I had "dressed for the occasion".

Google tells me it is accepted that women have lower libidos than men. Top result is a survey citing most men wish to have sex every day whereas only 7% of women would want it daily. And it's not just Cosmopolitan type stuff. Quite a few peer reviewed studies too.

But I am not an expert and accept the internet is often full of shit.

And @ElectricLegs I can't imagine why your electric legs would ever be rejected! 😂

This is likely to be due to how bad so many men are at sex.

Yes well this I can definitely get behind.

If they aren't doing it for you give them some gentle guidance.

I had a slow learner.

I have been thinking about this thread for the last few days. I definitely have a bit of duty sex, DH has a higher libido than mine.

But then isn't marriage a series of compromises anyway? DH kindly agreed to go and visit my DPs with me on Sunday, they are very elderly and the drive is an hour each way. He had a ton of other stuff he would have enjoyed doing more and I didn't put any pressure on him to join me, but I appreciated him doing it all the same. TBH having a quick shag is a lot less bother than taking a whole day out to make me happy.

I wonder if the concept of courtly love and great romances has made the act of sex something more than it actually is. Also the fact that we are living longer way past child bearing age and have contraception adds nuances as well.

There is obviously a red line between sex as an act of pleasing your DP and non consensual rape.

I don't often wade into this area, so I hope I am not talking out of turn.

Yes but that doesn't mean these lower libidos are biological.

Hormonal contraception reduces libido because it tricks the female body into thinking it's pregnant. It's even listed as a side effect!

Also 1/4 women take anti depressants- also have lower libido as a side effect.

Then there's all the sociological causes: porn/rape culture, 'duty' sex, history of sex abuse, lack of body confidence due to media images of women, slut shaming, unequal housework, women's chronic lack of sleep, childcare responsibilities.

@rookiemere I think you and a couple of other posters have illustrated that within a strong, loving, reciprocal relationship, duty sex can be absolutely fine. An act of love in fact. It's when the DH takes it for granted, or doesn't reciprocate or is generally selfish or manipulative that it becomes problematic.

This is really interesting to me. I was caught in what was retrospectively a very unpleasant relationship with a narcissist recently and after the discard phase I thought we'd got back together because, well, it seemed like we had. The last time I saw him, he fucked me in a very unrewarding way for about two minutes and then rolled over and went to sleep.

A few days later, when he told me I wasn't his girlfriend again yet because I still wasn't forgiven, I remembered that duty sex and the scales just fell from my eyes. It seems like my vagina has better boundaries than my brain. 😅

I don't think performance can be managed to the same exceptional quality each time, and in relationships I am willing to tolerate the occasional rubbish shag, but I have a high libido and if I'm showing you my vagina without girlfriend benefits, you'd better show your gratitude.

I don't know how much this contributes to the discussion. When I was married I actually ceased all sex with my husband because I never enjoyed it with him.

Germaine Greer said, bad sex is bad for you.

the general understanding seems to be that women’s libido is different from men’s.

i think there has been a push by some feminists to say that women are as horny as men, but the reality seems to be that most men think about sex more and desire sex more than most women

in long term heterosexual relationships men are typically the drivers of sex

"Bad sex is bad for you"

I really agree with this. For me there is a huge difference between other compromises within a marriage and in having sex you don't want in order to please your husband.

Hence the lesbian bed death

men are usually the drivers of sex in a long term relationship

men are usually the drivers of sex in a long term relationship

This is certainly my experience. I'm pretty sure I'd live very happily without sex now if I wasn't married.

Luckily I don't have any of the problems others have mentioned on this thread (he's a good man, I'm not tired all the time, he doesn't whine or sulk when I do refuse him, he does plenty of housework, he treats me nicely, he's good in bed). Duty sex is surely a very different thing if you don't fancy your man any more or he's crap in bed etc.

I think women probs do have lower libidos in general. But just bc patriarchy frames this as a bad thing doesn't mean it is. I think lesbian bed death is a really sexist concept given that they seem to have similar levels of sexual satisfaction to straight women if this article is true -
https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/all-about-sex/202302/debunking-the-myth-of-lesbian-bed-death

Why should having less sex but enjoying the sex you do have be seen as 'death'? It's a bit like how women are seen as weaker by male definitions as they're naturally less muscular, when men could equally be described as weaker in the endurance stakes.

@AliasGrace47 yes the descriptions always use the male position as the starting point and assume any deviation from that is abnormal. Patriarchy! In reality it's men who are the problematic ones with their socially unacceptable sexual desires and demands. The prevalence of paedophilia and violence in men suggests women are the much better place to start for a normal baseline.

It could well be that in general women have a lower libido and in general are happier with less frequent but longer and ‘higher quality’ sex, and in general men desire more frequent sex but don’t need it to be as long

interestingly my wife prefer fast ‘passionate’ sex and i find this less satisfying and would rather it be longer so this is full of exceptions and individual distances.

neither high libido or lower libido is good or bad. The problem is when you get a mismatch of libidos in a relationship. And then how you can them manage with that to try and keep both partners satisfied enough to be happy together

which i suppose means one of the partners having sex when they aren’t really in the mood, but do it out of empathy and kindness, rather than duty or coercion