How to challenge mixed changing at local pool

[SomeOriginalUserName]

I usually lurk & learn but can't find anything with a search, so can anyone help?

My local pool, owned by the council but signed over to Everyone Active to run, has used the Covid19 situation as an excuse to replace single-sex changing with mixed changing areas.

They claim this is to comply with one direction flow requirements - the separate areas are on either side of a central corridor. Entry is now on the left of the corridor, the same side the men's area is on, and this is now a mixed area. The women's area is on the right and, inexplicably, is completely closed off: People exit on that side so no one can use it. Real nonsense.

I've suggested separate times for male & female, or finding another area somewhere else in the large centre for a second change area, but the male manager has completely dismissed me.

I've cited the Equality Act and single-sex provision. Ignored.

I've countered his 'but there are cubicles' argument by explaining that the 2 foot gap at the top and bottom of the changing stalls and shower stalls are nowhere near offering security and privacy, but he's dismissed me. He's made some references to these meeting standards for Swim England and Sport England?!? And when I've referred him to figures on sexual assaults in leisure centres and info on up-skirting and men shoving cameras under gaps to take photos, he's gone on about gaps being necessary to clean!

And he really isn't interested when I point out that failure to provide safe, private single-sex facilities is exactly why women and girls stop doing sport - because we're effectively shut out.

I understand the guidance about coming ready to swim: I had my costume on under my clothes. But I still need a safe, private area away from men to undress, check my tampon, use the loos, and to shower and change afterwards - I'm not going to put my clothes on over a wet costume and get the bus home before being able to wash out the dirt and chemicals of the pool.

And the excuses he's given for not providing this just don't cut it.

They won't put the info about removing single-sex changing on the website tho - afraid of the publicity I suppose - so women are paying and booking swim sessions only to have to turn around and leave when they discover the situation. I'm not the only one whose complained, but I'm not sure what to do next.

I've emailed the local council, since they own the site and Everyone Active has claimed they're okay with the mixed changing.

And I'm going to write to head office to ask why they think they can ignore the Equality Act, dismiss women's concerns and bar them from the pool unless they're willing to compromise their safety.

Anything else I can do?

Everyone Active have form for failing to provide single-sex facilities in other centres they run and I really don't want to see this happening at my local pool.

(GGGrrrr - waiting all year for the pool to re-open and now the hottest summer ever and I can't swim unless I agree to put myself in an unsafe situation. )

Not sure how to help but my local council pool (was fusion, now Better) is only mixed sex changing. Showers on poolside.

I hate it.

It's quite large, I don't see why when they built the pool single sex changing wasn't installed for the pool as it is for the gym and sports hall.

I don't think I've been to a swimming pool in years that has had single sex changing rooms.

Both council pools in Brighton & Hove are mixed with lockable cubicles.

Center Parcs is mixed, again with lockable cubicles.

I also prefer it mixed and means I can keep DS with me (he doesn't have a dad).

At ours there are changing rooms plus cubicles for men, for men with children, for women and for women with children. We are free to shower with others of our own sex and have always felt safe. I have also used mixed sex all comers and walked into the unmarked gents and not comfortable in showers or indeed in inadequate cubicles. This just shouldn’t be happening. I don’t care if some of you feel comfortable. Many do not.

It is not only sexist, but racist. Anti-semitic in fact given the modesty expected of women in certain traditions in Judaism, and Islamophobic.

So consider the EHRC as well, or get local councillors involved as well.

I think there’s a difference between mixed sex changing areas that have been designed as mixed sex, and mixed sex changing areas that were originally single sex changing areas.

The nearest pool to me has a mixed sex changing area that’s been designed that way.
Well lit, lockable cubicles with walls down to the floor and very high so people can’t look over / under the walls. And a few big family cubicles as well.
The only showers are poolside showers so everyone showers in their bathing costumes.

I’ve been fine with using the mixed sex changing area at this pool, but the situation OP describes is very different and much less private.

@newnortherner111

It is not only sexist, but racist. Anti-semitic in fact given the modesty expected of women in certain traditions in Judaism, and Islamophobic.

So consider the EHRC as well, or get local councillors involved as well.

I think you are really clutching at straws here especially if the changing cubicles are locked. It is a swimming pool where people are in swimming costumes, the complete opposite of modest. If the expectations are that high they would be unlikely to be going to a mixed sex swim session.

My local council pool has had to change to mixed sex for a C19 one way system. At the time of booking you're told to arrive with your swimming gear on under your clothes. You enter through one changing room (cubicles and lockers out of bounds, just a toilet available), and take your bag through to the pool where there are distanced chairs set out to leave it on. Exit through the other changing room, where you shower with your costume on (which I do even in single sex womens) and change in the cubicles.

I don't think there would be an appetite to retain this after restrictions ease, as it's clearly more faff. It had been newly refurbished just before the pandemic hit, with single sex changing.

We haven’t had single sex changing in years ..it’s all cubicles and all mixed sex …
They ripped it out when legacy leisure took over a few years ago .
Hate it .

Gaps top and bottom of cubicles
I’m just so great full there is still a ladies loo ,and the toilets aren’t mixed as well.

My local pools are mixed but it's not an issue as they currently only have 8 cubicles (of the 30+) available and the rest are locked by staff to ensure distancing in the changing area... Also we are still encouraged to arrive beach ready and there are no private showers (only the pre pool rince in the corridor ones).

@FierceBarrie

You might also want to raise the issue on this thread.

Although it’s unclear if the OP is ever coming back.

Thanks for the link - it's brilliant and sad. I'll definitely be referencing that if anyone from the council agrees to meet with me.

It's exactly this - I'd been waiting over a year to get back into the pool and I was so happy on my way to the centre, and my stomach fell, heart pounded when I discovered I'd either have to risk a space that made me feel scared, or go back home.

I was sat at home during the heatwave when I woulda coulda shoulda been swimming, all because the needs of women and girls like me were considered disposable in the new Covid world order.

Surely it isn't any more covid-safe anyway, as everyone is using a smaller area than before.

@Beowulfa

My local council pool has had to change to mixed sex for a C19 one way system. At the time of booking you're told to arrive with your swimming gear on under your clothes. You enter through one changing room (cubicles and lockers out of bounds, just a toilet available), and take your bag through to the pool where there are distanced chairs set out to leave it on. Exit through the other changing room, where you shower with your costume on (which I do even in single sex womens) and change in the cubicles.

I don't think there would be an appetite to retain this after restrictions ease, as it's clearly more faff. It had been newly refurbished just before the pandemic hit, with single sex changing.

This sounds very much like the situation here. Maybe that was the agreed approach across councils?

But there was no consultation, no proper impact assessment, and no real risk assessment. Or else someone would have realised that the easiest solution wasn't the best, and that more effort needed to be made.

I get it, its a challenge for everyone. But that doesn't give anyone permission to disregard safety.

Yes, same here, I'm really worried this might be a backdoor thing and they will want to keep mixed changing after. If I got assurances that wasn't going to be the case, I'd still be angry but I'd be more able to swallow the current situation.

Our pools have always been like this, never been any issues as far as I know. Unless you count the complaints of women hogging the hair dryers lol

@SengaMac

Surely it isn't any more covid-safe anyway, as everyone is using a smaller area than before.

No, it didn't look like there was any social distancing going on at all.

They'd limited the numbers of people allowed to book, of course, but everyone arrived at the same time for their session and crammed into a small area.

But at least there was a "one way flow system", right?!

Per other posters, I'm trying to set up a phone call with the council Equality officer.

This is an issue of people being actively discriminated against.

And the council knows it, or else they wouldn't have retained single-sex provision and in the past offered single-sex swim sessions, to cater to peoples personal, religious, needs.

Yes, it might seem contradictory that people are getting ready to go into a swimming pool, in costumes, to swim in a mixed pool.

But a lot of people choose costumes that offer a lot of coverage, there are no dark corners in the pool, no one has a mobile phone to secretly try and film you when you take off your costume, there are lifeguards who can see everything going on...

I don't feel unsafe in a pool. I do feel unsafe in mixed changing areas.

Do those who don't like this never go abroad on holiday? Many swimming pools, beaches etc have people wandering around with no clothes on or changing on the beach or beside a lake etc. It really is only us brits who get hung up about this in Europe.

@80Days

I think there’s a difference between mixed sex changing areas that have been designed as mixed sex, and mixed sex changing areas that were originally single sex changing areas.

The nearest pool to me has a mixed sex changing area that’s been designed that way.
Well lit, lockable cubicles with walls down to the floor and very high so people can’t look over / under the walls. And a few big family cubicles as well.
The only showers are poolside showers so everyone showers in their bathing costumes.

I’ve been fine with using the mixed sex changing area at this pool, but the situation OP describes is very different and much less private.

This is exactly the issue. Designed from the off mixed sex with proper architecture changing rooms are completely different to the ‘just bung a different sign on the door and make very little other changes’ that the OP describes

@helpfulperson

Do those who don't like this never go abroad on holiday? Many swimming pools, beaches etc have people wandering around with no clothes on or changing on the beach or beside a lake etc. It really is only us brits who get hung up about this in Europe.

You're confusing people who 'don't like' ... something (not quite sure what - nudity? beaches? other countries) with people who have concerns over safety and privacy.

Or maybe you're conflating the two to try and be dismissive.

I'm willing to be hung up about women's safety and safeguarding.

I swim in a number of different pools across 3 different local authorities, two authorities have outsourced to external providers, the other is still in house. All have mixed sex changing facilities with some sort of gap at the bottom of the doors.

Women with PTSD from male sexual violence are also covered by the Equality Act if the PTSD is severe enough to meet the definition of a disability, which it often is.

If this is council provision, how are they meeting the public sector equality duty (an additional EA requirement for public sector bodies to proactively consider discrimination issues before people raise it with them due to being excluded) to make services accessible to those disabled women?

We have (mostly) moved beyond people saying stepped-only access to buildings is fine because they can use steps, sod people who need ramps. Lots of the replies on this thread are basically the same principle.

@tornadosequins

Women with PTSD from male sexual violence are also covered by the Equality Act if the PTSD is severe enough to meet the definition of a disability, which it often is.

If this is council provision, how are they meeting the public sector equality duty (an additional EA requirement for public sector bodies to proactively consider discrimination issues before people raise it with them due to being excluded) to make services accessible to those disabled women?

We have (mostly) moved beyond people saying stepped-only access to buildings is fine because they can use steps, sod people who need ramps. Lots of the replies on this thread are basically the same principle.

Thanks - I hadn't consider things in terms of disability - there are lots of really good reasons that single-sex facilities should be available and that should have been considered before this change was made. I'll add this to the list of points to make.

Temporary or not, it is actively excluding and actively discriminating. And, at this stage, I guess I have to focus on making sure it doesn't become a long-term thing.

And, yep, it's a shame that so many people saw the title of the thread - asking for help - and decided to share their I'm-alright-jack stories to make people feel bad for wanting their needs considered.

Where on earth do you all live, I've honestly never come across a mixed sex facility, except as a family/third option?? OP do you have an alternative centre you could use? I would be incredibly uncomfortable with this also, and I'm very grateful that we have a membership to a gym that provides the three option system.

@AledsiPad

Where on earth do you all live, I've honestly never come across a mixed sex facility, except as a family/third option?? OP do you have an alternative centre you could use? I would be incredibly uncomfortable with this also, and I'm very grateful that we have a membership to a gym that provides the three option system.

Right?!

I've been able to use single-sex changing all my life - it's always been an option.

And I checked - even with recent moves towards mixed changes, they are still less than 50%, so the majority are single-sex.

There is another pool but it hasn't been re-opened at all - too difficult with the Covid requirements.

That's the thing - this centre is big and provision could have and should have been made. It just didn't occur to them or they decided it didn't matter that some women would be effectively barred.

And that's certainly the impression the manager gave me.

With restrictions extended for another month and possibly more, I'm looking at private gyms but that's a chunk of cash.