Blood sugar diet and fast800 thread 16

[thenewaveragebear1983]

Here’s the new thread for the BSD followers, plus those following the Fast800 plan. Everyone is welcome to join us. Here’s a quick recap!

The BSD/fast 800 is a low carb, Mediterranean style way of eating, with the primary aim of stabilising your insulin response when you eat. You achieve this by: eating fewer carbs, cutting out sugar and sweet tasting foods including most fruit, and by following a low calorie plan that reduces your visceral fat meaning that everything functions more effectively. Less insulin means less fat storage (in a nutshell, although more info can be found on this online). The diet was designed to reduce T2 diabetes symptoms (or even reverse it entirely) but can also be used for weightloss.

Eat:
Meats and fish
Oils
Eggs
Full fat dairy products
Nuts, seeds
Pulses/ beans
Veg that grows above ground
Limit fruit: apples, pears, berries- in moderation, with meals, with fats

Occasional alcoholic drinks allowed (spirits, red wine are preferable to beer, lager, etc)
Tea and coffee, herbal tea etc.
And water- drink lots of water!

Avoid
sugar, sweets, and ‘naturally occurring sugars’ such as fructose, maltose, honey, agave, puréed dates etc....

Potatoes of any variety
Pasta
Rice
Breakfast cereals (occasional steel cut oats are ok)
Breads/ flour based products

Exercise:
Michael Moseley recommends HIIT workouts to increase calorie burn and help to tone up, and recommends walking more (increasing your steps weekly until you hit around 10000 a day)

Mindfulness
MM also suggests a programme of mindfulness, meditation, practised for a few minutes each day.

How to follow the plan:
Fast800: follow the plan above, sticking to 800 calories every day for 2 weeks. Ideal to give your weightloss a real kick start, plus improve your insulin function and reduce your sugar cravings.
8 weeks BSD- 8 weeks, follow the guidelines above- 800 calories a day. You don’t need to count carbs grams because the diet is naturally self limiting.
BSD 5:2- for a more leisurely weightloss journey, or as maintenance, or once you’ve done an 8 week stint or 2 weeks of Fast800, you can play around with a combination of increased calorie count, ‘free eating’ and fasting days (800 cals) until you achieve your goals. Many of our long standing members now follow this approach.

You can stop 800 calorie days at any time once you achieve your goal. It’s advised to limit yourself to 12 weeks maximum at 800 calorie days, but you should get excellent results in 8 weeks. Depending on your weightloss goals, you can do further ‘rounds’ of either the 8 week BSD or the Fast800.

Some useful links

Meal planning ideas thread
Blood sugar diet recipe thread and menu planner meal planning thread

<a class="break-all" href="http://go.mumsnet.com/?xs=1&id=470X1554755&url=healthyeater.com/important-tool-weight-loss" target="_blank">TDEE calculator to calculate your daily calorie requirement

<a class="break-all" href="http://go.mumsnet.com/?xs=1&id=470X1554755&url=caliberstrong.com/how-whooshes-impact-your-weight-loss/" target="_blank">information about the ‘whoosh’ phenomenon

We are a nut-free house due to my child’s allergies so I don’t have anything like almond milk in. It is a bit limiting on this diet, but not worth the risk!

Well done black on that loss! It’s so motivating to see the numbers go down quickly. No change for me today on day 4, must have been that extra sausage!! On the plus side I feel loads better today. Interesting to hear I’m not the only one struggling with sleep, although I had a relatively carby tea last night (dhal) and slept much better for it.

Didn’t have any hunger pangs before bed, or in the night or even this morning which is great! Hopefully gets easier from here on in.

I got some Keto sticks as recommended in the book. Tested yesterday and think I might be borderline ketosis but there doesn’t seem to be much difference at the bottom of the scale for the sticks I have!! Anyone got any clues how to tell? Or what “level” of Ketosis is normal, seems to range 1-16 on my sticks?

Oh I do know the shakes are made of nuts btw! I store the pouch out of the way of all other food in the house.

Great work everyone!

@Youhavewonaprize I have never really managed to get into true ketosis on this plan although some people do. I find it too hard to get the right balance of macros, and because I don't eat dairy I don't get enough fat in. The key to ketosis is to pretty much consume all your calories as fat (as protein raises blood sugar slightly if you eat too much of it) and the first BSD never mentioned ketosis at all (although the fast800 one does)
So much can affect those ketostix such as time of day, how dehydrated you are etc so I wouldn't worry too much about chasing ketosis. It will still work even if you aren't showing ketones on the sticks

I’m already finding Day 3 really hard and it’s still only mid-morning. Went for a swim first thing and really felt the effects - I was noticeably slower, only managed twenty minutes instead of usual thirty and barely had the energy to hold the hairdryer up afterwards. Felt quite spacey on the way home. Made it to 16hrs fasting but not sure it was sensible to do so. I’ve had a shake now for breakfast, plenty of water and a black coffee but feel freezing cold and finding it hard to concentrate or summon the energy to go and do my make up.

@youhavewonaprize - I am awful for weighing every day but am going to try and limit myself to 2/3 times a week, with my official weigh-in day as a Saturday morning. I hope I can keep away from the scales in between lol.

That’s fab blackistheneworange and well done all the new starters.

Time of the month here, I am avoiding the obvious carbs, will start on Monday fingers crossed. Don’t feel well enough at the moment. I so want my periods to stop (I’m 52).

Thanks @thenewaveragebear1983 that’s good to know, and interesting ketosis isn’t mentioned in the bsd book.

@blackistheneworange I used to be obsessive about weighing every day as well so I need to keep an eye for old habits creeping back. Although given I weighed myself about 4 times last year I don’t think we’re in danger anytime soon!

@CaptainBrickbeard you’re basically describing how I felt yesterday. I’m feeling much better today so hopefully you will tomorrow

@CaptainBrickbeard & @youhavewonaprize Day 3 is renown for being hard & often starts the onset of the 'keto flu' where you feel crap for a few days. Drink loads and loads of water and add more salt to your diet, it will help ease you through!

I'm opposite on the weighing myself, I need to do it every day or I start to get slack. When I reach my goal and keep it there for a bit I'll try to loosen up but it really helps me see the daily impact (positive & negative) of my choices!

Hello all
It's been a while since I've been here, too many holidays, anxiety issues and Xmas
Well now I'm ready to start again

I'm going to do the 800 fast for 2 weeks minimum. Going for 4 if I can.
I'm staying off alcohol in January.
I have about 10lbs to lose

Could definitely do with the support and some new meal ideas that don't take ages after a day in work

@CaptainBrickbeard I have a glut of almond milk as my best friend's daughter drinks it (she has severe allergies to everything other than nuts I think!)

I am also on day 3 and found it harder than the last two days.

I had an avocado for lunch rather than a shake and am looking forward to dinner. Salad leaves, some leftover Dahl from yesterday and a spoon or two of cauliflower rice.

Tomorrow I am making a pot roast, so I'll hang on until mid afternoon with no food and then have some of the beef, gravy and green vegetables... and renounce the potatoes and Yorkshires!! 😇

@MozzchopsThirty hello! I have been on a break too, but I recognise your name. Ditto to being off alcohol for 30 days and everything else you are doing... but I have more to lose

My Day 3 improved a lot! I had a tuna salad with olives for lunch, drank a ton of water and went for a gentle walk. That horrible jelly-legged feeling went away and I’ve been fine since. Had stir fried cabbage and mackerel from the book for tea. Seemed like a lot of food for just under 300 calories, the cabbage added a lot of bulk!

Made these chicken goujons tonight and even DD was impressed, really yummy! I added a little Cayenne for a touch of a bite. 400 cals but very filling!

Hi - could I join in please?

I’ve just started Fast800 - on my fourth day, not lost anything yet - would you expect to? I’m 85kg and 5’2 It’s the biggest I’ve ever been and I’m still bfing my toddler. But I really need to do something about this weight!

What do you find easier / works better / works for you - 5:2 or 16:8? I’m not unfamiliar with either having dabbled with both in between having children but could never really stick to either.

I also want to address the massively emotional over eating in the evenings so hoping just being more mindful will reset some habits.

Qq- I went on a five mile walk today and spent about 450 calories. Do you add these onto you can have or do you just generally stick to the calorie limit regardless?

Today's been ok for me but again, I haven't calorie counted. I just keep forgetting! I will tomorrow though, I promise!

Today I had a homemade shake with chia seeds, frozen raspberries, soy milk and peanut butter after bootcamp. Lunch was salad, coleslaw and vegan cheese, dinner was 2 veggie burgers with vegan cheese and salad. Really yummy! I've had a small handful of nuts too.

This is now my fourth day of 'trying very hard to be veggie' (I am not 100% trying and don't Intend to be fully veggie ever) but it's been really interesting and I've tried new things. I do find the food is higher in carbs than I am used to and higher than is probably ideal. I suppose there's two types of veggie food- Quorn based which is protein or veg based which is carbs. I think I need to look more closely at packaging in the supermarket to ensure I get the protein stuff not the higher carb stuff. I have eaten tonnes more veg than I have recently been doing and I feel ok. My skin has broken out though which is a sure sign of some detoxing going on.

Tomorrow I aim to fast til lunchtime again, then may have the Mexican eggs I planned for dinner tonight (and didn't have!), a run in the afternoon, then dinner will be a veggie casserole that the kids and Dh can have chicken added to.

I'm going to batch cook tomorrow too: a quorn mince chilli and a shepherds pie (with celeriac mash) which I can portion up for the week, and a meat version of each too for the family.

Mozzchops welcome back! And good luck for your strict 800 two weeks.

Day 3 of 30 day yoga done. I’m really enjoying it so far this year, and feel like I’m in a much better place for it mentally. I’m able to tune in more to the ‘inner’ part of the practice, rather than just wondering how long is left. It’s like not only my organs have been drained of fat by fast800, but some of the fuzz in my brain too.

@GorgeousLadyofWrestling
Hi, welcome! You could expect to lose something but there's lots of reasons why you might not show on the scales do don't be disheartened. Are you drinking enough? You do need extra water. Are you weighing and tracking your cals and carbs (you don't have to do this, certainly not every day, but it can help)

Re: 5:2 and 16:8 - In theory you can do both as one relates to the week, and one relates to the day. So you might do a 5 days on 1500cals, 2 days on 800, but also each day aim to have a fast of 16 hours. For most of us this usually means delaying breakfast til 10 and having dinner at 6, or delaying/missing breakfast til lunch (12) and then having dinner at 8. Even on non fast days it has been shown that despite no reduction in calories, sticking to a 16:8 pattern resulted in weightloss in multiple studies (source: my infinite library of useless blood sugar diet facts )

@thenewaveragebear1983 thanks for the welcome, and that info!

I don’t know if I am low carbing enough. I have had chicken and mushroom soup a couple of the days that had a small bit of rice in. Also had a banana. Definitely not drinking enough water!

Just to clarify - do you mean do 16:8 on all days, five days of 1500 and two days of 800 fast days?

gorgeouslady I’ve lost 1lb over the last 4 days on 800 so a tadge disappointed but I’m probably not drinking enough water. Bizarrely though I feel slimmer. I’ve nit managed any exercise as feel a bit down.... I know exercise would help that but I’m just too ‘meh’ ifykwim
Another 800cal day today & 4th day of no alcohol... don’t think I’ve ever gone 4 days AF before!!

@GorgeousLadyofWrestling I think the benefits of 16:8 come from doing it every day if you can. You will get benefits from doing it even on days where you eat lots of carbs or don't stick to the plan at all. On fast days, it really helps to start eating later and stop earlier so you will naturally do longer time without food anyway. I find the earlier I start eating, the more I eat all day, not just the additional meal but extra calories all day from grazing/snacking.

Re: food/carbs. Where possible I would cut out anything that raises your blood sugar too significantly- so pasta, rice, potato, bread/flour products, sugar and most fruit (and especially bananas, sorry). Aim for fat as your main calorie source, with protein, and then carbs last. It feels like you'll be hungry doing that but the fat will keep you satisfied whereas while carbs 'fill you up' they very quickly get digested and leave you hungry again.

Thank you for the welcome back

I'm busy eating the contents of the fridge before starting on Monday

Just to clarify - do you mean do 16:8 on all days, five days of 1500 and two days of 800 fast days?

I think advice on fast800 is to do 2 full weeks at 800 calories, then you can choose to either continue at 800, or do some variation on the 5:2 by having some days with more calories, and some fasting days (although doesn't necessarily need to be 5:2, could be 3:4?). The 16:8/ time restricted eating is a completely separate thing that you can do alongside your fast days (but can even do on completely off plan days) as an additional way to increase your insulin sensitivity and therefore boost your weightloss

Just realised I answered your question twice! It's been a long day!

Day 3 of Fast800 but had several days after Xmas of high protein/low carb. I'm enjoying how much fruit & veg I'm eating & I've lost 4lbs but it is hard on the willpower. Reveals how much my body craves kcals from white carbs & sugar I guess.

I’ve been concerned that I’m eating too many carbs and hence only 1lb lost. So I’ve been looking back at MFP and it’s 50g or under everyday. Is this about right? I thought about putting these parameters into ‘goals’ but no idea if these are correct...