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Fasting / 5:2 diet

Talk about intermittent fasting and 5:2, including what’s worked for others. Mumsnet hasn't checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. You may wish to speak to a medical professional before starting any diet.

The 5:2 thread number 34 - New Year (title courtesy of B&W) Come and join us and take CONTROL! Of your weight, and of your lives.

999 replies

BigChocFrenzyAteYourReindeer · 30/12/2013 01:10

The continuing thread for those of us following the 5:2 fast or other forms of fasting such as 4:3, ADF, or daily 16:8.
The 5:2 diet was featured on Horizon in August 2012 and essentially requires you to fast for 2 non-consecutive days per week. The other 5 days, you can eat normally - or approximately your Total Daily Energy Expenditure (TDEE - see explanation below). 4:3 is the same except you fast on 3 days in the week. Alternate-day fasting (ADF) is just how it sounds; you fast every other day. 16:8 is another form where you stick to only eating in an 8 hour window each day, therefore fasting for 16 hours each day.
By "fasting", we mean that we keep our calorie consumption very low, around 500 calories on average for a woman, 600 for a man, on those days.
You'll find on these threads we use a number of acronyms. If you're new to the threads, or Mumsnet in general, they might not make much sense.
WOE/WOL = Way Of Eating/Way Of Life. We use this term instead of "diet" as many of us see this as something to do in the long term.
MFP = My Fitness Pal, a website or app many use for keeping track of the number of calories they're eating.
TDEE = Total Daily Energy Expenditure, quantifies the number of calories you burn in a day. This measure is best estimated by scaling your Basal Metabolic Rate to your level of activity. TDEE is critical in tailoring your nutrition plan to desired fitness goals. Here is a link to a calculator to help you figure out how many calories you should be eating in a day.
NFD = Non fast day
NSV = Non scale victory
Michael Mosley has a website to accompany his book on the subject. Please go check it out, as he's the whole reason most of us are here!
Lurkers and new starters: please just jump in and post - you'll find a lot of support here and we’re a friendly bunch.
Here is a list of links to get you started with this way of eating. Please let us know if you find a new article or some other information online:
All our previous threads can be found by browsing through the fasting section of the site.
Another thread which breadandwine has started is a good resource for some of the tips and links that get lost in these big threads. In addition to sharing links, we try to condense some of our top tips for fasting there. Keep in mind, we all do this differently, so these are just tips, not rules. This might be a good place to catch up with us if you're feeling a bit lost!
eatriskier’s thread has some lovely inspiring stories which are worth checking out if you want some motivation to get started or keep going through a plateau. Please add your own too.
frenchfancy has a recipe thread over here, please post any low-calorie recipes there so they don't get lost in these bigger threads!
If you've been at this a while and are moving on to maintaining your goal weight, there is a thread here to discuss that.
Here is the link to the BBC article regarding Michael Mosley's findings, which was featured on Horizon - link to that programme here.
A blog post here gives some of the scientific explanation for why this way of eating helps you to not only lose weight, but improve your all-around health.
This link nicely demonstrates that there are many body ‘right’ body shapes and types, because what we are actually aiming for is low body fat for fitness and health.
A Telegraph article which comments on the diet and gives a brief overview by Dr Mosley himself, very informative if you're just starting. (I highly recommend this for an overview)
A study discussed here gives commentary specifically addressing the effect of this diet on obese people (both men and women), with regard to both health and weight loss. ("After 8 weeks of treatment, participants had an average 12.5 lbs reduction in body weight and a 4 cm decrease in waist circumference. Total fat mass declined by about 12 lbs while lean body mass remained relatively constant.) it also mentions "Plasma adiponectin, a protein hormone that is elevated in obesity and associated with heart disease, dropped by 30%. As did LDL cholesterol (25%) and triglycerides (32%).")
Something to consider if you are currently your ideal BMI: this appears to suggest the benefits for women at a lower BMI might not be seeing the same health benefits that are found on men at their ideal BMI. (Though anecdotal evidence from these long-running threads may suggest otherwise…)
A BIG THANK YOU to all who have been contributing. Most of us are learning this way of eating as we go along. All of the links above have been posted by others in our previous threads, and they've been very helpful.
A HUGE THANK YOU to Greeneggsandnicht for putting together all this info and resources into one concise OP text, much appreciated by so many 5:2ers!
Come join us, and tell us about your experiences with this way of life!

OP posts:
Peplum41 · 07/01/2014 19:40

A happy scale app? Intrigued.

Just taken the battery out of mine because I was not happy with them.

That will learn em.

BsshBossh · 07/01/2014 19:44

muffins I weigh weekly these days: Friday morning first thing after second FD of the week. At the beginning of my weightloss journey though, last year, I weighed in every month to every few months. No reason why really, just that up to that point I never weighed myself: only when I got weighed at GPs or gym. Probably the reason I slowly, blithely (and contentedly) grew to 15 stones.

ToffeeOwnsTheSausage · 07/01/2014 19:48

peplum41 - it was recommended to me but I can't remember who by Blush. Was a 5:2 er though.

mummytowillow · 07/01/2014 19:56

Hi everyone, I'm loving this WOE I'm just not hungry at all and don't feel deprived! Grin

Just one FD question is 18 hours gap enough ie 6 night before til 12 noon next day? Or should I aim for longer.

muffins · 07/01/2014 19:58

Ooh yes just looked at happy scale app...'it smooths out' fluctuations in weight to predict actual weight or something along those lines, may download it I think

DottiestDoris · 07/01/2014 20:17

Whenshewasbad-my baby is 11 weeks. He's my second so I'm busy trying to run after the first and feed/comfort the second. The tiredness from this plus my extra weight means I'm like you-not much happening with the hubby! He says he doesn't care how I look but then in the next breath, reminiscences about the whippersnapper I was when we met... either way, what's important is how WE feel and if we feel big and unattractive then that's the time to do something about it. I have a stone to lose to be back to pre second pregnancy weight and another half to get back to my slimmest. What about you? Im a bit dismayed at how few calories I'm supposed to consume TDEE. Im adding some for the bf but all the same, a bit of a shock as I had heard you could basically eat what you wanted on NFD.

Peplum41 · 07/01/2014 20:26

Ah dear, dottiestdoris, how many cals is your TDEE? Are you bf? I'm not sure, can bf mums have more on TDEE?

TalkinPeace · 07/01/2014 20:32

mummytowillow
if 18 hours feels good, stick with it. if you are not hungry after 18 go a bit longer
but remember, this is not a competition with anybody else
its a slow discussion with your internal hunger reflexes to re educate them into good habits

Dottiest / Peplum
I'm pretty sure that bigchoc looked it up and BF FD allowance is around the 750 to 1000 range to ensure that you shrink while keeping the baby growing
if you are overweight, staying within normal TDEE on NFDs should not do any harm, but listen to your body
( and don't let your blood pressure crash resulting in faint and major nose rebuilding surgery like I did )

BobPatSamandIgglePiggle · 07/01/2014 20:50

Hi :-)

I'm New to the 5:2, just started to read all your advice tonight but woke up this morning and just though 'bugger it, can't stand being fat anymore'

Just wondering if i've done it right today though (before i read up, realise and pig out, lol)

Had dinner last night at 7.30, no snacks after which is unusual and something i need to work on.

Sip of dh's coffee with milk as i legged it out the door then just water with lemon all day today (i took a boiled egg and cucumber to work but left them in the car so didn't bother)

Dinner tonight at 7.30 was baked chicken breast, veg and a tiny bit if gravy.

Is that about right? Been so busy I've not even noticed.

What now, nothing else tonight then eat normally tomorrow? Will read all the info, just after a quick nod or head shake!

Thanks :-)

mscnile · 07/01/2014 20:55

That sounds ideal bobpatsam, well done!

Toffee, those sound yummy now you mention the caramel taste, might have to try them!

LexingtonBear · 07/01/2014 20:56

BobPat - definite big nod! Sounds like you did brilliantly, and going all day without anything on your first fd is really impressive - well done you! This really is a great way of eating, and I hope you enjoy it as much as so many of the other posters on here do

WhenSheWasBadSheWasExhausted · 07/01/2014 21:21

doris we sound so similar, ds is my second, dd is almost 3. I need to lose 1 stone to get to pre ds weight. I want to lose 1 1/2 stone to get to pre dd weight. That would take me to 10 stone 2, I would like to weigh less but I'm 5"7 and 10 stone would be quite an achievement.

I agree with you, it's how we feel in ourselves that's important. Dh could swear blind he finds me attractive but if I don't feel it myself it doesn't really matter. Mind you last time he saw me naked I was giving birth, I must look better than that now Grin

talikin you fainted and needed surgery Shock poor you. I think I'll stick with 1000 cals for the time being. I like my nose the way it is.

So glad I didn't fast today. Not feeling well plus ds had his injections today and dd has been particularly challenging behaving like a right little madam today.

Going for it tomorrow instead.

BobPatSamandIgglePiggle · 07/01/2014 21:22

Thanks lex and msc it's good to know I'm on the right lines. Missing my night time snacks but the Xmas chocs have gone and i need to stop munching - evenings and travelling home from work snacks are my downfall.

Great to see everyone's success stories!

DottiestDoris · 07/01/2014 21:22

Talkin and Peplum my TDEE came out at 1200. If I weren't allowed extra for bf on NFD then id only be consuming an extra 200 calories on NFDs. That can't be right!

DottiestDoris · 07/01/2014 21:27

Yes, Whenshewasbad, I forgot to commiserate with poor Talkin! What a lesson to learn, poor thing. My ds1 is 2.4. My weight loss plan is exactly like yours, and the targets are identical. Only difference is im 5'9. Im definitely going to keep in touch with your progress if you don't mind as it helps to have the support if somebody in a similar position with similar targets.

BetsyBell · 07/01/2014 21:30

Dottiest There's no way your tdee is 1200 - use this link to check please!
thefastdiet.co.uk/how-many-calories-on-a-non-fast-day/

(Or I can do it for you if you want to divulge your height, weight & age :) )

Breadandwine · 07/01/2014 21:31

Liquid Only Fasts:
Build up to them slowly. I started my LOFs by not eating on a fast day until I felt hungry - and found I just didn't get hungry. But I'd been 5:2ing for getting on for a year to get to this stage. (But many fasters on here got there a lot quicker than that!) If you have something to hand if you get hungry, it's like a safety blanket.

Gradually, it's possible the need to eat will get later and later until you find you don't need to eat - and that is the easiest fast day of all!

4:3 vs 5:2:
On The 52 Fast Diet forum they compared these two variations, and found no difference in weight loss between them.

This forum is a brilliant resource for anyone looking to do IF. There is a terrific science section, for instance. Well worth browsing the whole site, which is full of supportive, helpful people - just as this thread is!

They've been checking many IFer's weightloss for 12 months, now, and the average loss has consistently been - 1lb/week!

Welcome to all the new fasters-as has been said, you've come to the right place!

I'll make a forecast to you guys - within a week or so you'll find yourself reassuring other new fasters! It really is that easy.

And, don't forget, everyone you see on these threads started out just as you did - unsure, doubtful, hoping against hope, and all the rest!

If you're lurking and think that a quarter of your calories is too extreme - that's exactly what I thought, nearly two years ago. So I started by cutting my daily calories in half - and I still lost weight. Once you're happy with that, drop the cals down to 1000 - and then 800.

Gently does it, yes?

Eatriskier · 07/01/2014 21:35

doris where have you calculated that? If you're 5'9 I can't imagine your tdee being that low unless you are already underweight. Have you calculated a figure for weight loss?

Eatriskier · 07/01/2014 21:40

I love tips descriptions. An internal discussion. That's a great way of describing it.

b&w I don't know if you know but I'm too lazy to find out myself... Is the comparison of 5:2 v 4:3 done solely on people who start out doing one or the other and stick to it? I've often wondered if the lack of difference is because people shift to 4:3 when they hit plateaus and if that skews the data somewhat. I'll get off my butt and find out myself if you don't know off hand Wink

OBehaveMaeve · 07/01/2014 21:41

Just putting myself on the roll. Day one of 5:2 ticked off. In bed now. Feeling weak :-p but relieved!

BetsyBell · 07/01/2014 21:43

Dottiest I just had a look on Kellymom (BF site) which suggests that if you're exclusively breastfeeding you need to take in 300-500 extra calories to maintain weight.

kellymom.com/nutrition/mothers-diet/mom-calories-fluids/

So on NFDs you should be adding in extra calories.

BetsyBell · 07/01/2014 21:44

Well done Maeve! Tomorrow's breakfast is going to taste divine!

DottiestDoris · 07/01/2014 21:45

Oh dear, am I being a muppet? I thought it was the calorie target that MFP gives you. You may laugh. I can take it. Im 34, 5ft 9 and 11.8 as of this morning after my first fd! Go on, tell me I can eat more! Smile

TalkinPeace · 07/01/2014 21:45

Eatriskier
I've been watching a load of new threads on the Weight Loss board of ladies with major targets and trying to think of ways to

  • explain to them why I'm on their threads
  • help them stay 'on the wagon' more than their usual few weeks
its good for my thought process because as somebody said on Betseys thread, 5:2 posts can get a tad competitive without us meaning to
BigChocFrenzy · 07/01/2014 21:46

BFers should definitely start with 1000 cals on FDs. This figure comes from Dr Varady, who has done far more human trials on IF than anyone else.

After you get used to 1000, you may feel able to drop gradually towards 750 (some 5:2ers have done this), but do NOT rush or force this. You may wish to remain at 1000, which is fine. Your milk supply is so important, it is better to lose weight a bit more slowly.

TDEE Please remember everybody when calculating this for FDs to select for "no weight loss", because you lose weight via your 2 FDs.
5:2 won't work properly if you have a large weekly deficit on your NFDs as well.

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