I'm asking Keir a question about women's rights on 5 live - how to phrase it?

[JanefromLondon1]

I want him not to be able to give me the flannel that we have to be kind to the woMen. I want assurances that we do t have to share our spaces. I want to not sound like the very nervous person that am I!

Any help appreciated?

Yeah the difference between how the 2 males treated the previous caller and Jane was illuminating.

Well done Jane and thank you so much. I'm another voter that Labour has lost with their appalling treatment of women.

Thought the same about the sighing - really brought it home!!

(Obviously you can't say "for fuck's sake" on the radio at that time of day )

Thank you for making up my mind not to vote Labour! You did great!

Going to be blunt.

I have trans friends, i am part of a social community that is heavily Trans/Nb heavy, both FtM and MtF.

I support, love and fight for their rights to exist without discrimination and i dislike intensely the GC view.

however, even i know that bio women deserve the right to bio-women only spaces, in healthcare, therapy/safe spaces and sport.

Most of my trans friends agree ftr. They just want to exist.. its only the assholes who keep trying to push themselves into womens safe spaces, and the vast majority of Trans folk hate them for making their lives harder.

Not even slightly shocked to see this call misrepresented on the Guardian.

www.theguardian.com/politics/live/2024/jun/28/uk-general-election-live-reform-campaigners-filmed-secretly-making-racist-homophobic-slurs

"The next caller, Jane, asks if Starmer will protect spaces for biological women. Saying she is sick of the “absolute twaddle” that he come out of his mouth on this, she says she does not want trans women using women’s toilets or other spaces for women.

Starmer says Labour will protect women’s spaces. But he also says he wants to protect trans women with dignity and respect."

Note to the Graun: THE WORD IS MEN

however, even i know that bio women deserve the right to bio-women only spaces, in healthcare, therapy/safe spaces and sport.

That aligns exactly with GC views, so what is it about GC views you dislike intensely?

Bad news for you Foxxo, what you are describing here are precisely GC views. I’m sad to say that the ‘assholes’ you reference are the ones who suggest GC people don’t support trans rights.

I support, love and fight for their rights to exist without discrimination and i dislike intensely the GC view.

Thank you for your post, and that's great, but what you're espousing, a separation between sex and gender identity, is what most people with the "GC view" espouse. The debate is robust on both sides, not just at the extreme ends.

I don't believe males can ever be women. It's not personal, I just don't see male trans people as anything other than men. I don't want them discriminated against, I just don't want them to be treated like they are actually women, and for women to be forced, bullied or gaslighted into pretending that they think they are. In reality most people know they are not, they just don't think women's feelings or safety are important enough to care about women who want single sex spaces.

because the people i know in RL who claim 'GC' beliefs are actually transphobes, and don't believe my friends have any right to even exist. <shrug>

If you have GC views and don't think that, great!

@Foxxo

How do you think they don't think they "have the right to exist"? Is that actually true, or do they, like me, just think male trans people are men?

Jane you were fantastic! Well done!

Hate to break it to you but you and your friends are on the side of JKR

Where is that “basic level of respect for other humans” given whenever women try to gather and speak?

(Not intending to derail your thread OP, thank you for putting him on the spot, he cannot bring himself to say what a women is. He’s useless).

Thank you Jane, for trying to get a straight answer.
I've just emailed my Labour candidate explaining exactly why she won't be getting my vote.
It's such a shame that there is no other party that will admit that, whilst trans people are as worthy of respect as anyone else, biological women's spaces need to be protected.

Going to listen to this on catchup, but it sounds like you did a far better job than any of the supposed 'professional' journalists in holding Starmer's feet to the fire and not letting his wriggle out of answering the question, Jane. Brava!

I've decided I'm definitely not voting Labour now. I had thought Starmer had been getting splinters up his arse because he didn't want to upset the TRAs but really saw sense. After all, he's not thick. But events of the past couple of weeks have made clear he really believes the woo-woo and will not protect women. So he can fuck right off.

How? Humans can't change sex. So it's a lie.

Can't help but notice that we have two derailers on this thread. Some people really don't like women talking about our rights and holding powerful men to account, and will do anything to disrupt that.

I missed it well done on doing this

What did you ask?

I’d like to hear it, will check out if I can

Go back to the start of this live stream then go forward to about 9.43

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/c2504p02wz3t

Well fucking done Jane @bleughgreen you were magnificent

Oh my god Jane you were amazing

His stupid last job answer

And you said you want to hear about the future not the past

You bloody legend. You made me nearly cry with frustration with you

He didn’t answer you still

He deflected to Sunak again

Ffs

You tried. Thank you I couldn’t do it that well

It’s not about disrupting your ability to discuss @MaidOfAle, it’s about having a different opinion. I’m just asking for a respectful discussion. I didn’t realise that on MN people were only allowed to post in support of the OP and not to express a different opinion.

And @HoneyButterPopcorn, it’s fine for you to have an opinion, and it’s fine for you to have one too. But that is what that is- an opinion, not a fact.

My postal vote is sitting in front of me with a cross in the Labour box. I'm just about to stick in the recycling bin rather than post it.

Fuck off Keir. I don't trust you.

In your self selecting friend group.
They wouldn’t tell you if they didn’t agree with you cos you’d shout at them, anyway.

There are a lot of us who feel strongly about this.

In your self selecting friend group.
They wouldn’t tell you if they didn’t agree with you cos you’d shout at them, anyway.

There are a lot of us who feel strongly about this.

Elle claims to have YouGov poll evidence that most women disagree with us on gender identity issues, but so far she has only posted a link where I can't see where it's leading. I asked for the full link but it doesn't seem to be forthcoming.