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Fasting / 5:2 diet

Talk about intermittent fasting and 5:2, including what’s worked for others. Mumsnet hasn't checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. You may wish to speak to a medical professional before starting any diet.

The 5:2 thread number 34 - New Year (title courtesy of B&W) Come and join us and take CONTROL! Of your weight, and of your lives.

999 replies

BigChocFrenzyAteYourReindeer · 30/12/2013 01:10

The continuing thread for those of us following the 5:2 fast or other forms of fasting such as 4:3, ADF, or daily 16:8.
The 5:2 diet was featured on Horizon in August 2012 and essentially requires you to fast for 2 non-consecutive days per week. The other 5 days, you can eat normally - or approximately your Total Daily Energy Expenditure (TDEE - see explanation below). 4:3 is the same except you fast on 3 days in the week. Alternate-day fasting (ADF) is just how it sounds; you fast every other day. 16:8 is another form where you stick to only eating in an 8 hour window each day, therefore fasting for 16 hours each day.
By "fasting", we mean that we keep our calorie consumption very low, around 500 calories on average for a woman, 600 for a man, on those days.
You'll find on these threads we use a number of acronyms. If you're new to the threads, or Mumsnet in general, they might not make much sense.
WOE/WOL = Way Of Eating/Way Of Life. We use this term instead of "diet" as many of us see this as something to do in the long term.
MFP = My Fitness Pal, a website or app many use for keeping track of the number of calories they're eating.
TDEE = Total Daily Energy Expenditure, quantifies the number of calories you burn in a day. This measure is best estimated by scaling your Basal Metabolic Rate to your level of activity. TDEE is critical in tailoring your nutrition plan to desired fitness goals. Here is a link to a calculator to help you figure out how many calories you should be eating in a day.
NFD = Non fast day
NSV = Non scale victory
Michael Mosley has a website to accompany his book on the subject. Please go check it out, as he's the whole reason most of us are here!
Lurkers and new starters: please just jump in and post - you'll find a lot of support here and we’re a friendly bunch.
Here is a list of links to get you started with this way of eating. Please let us know if you find a new article or some other information online:
All our previous threads can be found by browsing through the fasting section of the site.
Another thread which breadandwine has started is a good resource for some of the tips and links that get lost in these big threads. In addition to sharing links, we try to condense some of our top tips for fasting there. Keep in mind, we all do this differently, so these are just tips, not rules. This might be a good place to catch up with us if you're feeling a bit lost!
eatriskier’s thread has some lovely inspiring stories which are worth checking out if you want some motivation to get started or keep going through a plateau. Please add your own too.
frenchfancy has a recipe thread over here, please post any low-calorie recipes there so they don't get lost in these bigger threads!
If you've been at this a while and are moving on to maintaining your goal weight, there is a thread here to discuss that.
Here is the link to the BBC article regarding Michael Mosley's findings, which was featured on Horizon - link to that programme here.
A blog post here gives some of the scientific explanation for why this way of eating helps you to not only lose weight, but improve your all-around health.
This link nicely demonstrates that there are many body ‘right’ body shapes and types, because what we are actually aiming for is low body fat for fitness and health.
A Telegraph article which comments on the diet and gives a brief overview by Dr Mosley himself, very informative if you're just starting. (I highly recommend this for an overview)
A study discussed here gives commentary specifically addressing the effect of this diet on obese people (both men and women), with regard to both health and weight loss. ("After 8 weeks of treatment, participants had an average 12.5 lbs reduction in body weight and a 4 cm decrease in waist circumference. Total fat mass declined by about 12 lbs while lean body mass remained relatively constant.) it also mentions "Plasma adiponectin, a protein hormone that is elevated in obesity and associated with heart disease, dropped by 30%. As did LDL cholesterol (25%) and triglycerides (32%).")
Something to consider if you are currently your ideal BMI: this appears to suggest the benefits for women at a lower BMI might not be seeing the same health benefits that are found on men at their ideal BMI. (Though anecdotal evidence from these long-running threads may suggest otherwise…)
A BIG THANK YOU to all who have been contributing. Most of us are learning this way of eating as we go along. All of the links above have been posted by others in our previous threads, and they've been very helpful.
A HUGE THANK YOU to Greeneggsandnicht for putting together all this info and resources into one concise OP text, much appreciated by so many 5:2ers!
Come join us, and tell us about your experiences with this way of life!

OP posts:
Breadandwine · 01/01/2014 11:53

I have bacon and stilton pull-apart bread in the oven.

Toffee you're amazing! You've been feeling crap for days, now, you said yourself you've no energy - yet you drop that lovely bit of baking into the thread without even thinking about it!

Wonderful! Star

Any chance of a recipe? Smile

I wouldn't worry about fasting - I think you should just pamper yourself until you feel well again. You know the weight will come off when you put your mind to it. Flowers

Breadandwine · 01/01/2014 12:04

Posted too early!

Meant to say I'm fasting tomorrow - and I need to plan an early dinner tonight. If I can finish that by 6, it means that, by the time I go to be about 2am, I'll have 8 hours in the bag - gives me a head start.

About baking: yesterday I made a large loaf (overnight, no kneading) - 1.1kg - which I cut into 16 chunks of around 70g each. Last year at this time I would have cut it into 100g chunks.

Then I made some Peshwari naan - in the oven - since we we'd sent out for an Indian meal. It was really busy, so we had to wait nearly two hours. Back along I'd have been chewing the carpet and getting very impatient. But in fact I was quite serene, albeit knocking back a bit more stout than I intended whilst waiting.

Earlier I'd made a vegan trifle, only to find I'd run out of soya cream - something I always have in the cupboard! So I had it without.

I find the sponge cooked in the microwave too light for a trifle - I like a solid sponge for the jelly to soak into. Next time I'll bake the sponge in the oven.

BiscuitsAreMyDownfall · 01/01/2014 12:11

So just worked out my body fat percentage and its classed as obese, I'm confused now. My BMI is just into the overweight bordering on healthy whereas body fat is 39.1% so just into obese. That's my huge belly for you.

Had a bit of a wake-up call there. 2 years ago I was a stone and a half heavier, can't begin to imagine how bad I was then. No more thinking that I was OK. I'm really not.

Southeastdweller · 01/01/2014 12:21

Happy new year everyone!

Little exercise and plenty of yummy food the past five days is leading me to a much-needed fast day tomorrow. My gym is open today so I'm going there for a couple of hours and I'm hoping my packet of sea salt caramel fudge I opened earlier lasts until Sunday!

biscuits Do you think he had a sneaky look at the book when you weren't around? Wink

ToffeeOwnsTheSausage · 01/01/2014 12:36

I forgot to measure. I haven't fasted for over a week. Not sure when to try again tbh as still not 100%. Any more advice?

Bacon and stilton pull-apart.

Prep - 25 mins
Cooking time - 25-30mins.
Serves 16

450g white self-raising flour.
1/4 tsp salt (I didn't put this in).
2 tsp baking powder.
85g diced butter.
1 egg, beaten.
About 200ml milk.
15 g butter - for later, needs melting.
115g cooked cold lean smoked back bacon, finely chopped (I left it cm size).
115g stilton cheese, crumbled.
Beaten egg to glaze (I used milk, and it was fine.)

Preheat oven to 200C.

Grease a deep 25cm round cake tin and set aside. *I used 2 cake tins of about 8 inches).

Sift the flour, salt and baking powder into a large bowl. (I don't sift and it all went in the food mixer to make the dough). Lightly rub in the butter. Add the egg and enough milk to form a soft dough.

Turn the dough onto a lightly floured surface and knead gently. Roll out to form a 40cm x 28cm rectangle. Lightly brush with the melted better evenly over the dough. Scatter the chopped bacon evenly over the dough then sprinkle the crumbled stilton cheese over the top.

Starting from the long side, roll up the dough fairly tightly like a Swiss roll. Cut into 16 even pieces (I was quite relaxed about this an di think I got about 12 pieces) then place the rolls, cut side up, in a circular pattern, so the slices are touching each other.

Brush the tops of the spirals with the beaten egg (I used milk) then bake for 25-30 minutes, or until risen and golden brown. Cool slightly in the tin, then turn out and invert onto a wire rack. Serve warm or cold.

Warm - they are divine.
Cold - still very tasty.

Enjoy!

FunnyFestiveTableRunner · 01/01/2014 12:37

Happy new year all of you.

Thanks BigChoc for the post bug tips. My appetite is definitely leading me towards certain foods. Had a chicken stir fry last night and it really settled my stomach. Muesli with almond milk this morning and veg broth for lunch. Going to have pork fillet and plenty of potatoes and veg for tea. Can't stomach any crap.

I have decided I am going to combine old WW plan and 5:2. I would rather count points than calories and I used to do the Wendy Plan as people called it - 2 low point days, some at normal points and at least one at very high points. So my fast days will be 8-10 points which leaves decent points for the other days. I need some structure because at the minute on non fast days I go mad.

Time for a name change too I reckon now that the festive season is over! Wink

BetsyBell · 01/01/2014 12:42

B&W that's what I'm thinking too - eat early this evening to get the fasting underway! 24 hours of liquid only then a nice bit of dinner.

Easy Grin

Just got to remember that evening snacking is now back off the menu.

tomorrowweeat · 01/01/2014 12:43

Hi Newbies and Old Friends :) Well the good news is I'm still a stone lighter than I was this time last year. But since stopping 5:2 ing in the Summer (long story/lots of silly excuses) I have managed to regain 1 stone 5 lbs of the weight I'd lost. Oh well, I'm back now with renewed enthusiasm. Good job really as at 13.5 I have a serious amount to lose.
First fast of the year today and I have a lovely pot of veg soup bubbling away in anticipation of my lunch (and dinner)
Good luck everyone.

BetsyBell · 01/01/2014 12:45

biscuits 2014 is going to be the year you change all that - new job to look forward to and all the skills in your locker to get a new body too. Smile

BiscuitsAreMyDownfall · 01/01/2014 12:52

Exactly Betsy

lucyintheskywithdinos · 01/01/2014 13:09

Happy New Year! I'm not fasting today...too hungover. We had a big party last night. I was mostly sensible though and several hours of dancing is good exercise right?

whenshewasbad you can do it!

BigChocFrenzyAteYourReindeer · 01/01/2014 13:15

Waist

Visceral fat (around the organs) is more dangerous than subcutaneous (under the skin).
The critical place to measure visceral fat is at the narrowest part of your trunk, 1-2 inches above the navel.

I think this is what we mean, on this thread at least, by waist measurement.

Losing Belly Fat

Combining IF with HIIT, which increases insulin sensitivity and burns more calories, is the optimum strategy for losing belly fat.

In your body, B-2 receptors are the ones that signal that it’s time to burn fat, as opposed to a-2 receptors, which signal it to hold onto fat deposits.

As you fast, the insulin levels in your body drop, which eventually inhibits the a-2 receptors and activates the b-2 receptors to start burning fat. Thus, when you eat again, the body is prepared to burn these calories rather than store them as fat.

Stubborn belly fat (usually when you don't have much excess) has far more a-2 receptors than b-2 receptors – hence the trouble with losing that last bit of fat.

OP posts:
BiscuitsAreMyDownfall · 01/01/2014 13:58

So basicallyBigChoc the best way to lose belly fat is IF and HIIT?

I will tell you in a few months if that is the case for me.

I measured around my navel so I need to measure again.

mummytowillow · 01/01/2014 14:32

Happy New Year everyone!

I've decided to join you all. I weighed myself this morning and I'm 14st 10lbs, that means I've put on over a stone in the last 3 months.

I'm a regular yo yo dieter and have had some success with WW and SW, but as soon as I tell myself I'm on a diet, I set myself up to fail. Its like voice telling me to crave chocolate and biscuits and I have zero willpower.

So having looked at this thread I think if I know I can eat normally for five days, and then eat but in limited amounts for two days this may help?

So, I've worked my TDEE as 1973 calories which does seem a lot, so can I just check I'm going to be doing this right please.

I can eat what I want up to that limit five days a week, obviously its more sensible to choose healthy options to make these calories up.

When I fast I need to stop eating the day around 6pm and try not to eat again until lunchtime (12 for me). I can eat 500 calories and again this can be anything (but should be filling). I've decided to fast on Monday and Wednesday is this OK or is the gap to big?

I'm thinking the way forward for fasting days is protein, veg and soups, is this correct.

Do any of you eat ready made soup, ie Covent Garden, tins etc and what do you recommend.

I'm going to a posh wedding in May, so how much could I shift before then do you think.

Thanks x

BiscuitsAreMyDownfall · 01/01/2014 14:32

Ok so I've just measured a couple of inches above my navel and it is 35 inches which puts me in the overweight category just over the healthy category so it matches my BMI. Still aware I need to change myself though, but I'm confident I can do this.

BiscuitsAreMyDownfall · 01/01/2014 14:33

Sounds good to me mummy.

mummytowillow · 01/01/2014 14:37

Sorry, one more question!

Should I start tomorrow and then fast on Monday, or start a fast day tomorrow?

Thanks

Breadandwine · 01/01/2014 14:48

Go for it tomorrow, willow! Lots of people fast on Mondays and Thursdays.

Sooner you start, and all that! Smile

ChristmasPudding6 · 01/01/2014 14:50

Happy new Year everyone!!!

Tomorrow will be my first fast day of 2014. I was still clearing up a box of celebrations into my tummy in the early hours this morning so it seemed pointless trying to start on an FD today. Like Betsy & B&W I will try having dinner a little earlier than usual to get more LOF hours under my belt. I'm hoping for a SWATH of 10st 7 on Friday morning and then I will be happy. Hoping to get to 9st 13 by end of April as that will be my 1 year anniversary on 5:2.

So many newbies on the thread. Great to see you all and good luck. This isn't a quick fix to losing weight so stick with it for the long haul and you won't be disappointed.

Mummy, it sounds like you are on the right track. Tomorrow is as good a day to start as any. Not everyone had been able to jump straight in at 500 cals so why don't you use it as a practise day? There will be lots of us on the thread tomorrow to support you and just keep yourself busy.

MrsFlorrick · 01/01/2014 14:58

Happy new year to you all!Wine

FD today. So far two clementines and a banana plus tea and a coffee.

Planning roast chicken later. With tatties for the DC and DH but kale crisps for me and other veg obv. Thinking cauliflower and broccoli.

Yesterday was a Bigchoc stylee high cal frenzy of crap food. 3800 cals. I didn't even have breakfast or wine for New Years.
I developed a migraine last night and needed to take my medication which doesn't mix with alcohol. At least it sorted the migraine so no wine didn't seem bad.
I had loads of sushi for lunch followed by coffee and danish at Eat. Dinner was a variety of Waitrose Heston party food things (junk basically). Followed by cheese and biscuits and then 10 ferror rocher.

The above doesn't sound much but plug it into MFP and you'll be surprised! It's scarily easy to eat a huge a amount without feeling like you pigged out.

It's all back to the fact that other than the sushi, the rest is pure crap and not actually filling meals.

That's why meals are so important.

Anyway feeling floppy today (after effect of medication). DH is hungover and DC are tired. So we are flopping in the lounge and DC watching TV (normally not allowed this time of day).

Biscuits. Don't worry about the waist measurements!!
Seriously. This woe will blitz it for you.
Last January my waist was 39inches and yes proper waist not belly button but above as Bigchoc said. I'm Blush about that. It sounds massive.

It's now 30. Bear in mind that at over 5'10" my waist hasn't ever been below 28" unless I was underweight.

You're starting from 35" and as I've lost 9" in a year, you'll lose that and probably more. So in under a year your waist will be like Eatriskiers tiny waist GrinGrin

Btw mine took 10 months to lose the 9" so much less than a year. Not lost lately as I've had a massively long stall (and not worked out much either).

So yeah you're waist will be great in no time. Doing the Shred or other JM workouts will help you get it there much faster.

MrsFlorrick · 01/01/2014 15:01

And yes easy for me to have a FD today as no wine last night and after effect if migraine means less hungry so I am taking advantage of that. Wink

WhenSheWasBadSheWasExhausted · 01/01/2014 15:18

Thanks lucy I need cheering on. I've had a mocha (88 cals) and porridge (300 cals). Hungry but not massively hungry.

I like your style, I remember feeling hungover after a night of drink and dancing, I'm hoping to donut again when the kids get a bit older.

mummytow best of luck with the diet, can't give any advice as its all a bit new to me too.

toffee that bacon and Stilton recipe sounds amazing.

Butteredsidedown · 01/01/2014 15:29

Done my stats ready for tomorrow

Weight 12st 5
Waist 37 inches (over half my height. Should be 32.5)
Bmi 28.7

I sort of wish that I could have a cholesterol test pre starting but I'm happy to know that whatever it was, it will be a lot better after a few weeks!

What do people do on mfp? I just set mine to 1/2 a lb loss per week so I have roughly my TDEE for the NFDs then plan on just ignoring the "you are under your calorie goal warnings for my FD!

I plan on taking a small cup of veg soup for lunch tomorrow to see me through at work after a 16 hr fast on clear liquids only.

EarSlaps · 01/01/2014 15:51

Biscuits- yes, fasted exercise and HIIT will definitely help blitz that belly fat! I lost 4 inches off my belly in about 4 months with that combination. Mine was with Jillian DVDs, so not even massively high intensity. I fasted twice a week (mostly- I cut out the occasional fast if it didn't fit in with social plans and just made up by cutting down a bit elsewhere) and exercised 3-5 times a week. I now have a flat tummy.

Butteredsidedown · 01/01/2014 16:06

EarSlaps ...flat tummy? Massive congrats Smile

You have no idea how much motivation that has just given me!

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