Page 6 | Awful victim blaming article - Emma Pattison 😢

Babyboomtastic · 2023-02-09T09:26:19+00:00

I was shocked to see this on the metro website: https://metro.co.uk/2023/02/08/emma-pattison-was-arrested-after-row-with-husband-years-before-death-18249909/ Headline: Epsom College head ‘was arrested after row with husband years before death’ Back in 2016 it seems that the husband phoned the police to say that she'll slapped him around the face, and then phoned back a few minutes later saying not to come as it was trivial. They came anyway, she was arrested, spoken to and then released without charge. It goes on day sat that they were having counselling for marital problems and her job was one of the issues. It comes across as 'poor man with violent workaholic wife snaps' 😡😡😡 IF she did slap him 6-7 years ago, that doesn't excuse murdering her or their child, and saying 'she was violent too, I was only defending myself, shes crazy etc' is textbook behaviour from many abusive men... Urgh

Boomboom22 · 09/02/2023 17:59

It is a part of doing gender, or male Ness. When women abuse they are vilified as they break the norms. When men do I they are excused as she made him do it, nagged etc. Working class dv is more physical, muddle class coercive and financial control which fit into their wider societal norms for each subculture. It is absolutely crazy to suggest female on male dv even scratches the surface of male to female. Even in normal loving relationships men are meant to be in control, earn more etc and society looks down on them if they don't. It's a big risk factor here that she had a higher status job than him, especially if his culture holds men as breadwinners. Someone said he's Jamaican though and depending on where this could be the case or it could be a more matriarchal sub culture.

MGMidget · 09/02/2023 18:31

The circumstances scream domestic abuse to me (by him not her).

MGMidget · 09/02/2023 18:37

However, that past allegation may have made her reluctant to contact the police when she was worried about his behaviour and she rang a relative for help instead. Sadly they didn't make it in time.

PeanutButterSmoothie · 09/02/2023 20:14

I don't think we can really make much judgement with the info we have beyond acknowledging the horrific nature of the final crime.

For sure if she had killed him and it subsequently came out that he'd been violent in the past people on here would be using this as a justification.

AppleKatie · 09/02/2023 22:09

Ffs I’m exhausted by the rush to minimise his horrific actions and turn it round into some kind of ‘yeah but she must be somehow at fault’ or even if she wasn’t so many woman abuse men so….

I don’t give a shite.

The man murdered his wife and his tiny daughter.

And it’s been more than 3 days so some other male fucker has probably done it since it’s just not on the news and by Sunday another woman will be gone too.

Untitledsquatboulder · 09/02/2023 22:37

VioletaDelValle · 09/02/2023 14:19

Because men are biologically dispositioned to be more aggressive than women or children. It isn’t hard.

Ah the old biology argument! Poor men, they just can't help it - it's biology innit.

Except it isn't that easily explained by biology and it just sounds like a cop out if I'm honest.

Ah that feminism - where biology is really important til suddenly it isn't.

Yes men are preprogrammed to be more aggressive than women. That's why they come with bigger muscles and greater strength. All about sex and resource guarding just like every other thing in nature. An explanation not an excuse but if you want to explain whytheworld is why it is and change it, then its where you need to start.

knittingaddict · 10/02/2023 06:58

AppleKatie · 09/02/2023 22:09

Ffs I’m exhausted by the rush to minimise his horrific actions and turn it round into some kind of ‘yeah but she must be somehow at fault’ or even if she wasn’t so many woman abuse men so….

I don’t give a shite.

The man murdered his wife and his tiny daughter.

And it’s been more than 3 days so some other male fucker has probably done it since it’s just not on the news and by Sunday another woman will be gone too.

👏Excellent point, well made.

knittingaddict · 10/02/2023 07:12

Untitledsquatboulder · 09/02/2023 22:37

Ah that feminism - where biology is really important til suddenly it isn't.

Yes men are preprogrammed to be more aggressive than women. That's why they come with bigger muscles and greater strength. All about sex and resource guarding just like every other thing in nature. An explanation not an excuse but if you want to explain whytheworld is why it is and change it, then its where you need to start.

Show quote history

My experience says the opposite of this.

The man I knew wasn't a living breathing testosterone machine. He was a pathetic loser of a man who thought the world owed him something and couldn't cope with the reality of what he really was, so took it out on the people closest to him.

He was also a misogynist who had never met a woman that he didn't despise. Misogyny isn't part of the bigger, stronger manly package, is it? It comes from somewhere else entirely. It also doesn't explain why so many men like this are controlling of their partners. Is that part of being a manly man too?

This man also had a dad who was just like him. Controlling, pathetic little man who bred a hatred of women in his son.

I will also add that my husband and dad don't fit your description of men either. They wouldn't dream of being violent or abusing anyone. Are they not real men?

(Can't believe that I'm reduced to NAMALT over this)

VioletaDelValle · 10/02/2023 07:30

Ah that feminism - where biology is really important til suddenly it isn't.

Yes men are preprogrammed to be more aggressive than women. That's why they come with bigger muscles and greater strength. All about sex and resource guarding just like every other thing in nature. An explanation not an excuse but if you want to explain whytheworld is why it is and change it, then its where you need to start.

No.
Men are preprogrammed to be stronger than women. This is what gives them the advantage against women.

The man that murdered my mum was a product of his upbringing. He mirrored the behaviour of his father and other men in his family. Just like every other abusive men I've encountered.
You're not born a violent misogynist, you learn that.

TeamadIshbel · 10/02/2023 12:18

Motherparent19 · 09/02/2023 13:37

What a strange thing to say! Why should anyone’s job or profession matter in terms of whether they are protected from domestic violence. Some of these assertions are so illogical that they are close to incomprehensible and reprehensible.

Domestic violence is not conditional on size, height, weight, job, whether or not you are or exhibit fear, your gender, your race, age or what you ate for breakfast.

Show quote history

You completely misunderstand my point.
When these murders are reported, some section of the media seem to find it more difficult to believe that it is what it is. A violent, controlling man has more than likely behaved like this for years. BUT it's a middle class family and often is reported as surprising. This is why toxic shit is written about this poor woman, painting her to have been in some way making it worse for herself. That is what the 'victim blaming' in the OP is referring to.
Perhaps you don't understand that. Please don't make ignorant unaware, assumptions.

StarbucksSmarterSister · 10/02/2023 13:34

Sadly quite a lot of people on social media are blaming her. One man said the slap showed she had repeatedly abused him. I challenged it and asked why would that make him kill his child.

The guy called me a piece of s**t and told me to stfu. Nice! Imagine how he must treat his poor wife.

knittingaddict · 10/02/2023 13:49

StarbucksSmarterSister

Sounds like another abusive man clinging to the fantasy that men are victims are women are to blame for everything really.

This is exactly what I was afraid of when I saw the BBC article. It was inevitable, sadly.

StarbucksSmarterSister · 10/02/2023 13:54

Absolutely.

Thelnebriati · 10/02/2023 15:19

The media has rules to follow around the reporting of suicide, so why not domestic violence?

Untitledsquatboulder · 10/02/2023 19:31

VioletaDelValle · 10/02/2023 07:30

Ah that feminism - where biology is really important til suddenly it isn't.

Yes men are preprogrammed to be more aggressive than women. That's why they come with bigger muscles and greater strength. All about sex and resource guarding just like every other thing in nature. An explanation not an excuse but if you want to explain whytheworld is why it is and change it, then its where you need to start.

No.
Men are preprogrammed to be stronger than women. This is what gives them the advantage against women.

The man that murdered my mum was a product of his upbringing. He mirrored the behaviour of his father and other men in his family. Just like every other abusive men I've encountered.
You're not born a violent misogynist, you learn that.

But why are men preprogrammed to be stronger? Why have they ever that way?

I'm sorry to hear what happened to your mother.

Untitledsquatboulder · 10/02/2023 19:32

Why have they evolved...

Baaaaaa · 10/02/2023 21:57

Abusers often claim they are the abused. It's just another form of abuse.

knittingaddict · 11/02/2023 08:42

Does it matter whether men are stronger than women? Obviously it matters in the sense that they can cause more harm, but nobody makes them throw their weight around.

AppleKatie · 11/02/2023 08:48

No it doesn’t matter especially not when they are holding a gun.

Anyone can kill with a gun. It is still overwhelmingly men that do it though.

VioletaDelValle · 11/02/2023 09:20

But why are men preprogrammed to be stronger?

Men evolved to be stronger so they could hunt. Not so they could kill women at will.

Men are not biologically preprogrammed to be violent. Studies that have looked at the effect of testosterone on male violence have found that in some men a confrontation with cause a spike in testosterone which can cause violence but this is typically in men who were already violent and and in a situation where the confrontation was with other men.
I'm some men the spike in testosterone caused them to be more caring and protective.

So biology can go some way to explain same sex aggression. But socialisation still plays a big part.

However the evidence shows that in male to female violence the cause is less about biology and more about socialisation.

Men are not biologically predisposed to kill women. It's a societal issue.

Untitledsquatboulder · 11/02/2023 09:23

No, men are not preprogrammed to kill women but it's not as simple as "hunting". But maybe this is not the thread to carry on this discussion which is after all about a man murdering a woman and child.

NattyNamechanger · 11/02/2023 09:36

Today's DM article implies that he killed her because she was " high flying"

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11737871/Details-emerge-tensions-Epsom-College-head-husband-killed-daughter.html

I have complained to IPSO ( Independent Press Complaints Organisation) and would urge everyone to do this.
She was a successful woman so he killed her and her daughter -it beggars belief that the Mail think that this makes it Ok

NattyNamechanger · 11/02/2023 09:38

Oops there is a missing -standards there

VioletaDelValle · 11/02/2023 09:55

Untitledsquatboulder · 11/02/2023 09:23

No, men are not preprogrammed to kill women but it's not as simple as "hunting". But maybe this is not the thread to carry on this discussion which is after all about a man murdering a woman and child.

No, maybe not.
however mum was killed in very similar circumstances and I find using biology as an excuse deeply offensive. It implies he couldn't help it.

It's as offensive as the media reporting that he killed her because he was jealous of her career.

There is no evidence that men are biologically predisposed to kill women. Blame society not biology.

VioletaDelValle · 11/02/2023 10:45

NattyNamechanger · 11/02/2023 09:36

Today's DM article implies that he killed her because she was " high flying"

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11737871/Details-emerge-tensions-Epsom-College-head-husband-killed-daughter.html

I have complained to IPSO ( Independent Press Complaints Organisation) and would urge everyone to do this.
She was a successful woman so he killed her and her daughter -it beggars belief that the Mail think that this makes it Ok

I've complained too. So has my DH.

Disgusting headline