Can anyone give me hope regarding 18 year old dd (will she get better with age and experience?)- massively affected by anxiety and unable to properly engage with life and its challenges

[LimitIsUp]

She has had her issues since year 9 (school refusal etc), more attendance issues at sixth form college, and then bailing out of University almost immediately.

Huge panic attack / meltdown today regarding 'knowing that she is a problem', hating herself and hating life, stating that she will never be able to go to University or hold down more than a minimum wage job' etc etc

She just can't do what her friends do (can't stay over at another friends house, can't talk to strangers, struggles to go into a shop and buy things on her own, can't do most casual jobs because the working environment is huge and scary (said about supermarket jobs, a job at a local theme park etc) - her safe space is very limited

She is medicated (citalopram), and is on her third counsellor (this one is offering CBT)

Might she just get better with age? I know anxiety is a life long condition but will she learn to manage it more effectively as she matures? I just feel that perhaps she is struggling with the transition from child to adult?

Are there any mumsnetters out there who were like this when younger but are now more able to deal with life?

tenredthings I have just seen your post about your son and I am clinging on to that as a lifeline!

It sounds like you are really trying your best and have done some background reading. There is no hard and fast answer with this. Some children do appear to really struggle with the transition into adulthood. It’s more difficult when they turn 18yrs. I would say keep supporting as you have been and provide guidance and advice at times (not over the top). But protect your own mental well-being also. If she picks up on your anxieties or frustrations about the situation it could make her more anxious. The Covid situation has not helped at all I’m sure

@Peachee

I hope this doesn’t sound unkind but do you think she feels the expectations you put on her to live what you deem a normal life? I have suffered from anxiety to the point I couldn’t get out of bed and my mom would have to come shopping with me at the age of 23. The only thing that helped things ease was to take the pressure off and put the breaks on.. at this stage on her life she has plenty of time to find her life long career get a job etc it just sounds like she needs to slowly adjust and needs a break.. too much pressure is put on people to live in a certain way otherwise they are a failure I’m sorry it’s just not the case.

If she wants to stay at home for the next couple of years to calm her nerves and get into a place whereby she feels she can move forward I would support that in every which way I could and help her slowly acclimatise to the basic situations she’s struggling with now.

I hope this isn’t seen as harsh as I’m fully aware the situation I put my mom and dad through was heartbreaking but in the end all I needed was support and a break..

That doesn't seem harsh and yes I suspect she does feel the pressure of my expectations that she should lead a normal life.

Yes absolutely she needs time and space - I have started to realise this. She does need to slowly acclimatise and she needs to steer her own path rather than me (trying to be helpful) butting in and suggesting what she should do next

@LimitIsUp Oh bless her. Covid will have made things so much harder for her. She will get there! That’s fantastic you’re supporting her with motorway lessons. You sound like a lovely mum. I’m sure you will but just in case; it’s worth reminding her that all the best drivers take a couple of attempts to pass . She fully deserves to pass first time as she’s a careful and good driver but things outside our control sometimes happen and lots of people take a couple of attempts. I would say, try to avoid people labelling her as ‘anxious’ or troubled and just give her lots of positive reinforcement like when she was little. You could even tell her that things are tough now - lots of people struggle - but she’s made of tougher stuff than she thinks and she’ll get there. Tell her that one day soon she’ll be driving to work / to her friends solo with the music on and a big smile on her face - she will. And lots of steps like that will build her confidence and independence.

Thank you Mintlegs

Conscious that I’m waxing lyrical about driving like a bit of a loon - but, for me, being able to drive myself meant I had confidence to-
Leave a bf’s house in the night after an argument (he was an arse) with my head held high and go back home
Plan little road trips with friends and not always be the one having to be picked up. I felt I could ‘give back’ to the friendships

• wider choice of jobs
• not having to ask for lifts from parents and feeling like a big baby

I think those things all shaped the next few years and really helped me become independent, move out and start a career, meet my now husband and navigate relationships and friendships with more confidence

@LimitIsUp

It can help contextualise what she is experiencing and starting to strategise to manage - there won’t be medication. But she appears to have lots of sensory issues and have meltdowns when stressed. It present differently in girls and they often have been emotive and imaginative children. They struggle with emotional regulation, but over very emotional.

This is very tricky ! She is addicted even if she says she isn’t and when she says it helps it does only for a while it’s a vicious cycle ! My son was exactly the same he is a successful barber with his own shop so not a typical Stoner .
He has health anxiety ect ect it’s only recently he has realised it’s causing more harm than good and this last week or 2 he has virtually stopped ! He’s found out himself that it will eventually stop him from doing things he wants , hopefully she will come to her own realisation try not to judge or become to involved just be there for her when she’s ready xxx

I agree with the comment about not labelling her as "anxious", as that can become part of someone's identity, particularly if you add a belief that its a lifelong condition! Everyone experiences anxiety, she is struggling with anxiety at the moment but there's no reason at all that this is her destiny for life. The cbt will hopefully help her learn to experience and tolerate anxious feelings, in a paced way, so that she learns not to be afraid of the sensations of fear, nerves, even panic - she can increase her "distress tolerance" and live a perfectly normal life. Be careful not to reinforce any sense of her as a permanently anxious person - it can be self fulfilling unfortunately. She can totally come out the other side of this, but I think some support for you so you can project confidence and a lack of anxiety about her anxiety will help you both.

It's agony though, seeing our loved ones struggling! Good luck

lemoncheesecake20 a friend of my dd who is wise beyond her tender years agrees with you that driving could really help her. Currently dd is the odd one out among her friends - the only one without a driving licence. Having to ask for lifts from us ( we do it willingly but that is not the point) does underline her dependence upon us, and I am so, so hopeful that she passes in six weeks time so that she can start to feel like a fully fledged adult

Also I think that having a clear boundary about the weed would also be good for you both. Even if you say she can't smoke inside the house, so she can in the garden - just so you are clearly and lovingly communicating that this is something that isn't acceptable inside your home and isn't good for her health, but you're not throwing her out or rejecting her. Just make it more uncomfortable for her to use it. Lots of people don't let family members smoke indoors.

Hairobessessed - delighted for you son that he has stopped now, that's fantastic. I am willing dd to come to the same conclusion.

Notagain20 - its a moot point, I do need to be careful not to reinforce the idea of her being a permanently anxious person.

"Gwynfluff" - she does have sensory issues, for sure. Has to have a mattress topper (like the Princess and the Pea), cant tolerate certain fabrics in clothing, has issues with food and hygiene

Definitely proceed with the Lorna Wing assessment, that will give both of you a better base to work from and depending on the results, it will give you both a much better idea of how much support she needs and how to give that support, now and in the future. Their report should highlight her strengths and weaknesses over a wide range of tests, so you get a much better idea of WHY she may struggle with some things and any interventions that would help her.

Parenting someone with ASC it totally different to parenting someone who is NT. Also, most neurodiverse kids tend to be emotionally around two thirds of their chronological age which makes them seem very obviously immature but also makes them very vulnerable. You've already outlined the differences between the things she and her age peers can do in their daily lives.

A tough love approach will not make someone less neurodiverse, it's more likely to intensify their anxiety so their behaviour is much more 'visible'.

Also, counselling, if given for an NT person will not be successful if the person is neurodiverse, she'd need a specialist counsellor with experience of helping people with neurodiversity IF she was able to participate in talk therapy. You've already said she can't talk to strangers and she's on her third counsellor, poor kid it must be hell for her.

One of the courses her current counsellor has done (she is well qualified generally) is 'Adapted Therapies – CBT for Autistic Spectrum Disorders'. Dd is finding her current counselling broadly helpful

We will definitely proceed with the referral - knowledge is power. Not quite the same, but dd was relieved when she got a diagnosis of dyslexia as it explained why she was struggling with certain things. If she does have ASC that too would help her make sense of things. It may be that she doesn't have ASC but we need to definitively rule it out or in

That's great, a really sensible move to discover what her challenges are and what interventions will help her. That matters so much more than the name of the condition(s).

Please don't let her drive stoned, do find out how long it stays in the system and how long it is detectable after smoking or eating so she knows not to jump in the car, it needs the same precautions as driving after taking alcohol.

If she has any co-ordination or concentration or processing issues, she may find driving an automatic is much easier, even if she passes her test in a manual.

She sounds just like my daughter who is 22 tbh. DD was diagnosed with ASC in 2016 and believe me , tough love doesn't work in my experience. We have tried that and have found a very slow, gentle approach works far better. I also think, in our case anyway, that we finally had to accept that our very bright clever daughter is very likely to struggle and need an element of support indefinitely.
Everything you describe , apart from the weed use, is similar to our situation except that DD is older and refuses to learn to drive as it terrifies her. Her issues became pronounced and noticeable at around 13 too..she sort of flew under the radar before that going through primary school etc although she was always quirky and a bit different. She too is on meds for social anxiety .
DD went off to uni but while it seemed to go really well for the first year she struggled socially in second yr and a friendship breakdown hurled her into a spiral of depression which she is still really struggling with. She is very low atm ...is refusing to continue the uni course and it all seems fairly hopeless right now tbh . Things I wish I had done differently looking back ? ....given more thought to her third level options and perhaps encouraged her more to go to a smaller college rather than uni....also wish we had taken a more gentle softly softly approach with a lot of things....railroading her into 'normal things' has really taken a toll on her I think..the efforts with masking and trying to fit in etc are far more than we ever realised. I agree it is a very fine line between enabling too much and gently edging them forwards but we have no choice right now but to go with a very slow softly softly approach. DD too is seeing a counsellor and is also on meds. I just want her now to be happily independant and I don't care what she chooses to do as long as she does something but that's a long way off for us tbh.
I would do things very differently if I could go back to age 17 or 18 with her again.
Good luck OP..it's a tough one for sure
It is very tough and I really sympathise.

When ds went to uni I really wasn't sure if we would ever see him again. He was suicidal and anxious from the age if 11. It's really hard but he had to learn that he could do things and he couldn't do that with us helping him- it just reinforced the idea that he was useless and not like his friends.
At 22 he still isn't the most confident of people, but he has come through uni/ covid/WFH better than I have.
Please take care of yourself, I know what it's like when your child is like this- the focus is all on them, but the strain on you will be enormous.

Also , I totally agree with everything Blanktimes said

I've found the comments above really helpful for situation with own DS, aged 18. Just wanted to add, do bear in mind that alongside 'going off to university' its possible to study with the Open University from home too. 75% of OU students study part-time alongside work, so it doesn't mean that you need to give up other bits of life (like the job) which are working. And of course if you do a year, and then decide you'd like to transfer to a brick university, well then it helps taper the transition, and the modules passed may be counted as credit in the new place.

IMHE I'd be looking as a minimum to give her a deadline about smoking weed in the house.

No drama, just say I am going to stop facilitating your weed smoking after x date, so I won't be allowing you anymore to smoke in the house.

It’s not something I know about so I may be talking crap but a lot of people I know with ASD/ADHD swear by CBD oil for anxiety - is that a possibility for gradually getting away from the actual weed?

Is it safe to drive when you’ve smoked weed?

That sounds incredibly tough and you have had some great replies on this thread. I totally agree that the anxiety label /identity is not at all helpful and could reinforce her experiences.

It's really a good idea to have an ASC assessment as it will help her not to blame herself and find a new and hopefully more helpful and empowered identity. If it isn't ASC then maybe reviewing her anxiety meds could help. As a pp asked, is your dd on the birth control pill? I had a horrendous bout of severe depression and anxiety when I was on the Dianette 30 years ago and it stopped shortly after I stopped taking it.

CBD oil is an excellent suggestion, maybe in combination with replacing the smoking bit with vaping? Hypnotherapy might be also useful but again, please first of all rule in our whether it's ASC.

Good luck with the driving lessons, your dd will find her feet, I'm sure. Please also see someone for yourself.

Is your dd artistic or musical? What are her true interests? Animals? Reading what sort of things does she genuinely relax with and come easy to her?

I did a course once on the teen brain - it is totally different to an adult brain and physically she will find it harder at her age. Her brain will fully mature by 25 though so yes things will get easier.
I am very sold on how sometimes primitive reflexes not going dormant in a child means they are in a permanent flight or fright mode - their senses are heightened and they constantly have adrenaline running through their body. Please google infant or primitive reflexes not going dormant and see if this makes sense for your daughter because she can get them dormant if it does.

OP, can I ask why you want her to have a new job by June? If she is managing to attend her current job, and has an understanding boss who is prepared to accommodate her needs, why wouldn't she just stay there?

My ds is a similar age. Autistic, severe social anxiety. Can't go to uni as we had to stop 1 A level as he had a breakdown. We are now seeing how incredibly tiring people and expectations are for him. Realistically he is only going to be able to work part time for now, and possibly for ever. If he had a reliable job - even a fairly mindless one - with a kindly employer and was learning to drive I would be utterly delighted.

I do agree that the self medicating with weed isn't good. Could you suggest she trying buying and using cannabis oil instead? And YY to autism assessment.

I’m not sure if they’d help given the current lack of diagnosis, but there are charities who help people with special needs find work, like this one in my county:

impact-initiatives.org.uk/services/adults-and-older-people/workability/

Might be worth finding one near you and just giving them a call.