Can you be depressed without the lethargy?

[Arion]

I'm really struggling at the moment, I was referred for counselling as my anxiety was getting worse. At the introductory session, talking things through opened up unresolved depressive episodes x 2. Had 1st proper session last week, anxiety score has gone right down, depression score has gone up. I don't have the feeling of trying to fight my way through mud like previous times. All the sad has been coming out this week, I'm not sleeping, I can't eat, I am holding onto control and functioning by the tips of my fingers, but I feel really clear headed. I usually bottle everything up and cover it with a layer of food, I don't know what to do with all this emotion. I'm scared it's going to break me, I'm scared of spiralling down into the depression of before, I'm scared of being stopped from ending things if it starts to get bad, and having to go through it again.
I have 2 lovely children and they are what are holding me here, I can't let them see me go down, I don't want to hurt them. I can't see what others see in me though. I've comfort ate from primary school, this is my normal, to feel that the world would be better if I wasn't here, to be waiting for everyone to see me how I do, and hate me. This is what I bury, this is what I cover with food. All this is welling up though and I keep feeling so sad. I've tried talking to friends (which I've never done in the past) but I'm hurting them and worrying them by hurting so much.
I'm on a very low dose of Amytriptaline for anxiety, (10mg) but I've just had 2 months supply to see me through the counselling. On Tuesday I was checking how much you would need to OD, I have enough, but all the information says that this is a really easy drug to OD on, and high risk of death, it's kind of a better be certain than a cry for help type.
I feel really clear headed though, I'm researching this and working out the options with about as much emotion as sorting out a meal plan, or a to-do list. I just want this to end, I'm so tired of not living, of burying everything and just existing. I just want to stop.

Some days it moves quite slowly. Like the threads here. But I find even reading the posts helps a lot

Weird mood today, feel really tired, I just want to run away, get on a bus and keep going, or curl up somewhere and just sleep.

Had two days that went well, but every time things go well I seem to want to punish myself. Went out for the day on Saturday with a friend and her family, had a good time but in the evening, really had the urge to cut again. Same yesterday, parents came over, everything went smoothly, kids had a great day, but when they were in bed, really wanted to cut.

I haven't cut for 19 years, but I can see how the blade would look on my arm, against my skin, feel the sharpness and the sting and see how the line of blood would look. I can almost feel the release of the pressure inside and it's so tempting, but I can't. Dh or dcs would see the cuts, it's just one more thing I can't do, have to avoid.

I just seem to keep coming back to the same point, the same feelings. Sometimes it feels inevitable that I'm going to at least try to make this all stop, and I might just as well get the attempt over and done with. I just feel cold and tired. But Dh is away from Wednesday to Friday and if I do anything now it will be a real inconvenience and cause all sorts of problems with childcare. I would just like to stop though. But, I'll just keep going, pack it all down, act normal, if I act hard enough I might even believe it myself.

I think you have to keep up the act a little bit longer... Hopefully you'll fool yourself a little bit too, and you can keep things going x

19 years is a long time. That must be a huge achievement. SH is something I have never done - never even considered - so I don't know if this will sound odd? Recently, knowing someone close who does SH, I think I understand it. Is that patronising, coming from someone who never has? I don't mean it to be. I get how the mental pain is so bad that a physical pain is easier to bear

Anyway, I will not start, and I want no-one to do it. Too risky, too secretive, too dangerous. If you can stop yourself from acting on the impulse now, I would be so glad for you. But if the other pain is worse, I understand things get confusing

Why not try to add 19 days onto your 19 years, then see how you feel? Is that a ridiculously impossible target?

I hope you get some sleep

Thank you. No, not patronising, we can explain depression, and try to get someone to understand what it's like when they've never had it. SH is no different, and probably less of a leap for someone to understand whose already had depression.

I didn't cut, I did manage to sleep, I'm still really tired though. Need to shower and make sandwiches as we're going out to the local National Trust place today. Hopefully a walk around and some fresh air will clear away some cobwebs.

Stupid thing is, because I can function, even when feeling like this, no one really knows where I am in my head. I don't usually let people see this side. I've tried in the last couple of weeks with two close friends who are very understanding, but sometimes, knowing they know and are checking on me feels worse. I've always hidden this, even Dh only knows that I'm sad when he's woken up and I've been crying in the night. He does know all about my childhood, but I did my usual of 'narrating' it not feeling it when I told him. I know I need to talk to my counsellor about this, but it's scary enough when it's going round my head, without feeling what I felt when it happened as I talk to someone.

We educate ourselves as children to accept, diminish, deny the suffering our parents dealt us. Even if they meant no harm but managed to do plenty. Not showing strong emotions in front of people must be a typical way of dealing with hurt. When we do expose our feelings, it never seems to feel right. Years of suppressing them, I guess

I agree, it's more comfortable to tell your 'story' than to engage with the emotions the story has left

That makes sense.

Well, today has been a good day. Good walk round outside, even though it was cool, and there been some rain showers, it's been lovely and bright. Only a small under current of sadness occasionally, which, to be fair is kind of my normal and ignorable. There were loads of bird feeders in the tree near where we parked the car, and it was lovely to watch all the birds feeding. I grew up in a village and we had loads of birds in the back garden, takes me back to good memories.

Really weird mood today, I feel really disconnected and distant, I want to crawl into bed and just hide/sleep. Dh away though for 3 days and dcs off school so I can't. Don't feel like harming or any thoughts of taking an OD, just feel like I really can't be bothered with anything.

Dd has trampolining tonight 6:15-7:15, so I won't get dcs in bed till near 8pm. I think as Dh is away I'll follow shortly after.

I can't do this anymore, I want to drop the dcs with a neighbour, I want to just get away, somewhere quiet and take all the tablets I've got. I want to sleep, I've had enough but I can't, they need me, if I do anything it'll fuck them up more than my parents did with me, I'm awful for even thinking it, I just feel so trapped, my life, my death isn't my own.

The children won't be okay without you so don't think they will

I understand you feel trapped, but you are smart enough to figure a way out of it. Even if you find it hard to follow your own advice, I'm sure you know ending things is not the answer. 'A permanent solution to a temporary problem' as they say

Speak later x

How temporary is the problem if it keeps coming back?

I've been horrible today, they've spent the afternoon in front of the TV and I've hidden upstairs, when I've been with them I've been irritable, they deserve so much better than me. I'm just so scared I'm going to totally fuck them up.

I feel that there's something inherently wrong with me, bad about me, this isn't depression talking, this is my normal, the feelings I don't look at. I used to steal money, to buy sweets to fill the void inside, that started in primary school. My children filled the hollow feeling but I still feel rotten inside, bad in my very core. I used to feel like I could suck any affection from those close to me, bleed people dry and I'd still not fill the hole inside. I can remember writing about that 19 years ago, when I first hit bottom. Now I just feel bad, that I'm going to damage people, or scared that everyone I know will look at me, and see me how I see me, and hate me as much as I hate myself.

I'm an only child, I'm used to doing things by myself, being self reliant. When I started at my dance class I didn't know anyone, I just turned up each week, for over a year. I sat by myself and just danced when I could. I know people know, but that's because they approached me. I look confident, but I'm more comfortable being by myself rather than approaching people. Unless I'm working, then it's my work personna, not me, and I can put other people at ease.

I am so lonely though. I always have been, I've just never really admitted it.

Sorry for the self pity.

Thank you for being here and listening Marchate, it means a lot. Sorry I keep coming back to the same crap.

I'm glad to help. I'm starting to cope with a rubbish childhood too, as you know. It creeps into every day, doesn't it?

You won't repeat your parents' mistakes. You will make your own, we all do! But being aware of things you wouldn't do to a child breaks the chain. There's nothing more inherently wrong with you than there is with anyone. You are a nice person who is struggling to come to terms with the past, while living in the present. It's a struggle. But you won't damage anyone providing you look after yourself

Read some of the links on the stately homes OP, write about your feelings, draw etc. You have the key, somewhere. You will find it

'The Trick is to Keep Breathing' as Janice Galloway wrote

Thank you

Didn't sleep very well, so very tired, but better place mentally this morning.

I'm very confused though. I've been putting all my dark bits down, the self pity, the maudlin crap, the anger, I've been horrible about people who care about me. How can can you read all that and yet say I'm a nice person? How?

Because I don't get the impression you mean harm to other people. The bad feelings are against yourself. Maybe sometimes they spring out at other people but it's yourself you are having trouble with

Maybe I'm wrong. Maybe I am projecting!

When you begin to see the situation other people have imposed on you, intentionally or not, and accept it never has been your fault, you will feel a bit better. Maybe we never feel fantastic about ourselves, but realising you couldn't stop things happening in your childhood is a great healer. Especially if you have always accepted joint responsibility for it

Ok, that makes sense. Thank you

Good day today. Went to the zoo with a friend and her children, DS was high maintenance, pushing boundaries but the weather was lovely and everyone seemed to have a good day. Relaxing, even with the children! Got a Dominos pizza on the way home, think it's the first time for a long while I've actually eaten properly the whole day.

I've read the Stately home thread, I actually read Toxic parents about 20 yrs ago. Not sure if I still have the book, might have to re-buy/re-read if I can't find it. Mum is a lot mellower now, they'll both turn 78 this year. The experiences of others on the Stately Homes thread are awful, I can fully understand the no contact some have. I hold my parents at arms length, they only live 7 miles away but I try to push visits to less than once a fortnight if I can, and I don't really tell them anything meaningful. I don't think they meant to hurt me, I think they did the best they could, that there was a lack of self-awareness, and issues from their upbringing. Both were born in 1938 so lived through the war and rationing, from what my aunt has said (Mum's sister), grandad was a work shy alcoholic, grandma had to keep house and work two jobs to make ends meet, life was a bit of a battle for them.

They are good grandparents and they care for my dcs. It's a different relationship between grandparents and grandchildren and both sides get a lot out of it that is positive. I just struggle sometimes with spending too much time with them, there's so much about me that they don't know, even though mum has mellowed I think she'd still judge actions from my past and struggle with them. That doesn't help with my self worth that I hide so much of me.

I'm counting down to the next counselling session, just a week and half. The two previous have been tough but as everything is flying around so much I almost want to talk about it with the counsellor, see if it takes away some of the power of the thoughts. Maybe give me some more ideas to reduce the impact of my internal monalogue.

Yes, these things pass down the generations. Someone has to break the chain. My parents both had 'odd' upbringings. They certainly avoided passing it all on to us but I fear they replaced some of it with other forms of abusive behaviour. Mine are both dead. They still can't leave me alone!

That sounds like a nice day out. Every good day is a positive step

Hello Arion and Marchate. Not much in the way of advice from me but just joining in with your thread to add my solidarity if that's ok.
Arion - I don't know from a personal perspective what you're living as I don't have those experiences myself. But you write beautifully and with a lot more insight than I suspect you give yourself credit for. Re your thoughts about SH, could you possibly do something else (ice cubes, elastic bands etc) if you're really struggling with the urge?
Also I really urge you to google the term self-compassion. It's increasingly important in therapy and part of what they call the 'third wave' of cognitive behavioural therapy. I think this could be an essential and I mean ESSENTIAL consideration for you as you move forward (and you are moving forward, even if it's not in a linear 'every day is better than the last' way).

You both sound like really lovely individuals who are doing their damndest to cope with shit that was brought to their door through no fault of their own. Don't underestimate your own strength, it shines of the page.

Thank you for joining in, Deri. We were muddling along just the two of us! I don't generally add my own experiences to threads, but I couldn't stop myself here

How are things this morning, Arion?

Hi Deri, morning Marchate. Thank you for your kind words Deri. Both of you have given me things to think about.

I will look up up self compassion. I had more of a look at the links on Stately homes, the Out of the Fog website had a list of twisted thinking, 10 different ways and I think I do all of them.

I can understand where different aspects of my behaviour come from, but it's also frustrating as it hasn't changed anything inside, more of an intellectual excercise? That's why I'm hoping this counsellor might be different as he's making me face the emotions not just the events? But then I worry that I'm pinning too much onto him?

Today I'm feeling calm, which is good. I'm knackered, but that's normal, I don't know if it's the tablets, the not sleeping properly or all the thoughts. It's probably a mixture of all three, but nothing a couple of cups of coffee won't help.

Thank you Marchate for sharing your experiences, I really appreciate it, and the time you've taken with me.

Here's something I read today

medium.com/thinking-about-psychotherapy/how-do-you-feel-about-your-therapist-210979ce66c7#.zcspwynso

Interesting article, there's lots on there to keep me busy. Benn into town with Dcs today, good day, a normal day. I'm really liking normal at the moment.

Have bought a journal that's got blank and lined pages in. There's loads on the links for me to work through. I want to note the ones that resonate with me as I'm sure that will change over time.

I suppose it would be cheating to print this thread off and give to my counsellor at the next session?

Maybe you could print it out anyway, and if you decided only to use it for reference during the session, that would be okay too