I have been sectioned.

[lazyhazydaisy]

I have just got access to the internet. I am much less petrified than I was at first but definitely 0 out of ten. I have a tribunal and if that fails I think I will be here until July. I feel as though I am living in a nightmare. I have never felt so alone.

Well, you have phoned MIND, Daisy, which is real-life help and was a bloody sensible move on your part :) Hope you're going to follow up with them and make an appointment with the CAB as well.

MNHQ have received lots of concerned mail about you! It must have been a lot, or OliviaL wouldn't have posted. That's loads of people all over the internet, being bothered about how you are. It's making me feel all warm and fluffy so I hope it's doing you some good, too.

Reading last night's posts, I'm a tad confused about why you went out of your way to fake delusions in Alcatraz. As you exhibited symptoms of psychosis, it's not that surprising they diagnosed you as psychotic. I realise experiments consistently show that mental institutions diagnose patients who are well but, to be honest, a medical hospital would diagnose a patient who presented with well-researched fake physical symptoms, too. Rosenhan's actors were told to be themselves after admission, weren't they? You may have complicated your case by doing this, depending on what your lawyers say of course.

Back to this present moment - a summer weekend with decent weather, for goodness sake, this can't be right??! I've put my "automatic pilot" on hold for a bit, to write to you. Weather's helping me feel slightly more positive about my Jobs To Do (I've got a roof to fix, as well, though not as bad as yours) and am also going to make some phone calls I've been putting off. Hope you're also feeling like Mrs Duzzit this weekend; catch you up on Monday :)

Shakey and Mooncup, thanks for your good wishes, they meant a lot.

Cross-posted. Have you eaten? EAT!
That's an order.

psychiatrists being rarely seen and having little patient contact.

[[?Staff and patients are strictly segregated. Staff have their own living space, including their dining facilities, bathrooms, and assembly places. The glassed quarters that contain the professional staff, which the pseudopatients came to call ?the cage,? sit out on every dayroom. The staff emerge primarily for care-taking purposes ? to give medication, to conduct therapy or group meeting, to instruct or reprimand a patient. Otherwise, staff keep to themselves, almost as if the disorder that afflicts their charges is somehow catching.?

This description bears resemblance to modern UK psychiatric wards. Psychiatrists spend little time with the patients in their care and nurses are occupied for a great deal of their time sitting in a locked room doing paperwork. The healthcare staff members with the most patient contact are the least qualified. This is far from ideal, and a target for improvement, but it should be noted that within healthcare this distance between staff and patients is not restricted to psychiatric wards and the pressures on staff due to the number of patients in their care means that a more desirable personal service is something with which the NHS struggles in all its domains.

Rosenhan?s description of the depersonalising effect of a long stay on the wards is also powerful. Despite their commitment to the experiment in which they are taking part, their wish to resist the powerlessness they experience leads several of them to jeopardise the study.

?The patient is deprived of many of his legal rights by dint of his psychiatric commitment. He is shorn of credibility by virtue of his psychiatric label. His freedom of movement is restricted. He cannot initiate contact with the staff, but may only respond to such overtures as they make. Personal privacy is minimal. Patient quarters and possessions can be entered and examined by any staff member, for whatever reason. His personal history and anguish is available to any staff member (often including the ?grey lady? and ?candy striper? volunteer) who chooses to read his folder, regardless of their therapeutic relationship to him. His personal hygiene and waste evacuation are often monitored.]]

This is a pretty good description of what goes on in those places. I was terrified of being institutionalised. I refused to take any 'privigedges', eg allowed to go for a cigarette unattended, allowed to go into the town for 4 hours, because I took the view that if I accepted any privileges I would be giving them the power to take them away.

"Despite their commitment to the experiment in which they are taking part, their wish to resist the powerlessness they experience leads several of them to jeopardise the study."

... Ah. Could this be what drove you to fake the symptoms?

YY - I complained about a nurse coming into my bathroom to watch me on the loo. I was told the staff had to have free access to patients any time, so I went slightly ballistic about the part of the rules which talked about respecting patients' dignity. Despite being told to hover near the bathroom (I agreed to leave the door ajar ), she kept coming in so, whenever she was on ward duty, I went down to the visitors' toilets for my morning evacuations.

Some of the staff are definitely weirder than some of the patients.

Rosenhan concludes:

?It is clear that we cannot distinguish the sane from the insane in psychiatric hospitals. The hospital itself imposes a special environment in which the meaning of behavior can easily be misunderstood. The consequences to patients hospitalized in such an environment ? the powerlessness, depersonalization, segregation, mortification, and self-labeling ? seem undoubtedly

It is a life sentence. Edam put it very well near the top of the thread. Having been dragged down 2 flights of stairs and dragged, barefoot into a waiting policevan in full view of the whole village is a sufficiently terrorising experience that it would be unnatural not to display extreme distress, which was immediately diagnosed as paranoid schizophrenia, paranoid personality disorder, and the other two which are on the first page. From then on I was labelled as more mad, as far as I can see, than the Norwegian who shot 74 schoolchildren.

And yet, because they thought that I was taking dangerous amounts of drugs, I am apparently 'better', and qualified to no support at all.

And, (and this is the really clever bit, the life sentence,) if I complain I will be diagnosed as suffering a 'relapse' (a referential failure, since I was never ill) or an 'episode'.

It should be of no surprise to anyone that inmates frequently commit suicide soon after release. (Probably with people with less paperwork to do than me), or turn to drink or drugs. There is no other career option. Any means to block out the inhumanity and fear will do. I don't have any drug contacts but I have seriously considered taking heroin. (But only if I could smoke it - terrified of needles.

I wonder how many times I have used the word terrified in this thread.

Daisy, in terms of RL help, have you contacted your MP? If not, would you permit someone to do so on your behalf? Your MP should be in a position to find you some help.

I'll finish the Princess Diana story later. I had been in for over 2 months when I decided to conduct my own Rosenham experiment by agreeing with ALL of their symptoms and give them a large dose of 'insight' if that was got the Rosenham psuedo-patients out.

It is proof of the brainwashed stupidity of the staff that they took me seriously and wrote it all in my notes. That was the only 'Ward Meeting' that my personal nurse (the one who wants to go to the pub with me) attended, and I kept avoiding questions about the yellow chair, Ascension Island logistics etc to ask her why she was wearing heels. As a reference to my shrinking her. She told me afterwards that the psychiatrist was very concerned about her and she had to explain that that whole session was a masterclass in sarcasm.

I have contacted my MP, but that was mainly about getting the house repaired. Also Andrew Landsley and the CEO of the Trust. I have written anonymously to the MP of the town that the hospital is in and he has agreed to look into various issues. He also appreciates my need for anonymity. He is going to find out how many inmates are brought in by police and (I think) how many inmates return, year after year. It really is a life sentence.

MIND were great but not really rl support. But I am/would be delighted if they read this thread.

No matter what I do I will be accused of having a mental illness, or paranoia or something, so I don't really see any way out. Hence my decision to end my life. It is a life sentence and I don't want mine to be long.

the psychiatrist was very concerned about her and she had to explain that that whole session was a masterclass in sarcasm.

Afternoon Daisee...You sound perfectly sane to me. Disturbed by the experience, yes, but that is to be expected and a natural reaction to what you went through. Maybe look into the stigma attached to mental illness? You are still you. You were sane before this, you were sane in the hospital, you are sane now. Its society's reaction you are worried about? And naturally fear being taken again.

Contact your MP again? Who is your MP...can we start contacting him/or her on your behalf to get you the help you need, with the house, with getting your life back, your reputation back, you were taken under false representation (is that taking it too far?) from your partner and parents you had not seen for 5 years (what would they know about your current mental health?) and a dr who has seen you twice...its all wrong!! From the word go it was all wrong, you should be asking nay demanding compensation for distress, your house, your future wages and apologies from GP, ex partner, your parents, the police, the hospital...hmm...long list there.

Would you like a Mumsnet campaign?

Anyway, how is that washing machine?

Maybe open a upstairs window or two if its sunny where you are...let some fresh air in...hope your planning your tea...you need strength to fight back. Ever tried Yoga? Or just some stretches?

Anyway tea time here, looking forward to your washing machine update...just been inspired to degunk the soap drawer...lovely.

xx

Garlic I did get some stuff done today. I have tons of document folders and I am trailing around the house, picking up bits of paper and putting them in the right folders in the garden table that is now taking up my sitting room.

I found this letter from my legal team (grandiose, but I just like saying it) to the idiot who forced me to take mind altering drugs.

Dear Dr Clot

Daisee

I represent the above named and looked after Daisee in relation to her appeal against detention when she was detained under Section 2 of the Mental Health Act. I saw Daisee this week and had a long conversation with her about her on-going detention. (NB: The lawyer did not know that I was not taking any drugs; I thought that it would put him in an awkward situation). She remains resolute in her opinion that her on-going detention in hospital is unnecessary and, as you are no doubt aware, is reluctant (RELUCTANT? BRING ON THE MARGARINE TUBS FILLED WITH RICE!) to engage in occupational therapy or, indeed any therapeutic work (jigsaws? colouring in?) which would, in her mind, impliedly vindicate the position of her clinical team.

Daisee is reluctant to appeal against her detention in Alcatraz as, in my view, I am sure that she wouldn't mind me suggesting this, she is fearful that having her detention upheld woud, again, be a vindication of the position taken by her clinical team and would undermine her view that her detention, from the outset, has been an inappropriate reaction to her presentation.

(In fact I cancelled 3 tribunals until I had all of my medical notes and was not going to risk it until I had these facts. If the tribunal had failed, which it probably would have done, due to my utter undisguised contempt for the entire fiasco, I would have been one more tribunal by Christmas 2012 and then one annually for the rest of my life. At least in prison you have a release date).

Whilst I very rarely feel that it is appropriate for me to make any comment about the clinical condition which has been taken by a patient's treating team ('treating is a euphemism for inforced drug taking; care is watching a patient do a poo) to maintain their detention, the appropriate mechanism clearly being to afford a patient the opportunity to appeal against their detention through the legitimate tribunal process, in this case I feel it is incumbent on me to raise some concerns on behalf of Daisee as to her continued detention in Alcatraz.

Having reviewed Daisee's nursing notes, having been involved in her case since her initial admission over 3 months ago and having visited her on a number of occasions (when he assured me that he thought there was nothing wrong with me at all, it seems that Daisee has made little in so far as true progress is concerned on the ward and her presentation seems very similar to that which I noted when I first met her. Daisee remains lucid, erudite and articulate and her underlying perception as to the benefit or otherwise of hospital inpatient treatment (DRUGS!) is unchanged.

Although I, of course, must accept that I may be wholly inaccurate in my perception of the present position, might I suggest that this is a case in which the therapeutic benefits (!!!!) of inpatient treatment (DRUGS) could be argued to have diminished to the point where Daisee's ongoing detention is disproportionate to either the risks that she presents or the benefits to be gained by a longer period of hospitalisation?

Again, forgive what I perceive to be an

...unorthodox approach and accept my apologies if you are of the view that I am straying into clinical territory. It is simplly my opinion that it is appropriate that I present my personal views to you given Daisee's position in relation to any tribunal application.

Yrs, etc

My lovely lawyer, partner in a specialist mental health law firm and his equally lovely partner from the same firm.

Any thoughts? I told you the lawyers were behind me from day one

He also went to talk to the nursing staff and they agreed that I should not be there, that they had no idea what to do with me and would discharge me tomorrow if they had ever had a chance to talk to Dr Clot.

I can't find the answer from Dr Clot but I have emailed lawyer requesting a copy.

Whilst I agree wholeheartedly that there should be no stigma attached to mental illness, although there is, I have absolutely sod all interest in that campaign because I have never been mentally ill. That was the problem; if I was, then there wouldn't been four months of hell. I hope that does not come across as harsh but mental illness has nothing to do with me at all.

I am very interested in how many vulnerable people are brutally attacked and traumatised by the police, especially as there are at least three methods of restraining people without harming them. I got the distinct impression in my case that those bastards were auditioning for a Bruce Willis film (or whatever). It was worse than bullying, it was physically damaging bullying and it was done with pleasure.

I am not still me. I managed to stay sane in Alcatraz but have been on the floor and suicidal ever since, and I am told I am well so that I don't need or qualify for help. There is no chance of me geting my life or my reputation back. The medical notes are riddled with inaccuracies and no one will do anything about it.

Can't face eating but doesn't matter cos can't face living either.

There were people in there contacting the European Court of Human Rights in desperation. I was considering Amnesty International but by that point I had put on a string of pearls and was released from section immediately.

(And took 30mg of valium which I had hidden, in order to appear calm and not 'labile in speech', 'blunt in affect' or suffering from 'thought disorder'. And this clot was one of the twunts that sectioned me in the first place.)

You do realise that suicidal intent IS a symptom of mental illness. Everything about the way you're currently living is disordered (chaotic).

This is what I meant earlier on, the mistreatment you've received under the guise of mental health treatment has actually caused you to become mentally ill.

It's like Poppy Shakespeare - not quite so bad, as the film character ended up catatonic in a bare cell. But, coupled with the fact that you seem to have been discharged for 'sanely' wearing a twinset & pearls, as N was for wearing Poppy's clothes & makeup, the institutional lunacy and its consequences look remarkably similar.

I am sure your lawyers are considering these facts. I imagine you should be in line for huge compensation. However, to get that you'll need to be alive and, preferably, not in intensive care. Eating will be a good start. Congrats on getting your filing together, you're doing better than me so far!

Yes. Of course I do. This is how the system works. They devastate your life to the point that there is no future and then you are part of the 'revolving door/magic roundabout endless life sentence of hell. I know all of their phrases and their tick box system. I was allowed to take out one book a week from the doctors' library. When I told them that I would rather chop of my leg if I could return to the day before I was assaulted they put it down as 'suicide idealisation'. But I wouldn't be on the floor if I hadn't gone through that hell.

They put me on the floor of utter hopelessness and now - BINGO! - I am suicidal, traumatised and hopeless. Before that I had been wrapping Christmas bloody presents.

Enjoy looking at the amount you pay to destroying lives in this expensive manner. I asked the lawyer how much the legal aid was costing and he laughed and said we were already into tens of thousands.

OK. So if you're going to see any benefit from these tens of thousands, and publicise the issue for the sake of future victims, you've got to eat. Anything will do, as long as it's food. You can top yourself once your case has been argued - before then, it's all a waste of your tremendous effort. You need to get it all published, too, as you're doing now.

All of the 6 survivors (a term I use loosely) that I am still in touch with are desperate to move house as soon as possible. It is not possible to live in a home after the police hooligans have had their fun (presumably one of the perks of the job, like the policeman who knocked over Ian Tomlinson for fun). The unnecessary brutality and humiliation alone is enough to drive anyone over the edge. Imagine it happened to you. I imagine it would come as something of a surprise. It certainly did to me.

Is there an alzheimer's thread? I don't want to cherry pick but the fact that the coroner was so scandalised when it has happened to so many 'dribblers' that I met in that hellhole leads me to suspect that it is not uncommon.

Vicar Why didn't they send around a policewoman to make me a cup of tea and try and to explain the situation? No wonder so many policewomen want to leave.

(Don't want to offend Vicar or Shiney but would appreciate how this can be allowed to happen, especially if it happens to someone who is genuinely mentally ill).

Incidentally, I never had a suicide plan before I came out of hospital and realised my life was now on a precipitous decline! Funny how that works, eh

Why should I not have the right to commit suicide? It's my body. I had no rights at all over my own body for 4 months (section 3 means no right to refuse arse cocktail pindown scenario) so I intend to excercise rights over my own body when I have finished my paperwork.

If you are seriously having suicidal thoughts it is very likely that you do have a mental health problem . From reading your posts I think it is quite clear that you do , they are disturbing to say the least .

I have stayed in a mental health hospital , as a patient ( not an inmate ) and the only thing I recognise from your posts is the insistence that you are completely well.

Precisely because I suspect you are quite unwell I am treading carefully and not wishing to offend. I thing any stigma from mental illness is usually less of an issue than you are dreading . I have been very open about my time in hospital and my ongoing struggles and have never had any problems with getting a job, a promotion or making healthy relationships with people .

I have known many people who have needed in patient treatment and only those with severe mental illness have come out planning suicide or locking themselves away.

As others have said you need to get specialist help , this obsession with writing a book, getting justice or outing the system is making you mentally ill even if you were perfectly fine in the first place.

I do hope you get the help that you need and you can start looking forward.