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Fasting / 5:2 diet

Talk about intermittent fasting and 5:2, including what’s worked for others. Mumsnet hasn't checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. You may wish to speak to a medical professional before starting any diet.

5:2 Exercise & Fitness Thread Number 2: Advice and information for those following 5:2 / IF (Intermittent Fasting)

990 replies

BigChocFrenzy · 28/03/2014 17:11

Why Exercise ?

Maintaining a normal bodyweight and taking regular exercise are 2 major areas of life which we can address to improve our health.

Regular exercise helps reduce the risk of obesity, type 2 diabetes, heart disease, high blood pressure, some cancers, osteoporosis, dementia, depression.

Increasing your % muscle and / or reducing your % body fat lowers the risk of death from all causes LowerRiskMuscle

Regular exercisers gain the greatest benefits over their lifetime and theyj can minimise biological aging, i.e. "Bend the Aging Curve BendAge

Fasted training

i.e. training on FDs, seems to increase the benefits of both training and IF.
Most experienced exercisers soon manage fasted training without loss of performance for session of up to 90 mins.

Hormesis

"What doesn't kill you makes you stronger"
Hormesis Mattson , BlackSwan and Hormesis is cutting edge science for nutrition and fitness.

Its principles are that alternating between "extremes" of feast and fast (5:2 / IF) or intense training and rest (HIIT), makes the body more resilient.

The intermittent stress of lifting an extreme weight or performing at high speed for a short period pushes the body to overcompensate and prepare for an even greater future challenge HormesisTrain , Hormesis-Edge , and AntiFragile The following recovery period avoids damage from over-stressing.

INEFFICIENT: Low-Medium Intensity Steady state Cardio

Steady state cardio is NOT necessary for fitness and should only be a small part of your weekly cardio, unless it is all you can manage to do.

Walking outdoors is beneficial psychologically, is easy on the knee joints and has some physical benefits.

However, at speeds of 5mph or faster, running will burn more calories per mile than walking Ref

Also low-moderate or steady state exercise tends to increase appetite, whereas intense exercise can suppress appetite for up to 15 hours.

BEST TYPES of Exercise

HIIT cardio and resistance training / weight lifting are recommended to boost the effect of 5:2/IF, to increase weight loss, reduce body fat, retain muscle and maintain TDEE / BMR.

Anyone who is not specialising in a sport at a high level should aim to do both HIIT cardio and lifting / resistance training.

FAST Exercise

Dr Mosely developed a Fast Exercise program to complement his 5:2 WOE FastExercise

He lists many HIIT and strength routines that only take a few minutes, but can make significantly improve metabolism and fat-burning capability FastExercises

HOW to Exercise

The cardio machines and the girlie pink dumbbells that gyms push are NOT adequate to significantly improve fitness or burn fat.

Whether you join a gym or train at home or in the park:

  • Train as intensively as your time, health and fitness level allow.
  • Do not remain in your comfort zone, or you will not improve.
  • You are supposed to drip sweat and pant heavily !
However, a brisk 30 mins daily walk plus 5 mins hoop is better than nothing and if done regularly will bring some health benefits.

HIIT (High Intensity Interval Training)

HIIT is an exercise strategy which alternates brief intervals of high intensity exercise with less-intense recovery periods.
Examples:

  • 20 seconds high intensity + 10 secs recovery
  • 60 sec high + 30 sec low etc.

HIIT is very time-efficient, producing the greatest fitness benefit in the least time (the advantage of hormesis).

Scientists have proved that HIIT burns more fat than steady state lower intensity exercise and speeds up the metabolism, which helps burn more calories for up to 48 hrs.

HIIT also improves the insulin metabolism, which is very important for health.

HIIT reduces risk of heart problems more than doing lower intensity SteadyState , pp. 31-34.

HIIT increases both aerobic and anaerobic endurance

HIIT can be applied to cardio: e.g. cycling, running, skipping, jumping, mountain climbs or to bodyweight exercises, e.g. squatting, situps, burpees, pressups

Most gyms offer HIIT classes, e.g. spinning, circuit training, CrossFit, Tabata, Fartlek*(Fartlek = HIIT with irregular intervals)

RESISTANCE Training / LIFTING

Helps retain muscle mass during weight loss and hence to maintain TDEE.
You can lift at home, or in the gym weights area, or in a pump class.

It is best not to train the same muscle groups 2 days in succession, so have rest days, or cardio, or train different muscle groups on different days.
Try to build up to weight training for 30-60 mins twice per week.

Reps = the number of repetitions in a set of a particular lifting exercise
Sets are normally separated by brief rests E.g. you might do 3 sets each of 12 reps all of the same exercise.

WARNING
Do not lift massively heavy barbells, more than bodyweight, unless you are really fit with good technique.
Women who have given birth and / or are aged 40+ have a higher risk of pelvic floor / prolapse injuries when lifting heavy than young non-mums.

Press ups

  • By far the best upper body exercise
  • Keep attempting one full pressup rather than doing several dozen girlie ones with your knees on the floor.
  • Once you can do one pressup, you will soon be able to build up to 5, then 10 etc.
  • Tip: keep the abs rigid, so strong abs are as important as strong shoulders & arms
  • Hand Release Pressups are good to build up strength for full ones
  • Also build up via inclined pressups InclinedPress , see bottom of wiki page
  • To increase the number of pushups IncreaseNum

ATG Arse To Grass bodyweight squat

  • The best exercise for the large muscle group in bum and thighs.
  • Basic principle: It is like having a pee on a public loo - get your bum down low and pointing to the rear, but not actually touching the seat.
-Lean back on your heels, so that weight is on them, not on your toes. -bring your arms forward
  • keep your back straight, but angled slightly forward, not vertical.
  • Go down as far as you can without knee pain.

Pullups

  • Very few women can do full ones, but assisted ones build excellent muscle
  • Work the same muscles with the much easier Australian pullup or imverted row InvertedRow

If you have access to dumbbells / barbells, then for maximum effect, work the large muscle groups:
squats bent-over rows (press button "female") Behind neckPress (press button "female") dead lift

To increase Strength Rather than Muscle Mass
Lift as heavy as you can, low reps, with 1 minute rest between sets e.g. 5 sets x 5 reps each, i.e. totalling 25 lifts.

To Build More Muscle
Lift lower (NOT Girlie) weight, do 3 sets x 8-20 reps, i.e. totalling 24-60 lifts.

AVOID OSTEOPOROSIS

To retain bone strength and avoid a painfully disabled old age, start now:
Ideally weight-bearing exercises that load the bone along its length of these types:

Impact exercise E.g. walking, running, jumping, skipping rope, step class, hitting a heavy punch bag.

Lifting: squats, press-ups, bench press, overhead press etc.

Squats are much better for osteoporosis than lunges, also for knees:
The weight in a squat is transmitted down along the spine, through the hip, and down along the bones of the leg, whereas in a lunge, it is transmitted across the shinbone and puts pressure on the knee joint.

Note: Cycling normally does NOT increase bone density, as it does not load bones along their length. Osteo

KETTLEBELLS Kettle
Beginners:
. Two-handed swing
. Sumo Deadlift
. Turkish Getup
. Swing
. Clean and Jerk
. Press

Improve your GRIP STRENGTH GripMen , BodyBuild

CALCULATORS:
Fast Fitness Calculators: 52FastExercise
Estimate your fitness age: FitAge
Estimate Vo2Max iTunes App: Vo2APP
Body Fat Calculator:BF
Healthy Body Fat Percentages at Different Ages: HealthyBF
TDEE with detailed activity times: TDEE

OP posts:
Thread gallery
37
BigChocFrenzy · 13/04/2015 08:01

A good reminder about iron and tea.
It's interesting how substances react together in our body. Calcium supplements often have added Vit D as they work together, but should be taken at different times to other vitamin tablets or it intereferes with their absorption. Complicated, but this summary helps.

OP posts:
ErrolTheDragon · 13/04/2015 08:30

This paper is a study of the effect of tea and other dietary substances on iron absorption which I think indicates that I can still have my lunchtime cuppa but that if you're actually having to supplement your iron, have it with some juice instead.

BetsyBell · 13/04/2015 11:01

Yes, we are not given enough info on the reactions of different things within our bodies - and it's so important! During both my pregnancies I couldn't touch tea or coffee. I thought it was to do with the caffeine at the time but I guess it's plausible that it was my body's way of saying 'you need all the iron you can get'. Which is why I pay attention when my tastes change.

I watched an interesting programme on iplayer yesterday "The truth about your medicine cabinet". I was aware on most the things it talked about but there was an interesting segment on the effect of cold and heat sprays or cream on muscles post-workout. Firstly it showed that the sprays only affected the skin and didn't change the temp in muscles, but the interesting bit was they got some volunteers at a 5 mile muddy obstacle race to either spend 15mins (long enough to change muscle temp by 1degree) in an ice bath, a hot bath or nothing then tracked their muscle recovery progress over the next few days. Unsurprisingly, the nothing group suffered the most but the other two had similar rates of very-much improved recovery - the ice bath slightly better, so often chosen by professional athletes, but for the rest of us a nice hot bath, post serious workout will do a lot of good. I love a bath so good news for me! Admittedly the sample size was small so I hope this is backed up by other studies.

Anglaise Congratulations! Now you've got a PB and podium spot perhaps you can stop torturing your poor body with the longer races!!

ErrolTheDragon · 13/04/2015 12:26

If any of my family did a 5 mile muddy obstacle course and didn't follow it with a hot bath they'd definitely suffer. Wink

BigChocFrenzy · 13/04/2015 13:39

Ice bath, yikes ! Shock [brrr emoticon]
I enjoy my looong hot shower afterwards in the gym Ok, standing = an "active" bath. Works for me.
(I suspect that 6 x weekly shower marathons, plus several bottles free filtered water per day, pays for my gym membership)

OP posts:
BetsyBell · 13/04/2015 13:55

Grin errol Quite.

I feel like that about showering at the gym BC- the water is seriously hot and plentiful. Luckily for everyone else me, they are not communal Grin [likes privacy emoticon]

ErrolTheDragon · 13/04/2015 16:26

Maybe my DD has the perfect solution after serious exertion windsurfing... they usually muck around in the cold water for a while after and then get the hot shower. Grin (this is a bunch of 15/16yo girls so the showers are not communal!)

BigChocFrenzy · 13/04/2015 20:28

Grin [bare-arsed shameless emoticon]

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ErrolTheDragon · 13/04/2015 21:20

My DD would be scandalised if I don't at least pretend a little modesty in the changing room. I suppose I was the same at her age.

Anglaise1 · 14/04/2015 07:54

Oh goodness, communal showers, I hated sport when at comprehensive school because of them, so did a lot of other girls. As an adult, no problem. Do they still exist in schools? In France they don't have any showers after sports in school at all, or proper sports 'kit' Shock it is much more casual. The extra curricular sports are more serious.
Betsy I watched that programme on the over the counter medicines last night - it was really interesting. Show that a lot of money is wasted unnecessarily on hot and cold sprays and cough medicine. Honey and lemon was the best thing to help stop a cough!

ErrolTheDragon · 14/04/2015 08:16

DD's school apparently does have showers but no-one uses them (even though I don't think they're communal as such) - she never has a towel in her PE kit. Instead they all have deodorant sprays - no idea how they breath through that fug!

ErrolTheDragon · 14/04/2015 22:29

Just noticed there is a whole new 'Weights room' topic - it might have useful info for people wanting do do more Big Girl weights.

BigChocFrenzy · 17/04/2015 09:57

This was requested by the main thread again - I'll add it to the OP in the next Exercise Thread 3

Dr Mosely developed a Fast Exercise program to complement his 5:2 WOE [[http://www.fast-exercises.com FastExercise]

He lists many HIIT and strength routines that only take a few minutes, but can make significantly improve metabolism and fat-burning capability FastExercises

This is what I condensed from his articles and my own research

HIIT Fitness Blasts
"No time" to exercise ?
Or want to boost fitness & fat-burning metabolism
Take a few mins per day, 3-5 days per week

START with 2 mins warmup then EITHER

Sprint or Rope-skipping intervals
. 1 min sprinting / skipping @ max effort +90 secs jogging to recover
. Do 5 intervals

OR

Fast Blasts
Choose say one of these exercises:
Running, stationary bike set to low resistance, burpees, punchbag, step-ups, swimming, squats, lunges, pressups, tricep dips, situps, jumping jacks ... or any combination you like.

Then choose your type of Blast from this list:

4-minute Blast
. 4 mins @ 90% effort

"Tabata" = 8 x intervals of 20 secs @ 100% effort + 10 secs recovery (rest or slow speed)

2 x20-sec intervals=
. 20-sec @ 100% effort
. 2 mins walk to recover
. 20-sec @ 100% effort

Preferably END any HIIT or Fat Blast with a few mins cooldown walk / jog

OP posts:
ErrolTheDragon · 17/04/2015 10:09

I was wondering, BC, whether it would be useful to pick out a few moves for the 'blasts' which can be done without special clothes or equipment - eg in socks and ordinary bra, no mat or dumbells. I'm pretty sure there are quite a few - e.g. squats (chair, normal, sumo, depending on tightness of clothes) maybe - can you think of some more? The no-excuses list. Grin

BigChocFrenzy · 17/04/2015 10:54

OK, no equipment and all except running can be done indoors:

No Excuses Running, burpees, air-punching, squats, squat jumps, lunges, pressups, tricep dips, situps, leg raises, jumping jacks, spotty dog, side hip raises ....

OP posts:
BigChocFrenzy · 17/04/2015 10:57

All need training shoes and anything cardio needs a sports bra.

OP posts:
stripytees · 17/04/2015 11:02

Do any of you use kettle bells? I have a 6kg one and two smaller ones. I used to use them regularly but have got out of the habit; planning to get back into it again.

BigChocFrenzy · 17/04/2015 11:14

breadandwine does a lot of kettlebells. There are exercises and videos at the end of the OP, just before the Calculators

OP posts:
ErrolTheDragon · 17/04/2015 11:22

BC - I think it's the faff of putting on a sports bra that will put some people off. I'm lucky working from home, I just put it on in the morning - essentially exercise clothes on top, jeans below till I'm ready to start and changing out of those takes literally no time combined with pre-exercise wee! Grin It really does remove a barrier.

I reckon of the ones you listed, the ones doable with decent normal bra would be:
air-punching, squats, lunges, pressups, tricep dips, situps, leg raises, spotty dog, side hip raises

and maybe could do the punches, squats (though maybe not for beginners) and situps without trainers.

BigChocFrenzy · 17/04/2015 13:37

I recommend getting changed, to avoid accidents and to feel vaguely professional. Fashionable kit can even be motivating.
Wink
High heels could be dangerous, flimsy clothes could be torn and accident /injury could put someone off for life.

I just can't visualise changing as a hurdle, not in someone who'll last the first 20 sec interval.

A certain minimum willpower / grip is required
Also loose-fitting clothes, cheap trainers

OP posts:
ErrolTheDragon · 17/04/2015 17:30

I just can't visualise changing as a hurdle
I can! Especially for people with small kids.
Obv not in high heels unless you're Ginger Rogers already.

Anglaise1 · 17/04/2015 20:48

Maybe it depends on the size of your bust. I don't, but I could quite easily run in a normal bra. I can certainly skip and do push ups, planks etc without a sports bra. But I'm a 34B so there isn't much there to harness. I guess if you are well endowed a sports bra is pretty much essential for most exercises.

BigChocFrenzy · 17/04/2015 20:58

I'm 34 A Blush < flat-chested view of life ! >

OP posts:
ErrolTheDragon · 17/04/2015 23:44

I'm a 32e and could do the ones I mentioned in normal bra, and planks, but not any running or jumping. Well, not unless I used my hands for support- running up and down stairs in my pjs I sometimes do that thing. Grin

BigChocFrenzy · 17/04/2015 23:48

We seem far more divided into couch potatoes or gym bunnies than when I was a kid skipping around dinosaurs
If you've got DCs, why not take them out running. Fit parents can help develop fit kids by example.

A big American Heart Foundation study:
. "Millions of children around the world cannot run as fast or as far as their parents were able to at their age" and
. "it takes children 90 seconds longer to run a mile than their counterparts did 30 years ago. Heart-related fitness has declined 5% each decade since 1975, for children"
The DCs in that article picture look slim, as I remember kids used to be

OP posts: