Blood sugar diet and fast800 thread 16

[thenewaveragebear1983]

Here’s the new thread for the BSD followers, plus those following the Fast800 plan. Everyone is welcome to join us. Here’s a quick recap!

The BSD/fast 800 is a low carb, Mediterranean style way of eating, with the primary aim of stabilising your insulin response when you eat. You achieve this by: eating fewer carbs, cutting out sugar and sweet tasting foods including most fruit, and by following a low calorie plan that reduces your visceral fat meaning that everything functions more effectively. Less insulin means less fat storage (in a nutshell, although more info can be found on this online). The diet was designed to reduce T2 diabetes symptoms (or even reverse it entirely) but can also be used for weightloss.

Eat:
Meats and fish
Oils
Eggs
Full fat dairy products
Nuts, seeds
Pulses/ beans
Veg that grows above ground
Limit fruit: apples, pears, berries- in moderation, with meals, with fats

Occasional alcoholic drinks allowed (spirits, red wine are preferable to beer, lager, etc)
Tea and coffee, herbal tea etc.
And water- drink lots of water!

Avoid
sugar, sweets, and ‘naturally occurring sugars’ such as fructose, maltose, honey, agave, puréed dates etc....

Potatoes of any variety
Pasta
Rice
Breakfast cereals (occasional steel cut oats are ok)
Breads/ flour based products

Exercise:
Michael Moseley recommends HIIT workouts to increase calorie burn and help to tone up, and recommends walking more (increasing your steps weekly until you hit around 10000 a day)

Mindfulness
MM also suggests a programme of mindfulness, meditation, practised for a few minutes each day.

How to follow the plan:
Fast800: follow the plan above, sticking to 800 calories every day for 2 weeks. Ideal to give your weightloss a real kick start, plus improve your insulin function and reduce your sugar cravings.
8 weeks BSD- 8 weeks, follow the guidelines above- 800 calories a day. You don’t need to count carbs grams because the diet is naturally self limiting.
BSD 5:2- for a more leisurely weightloss journey, or as maintenance, or once you’ve done an 8 week stint or 2 weeks of Fast800, you can play around with a combination of increased calorie count, ‘free eating’ and fasting days (800 cals) until you achieve your goals. Many of our long standing members now follow this approach.

You can stop 800 calorie days at any time once you achieve your goal. It’s advised to limit yourself to 12 weeks maximum at 800 calorie days, but you should get excellent results in 8 weeks. Depending on your weightloss goals, you can do further ‘rounds’ of either the 8 week BSD or the Fast800.

Some useful links

Meal planning ideas thread
Blood sugar diet recipe thread and menu planner meal planning thread

<a class="break-all" href="http://go.mumsnet.com/?xs=1&id=470X1554755&url=healthyeater.com/important-tool-weight-loss" target="_blank">TDEE calculator to calculate your daily calorie requirement

<a class="break-all" href="http://go.mumsnet.com/?xs=1&id=470X1554755&url=caliberstrong.com/how-whooshes-impact-your-weight-loss/" target="_blank">information about the ‘whoosh’ phenomenon

I had terrible insomnia last night. Just felt wide awake for hours on end. At 2am I got back up and ate a chunk of halloumi and then I finally fell asleep. I have a lot of complex work to do on a tight deadline and can’t afford to lose sleep right now so despite the amazing weight loss, I’m going to increase calories and carbs a little bit and then decrease again more slowly I think, or just accept slower weight loss in exchange for sleep!

And Kimlek I have no idea about macros and I don’t track them but I think fat is supposed to be a much higher proportion than 15% of your intake? And definitely should be higher than carb intake, I think.

@Kimlek I also don't really track macros, but I do tend to look over retrospectively after a good day and they tend to be much more highly weighted in fat, and fewer carbs. I'm finding this very difficult now I'm not eating so much meat and dairy- are you vegetarian? I would try to eat more fat than you currently are, it feels odd at first and takes some planning especially if (like me) you've always been told low fat is the way to lose weight. If you eat meat it's easier because the skin and fat of meat obviously helps boost your fat intake; veggie sources include nuts, peanut butter, butter (eg on veg), avocado etc.

@CaptainBrickbeard insomnia is awful isn't it. You have my sympathy as a long term sufferer. It is common on this plan while you adjust, and it's also a sign that your metabolism is cranking up from the fasting. If you allow yourself some extra calories at bedtime (eg your halloumi last night) if you try and keep it to fat/protein that shouldn't affect your weightloss too much.,

captain sleep is essential so a few extra calories is definitely worth it! A lack of sleep will effect insulin resistance and if you’re stressed with the deadline then that could too.
I’ve been trying to research the macros and the general consensus seems to be max 50g carbs; proteins should match goal weight (g for kg) so in my case goal is 70kg so 70g protein daily & the rest good fats. The basic version of MFP let’s me add macro goals so I’m going to try these and see if it makes any difference. I’m sure the main thing is the grams of carbs.

Thanks bear no I’m a carnivore!! Albeit given Mosley saying fish 3x a week and my effort to do at least one veggie meal a week I’m eating less meat than I usually would. But definitely more legumes. Let’s see how my new parameters work.

Mmmm... my menu plan this week has only 2 meat meals out of 14!

@Kimlek the 50g carbs is an arbitrary figure that, as far as I know is just a 'low carb high fat' tradition. I suppose because it's a manageable number (ie you can eat a fair bit of veg, occasional apples, porridge and a bit of dairy) but isn't excessively high. But it's a figure you can play around with. HFLC traditionally isn't calorie counted at all and is appetite led, so a 50g limit could be 50g out of 1800 total calories. Because our calorie count is low, 50g is quite a high percentage of our total cals if you do 800 every day. If you increase your calories either by choice or just because life happens, but stick to 50g carbs, the percentage of carbs you eat will decrease. Therefore, play around with it and find what works for you.

Be mindful also of fibre- UK labels have fibre grams already deducted from carb counts, but some American tracker apps deduct them again giving you a skewed 'net carbs' total. Some trackers where people can add foods themselves have incorrect figures for this reason. The more fibre you eat within your carbs, the slower the reaction on your blood sugars- so even though one day you might have 30g carbs (as sugar) it might do more damage than a day where you have 60g carbs (but lots of fibrous food).

Well weighed in this morning & down 6lbs since the 2nd! God I love this plan! Wondering if I'm going to get stuck on the same plateau as before though...

For those struggling to lose, how much water are you drinking? I usually need around 3L minimum when doing Fast800. And way more salt than before too!

Also came on yesterday & can feel the cravings but trying to be good. Definitely think that sparkling water helps me feel more full!

bear mmm that makes sense. I’ve definitely not been eating enough fat so mire lovely nuts for me!!
pheonix I think you’re right & my water intake is way too low.

Please forgive a newbie question: I'm making door for the week (I'm starting this tomorrow - first day back to school). I'm making a batch of soups (I did toy with the idea of following a menu plan from the book but I'd rather batch cook in advance) following recipes from the book. I was planning to make a cauliflower curry but there isn't one in the book - if I use MFP I can track the calories but is there a carb limit I should be aiming for? I can adjust the ingredients accordingly.

Thanks!

@didireallysaythat it's less to do with carb limits, and more to do with avoiding certain foods. If you stick to around 800 calories and also avoid those key foods which spike your booodsugar then it's almost impossible to eat too many carbs. Once you start increasing calorie counts then it can be helpful to keep an eye on the amount of carbs ( but as kimlek and I have been discussing today, more as a percentage of total consumption rather than a set number of grams?) I use my own recipes too, and find batch cooking particularly difficult to quantify- but so long as you don't use eg. Potatoes, flour, bread, rice, fruit, pasta, added sugar etc then your recipes should be fine. Your cauliflower curry sounds lovely! I love baked cauliflower with tikka masala sauce!

@Kimlek enjoy the nuts!

I've been batch cooking myself today: a veggie chilli with peppers, a veggie cottage pie with celeriac and cauliflower mash, and a meat version of each too- I actually feel really good going into January this year! I'm up to date with work due to a few really good planning sessions, I'm organised at home (kids rooms tidy, homework done, school uniform sorted out), I'm prepped for food, I've planned my workouts (signed up for a 6 week beginners boxing course?! Very unlike me!)

Man, I am totally winning at life right now

@thenewaveragebear1983 fantastic - thank you. I can post the recipe (I think there's a thread for recipes somewhere?).

I've made mushroom soup, a lentil veggie thing, and I'm about to make baked salmon and egg with no chives as my herb patch is a little miserable this time of year. I'm a little concerned that I'm going to find this hard but a soup and a large handful of greens should help a lot.

Two more questions and then I'll leave you in peace to enjoy your Sunday afternoons.

I've seen soup and stew recipes with parsnips (not my favourite) but not carrots - are carrots too sugary compared to parsnips?

And runner beans can be eaten without counting calories - I don't suppose you can replace with French beans? I didn't grow a lot of beans this year but I've got some frozen French beans.....

@didireallysaythat I've always used the school of thought that anything green was ok. Re: parsnips/carrots - I think die hard low carbers would avoid both, but I'd have thought parsnips were more carby than carrots?! I eat both, fwiw. I think in the BSD original Book he refers to 'veg grown above ground' which would rule out both carrots and parsnips so somewhere along the line he must have changed his stance on that

I am slinking in shamefacedly having been dreadful for about four weeks. I am heavier than ever before!!

I am starting tomorrow. Have the new recipe book and have planned the week. Going for as close as possible to 800 each day by having two of the recipes per day plus milk in coffee/tea.

Also batch-cooking today - several portions of cauliflower-broccoli soup in the freezer, and a big turkey and bean shepherds pie with celeriac and turnip mash in the fridge for meals for the week.

Sounds like we are all set for an excellent week!

Peachy welcome back. You will be back on track in no time.

Seems like I’m the only one not batch cooking today, but I do have the baby’s nap time to prep food each day so do that instead. @didireallysaythat I made a curried parsnip soup in the week and it came out quite carby on mfp. I’m still having it but will just keep other meals very low carb in comparison.

I had the feta and lentil salad from the book for lunch which was good. DH suggested to add beetroots next time which I think will be nice but prob a bit carby compared to cucumber!

Day 5 for me today and 3.2kg/7lb loss already. My mum was waving cake in my face this afternoon. She doesn’t really understand that I’m not going to be flexible on this diet, at least not in the first few weeks. If I cave on day 5 I don’t think I’m going to make it very far!

After a terrible night’s sleep last night and total mental fog today, I gave in. I haven’t calorie counted but have gone way over 800. All food from the BSD cook book, just about three times more of it than I should have had! With the exception of two dark chocolate peppermints I had left over from Christmas .

The weakness and heaviness in my limbs all day has been unreal so in addition to eating way over the 800 calories I also have barely moved. I haven’t even made it to 3,400 steps.

On the plus side, I’ve had loads and loads of water. I haven’t had any headaches so am fairly sure I’ve stayed quite well hydrated.

I know MM suggests that intermittent dieting can be effective. I didn’t intend to balls up as early as Day 4 but I absolutely could not stand up to the effects of the insomnia. I’m going to get back on it tomorrow - no way am I giving up - but I might need to ease myself in a bit more gently! I can’t afford carb flu or bad sleep this week!

Hi all.
I started fast800 on the 2nd jan.
First three days felt really tired but day 4 today and feeling much better.
I feel a bit like my head is so full of Various diets rules (yo-yo my whole life) that I can’t keep track of what’s the right thing to eat or not. Im generally familiar with low carb but things I’m not sure on are whether I can still have (calorie counted) skimmed milk in my coffee?
Does anyone have a quick look guide to yes and no foods?
I do have the book somewhere but it’s been absorbed by the post Christmas house carnage 🤦‍♀️

Ps I started at 13st 4, 5ft 3 (so bmi 33. Something)
Initial goal 11st 4, loss of 2 stone.

@Doubleyouexwhyandzed the opening post of this thread has a brief rundown. You can have milk in your coffee (doesn't have to be skimmed, in fact full fat or cream can be better in many ways as it boosts your fat intake)

saythat I think one carrot is about 2g of carbs so I wouldn’t get too worried. I’d highly recommend My Fitness Pal app as you can make recipes, save them & add them to each day as you eat them. It also lets you know calories and nutrients in the recipe plus you can edit it. All this for free! I count everything from a handful of French beans to a knob of butter. I’m hoping that when I’m on maintenance I’ll just ‘know’ what’s high carb or high calorie and what isn’t as I check everything on MFL.

Well...,a brief summary of this week (5 days) would be that it's been ok but not brilliant food wise. I've had good intentions and great plans, but they've not been particularly well executed. I imagine I will have maintained but will do a proper weigh in tomorrow, and measurements.

However, tomorrow is my big proper 100% on plan start date! Menu and shopping list done ✅

Tomorrow: gallons of water, fast til lunchtime, going out to the National trust with the dc for a walk to end the holidays, then dinner is veggie cottage pie. I'm going for a quick run in the afternoon.

I'm really going to try for 800 cals every day this week, wish me luck!!

No idea what happened there ... I replied to your parsnip v carrot question saythat none of the other replies and your 2nd post were there.... so ignore me!!
We all had the chicken & lentil thing today & yesterday made from breast not thighs and it was incredibly flavoursome!