The 5:2 thread number 28 - Come and join us! The threads may be getting on a bit but the new starters keep us young and fresh!

[BetsyBell]

The continuing thread for those of us following the 5:2 fast or other forms of fasting such as 4:3, ADF, or daily 16:8.

The 5:2 diet was featured on Horizon in August 2012 and essentially requires you to fast for 2 non-consecutive days per week. The other 5 days, you can eat normally - or approximately your Total Daily Energy Expenditure (TDEE - see explanation below). 4:3 is the same except you fast on 3 days in the week. Alternate-day fasting (ADF) is just how it sounds; you fast every other day. 16:8 is another form where you stick to only eating in an 8 hour window each day, therefore fasting for 16 hours each day.

By "fasting", we mean that we keep our calorie consumption very low, around 500 calories on average for a woman, 600 for a man, on those days.

You'll find on these threads we use a number of acronyms. If you're new to the threads, or Mumsnet in general, they might not make much sense.

WOE/WOL = Way Of Eating/Way Of Life. We use this term instead of "diet" as many of us see this as something to do in the long term.

MFP = My Fitness Pal, a website many use for keeping track of the number of calories they're eating.

TDEE = Total Daily Energy Expenditure, quantifies the number of calories you burn in a day. This measure is best estimated by scaling your Basal Metabolic Rate to your level of activity. TDEE is critical in tailoring your nutrition plan to desired fitness goals. Here is a link to a calculator to help you figure out how many calories you should be eating in a day.

NFD = Non fast day

NSV = Non scale victory

Michael Mosley has a website to accompany his book on the subject. Please go check it out, as he's the whole reason these threads started!

Lurkers and new starters: please just jump in and post - you'll find a lot of support here and we’re a friendly bunch.

Here is a list of links to get you started with this way of eating. Please let us know if you find a new article or some other information online:

Our previous threads can be found by browsing through the fasting section of the site.

Another thread which breadandwine has started is a good resource for some of the tips and links that get lost in these big threads. In addition to sharing links, we try to condense some of our top tips for fasting there. Keep in mind, we all do this differently, so these are just tips, not rules. This might be a good place to catch up with us if you're feeling a bit lost!

frenchfancy has a recipe thread over here, please post any low-calorie recipes there so they don't get lost in these bigger threads!

If you've been at this a while and are moving on to maintaining your goal weight, there is a thread here to discuss that.

Here is the link to the BBC article regarding Michael Mosley's findings, which was featured on Horizon.

There's a link to the aforementioned Horizon programme here.

A blog post here gives some of the scientific explanation for why this way of eating helps you to not only lose weight, but improve your all-around health.

A Telegraph article which comments on the diet and gives a brief overview by Dr Mosley himself, very informative if you're just starting. (I highly recommend this for an overview)

A study discussed here gives commentary specifically addressing the effect of this diet on obese people (both men and women), with regard to both health and weight loss. ("After 8 weeks of treatment, participants had an average 12.5 lbs reduction in body weight and a 4 cm decrease in waist circumference. Total fat mass declined by about 12 lbs while lean body mass remained relatively constant.) it also mentions "Plasma adiponectin, a protein hormone that is elevated in obesity and associated with heart disease, dropped by 30%. As did LDL cholesterol (25%) and triglycerides (32%).")

Something to consider if you are currently your ideal BMI: this appears to suggest the benefits for women at a lower BMI might not be seeing the same health benefits that are found on men at their ideal BMI.

A BIG THANK YOU to all who have been contributing. Most of us are learning this way of eating as we go along. All of the links above have been posted by others in our previous threads, and they've been very helpful.

A HUGE THANK YOU to Greeneggsandnicht for putting together all this info and resources into one concise OP text, much appreciated by so many 5:2ers!

Come join us, and tell us about your experiences with this diet!

Okey dokey, pelvic floor exercise number two
Either in downward dog or on hands and knees, breathe as slowly as you can a few times to steady the heart rate.
Then breathe all the way out and with empty lungs, pull your tummy button towards your back as hard as you can.
That should lift the whole of your pelvic floor right through to your bum (works for men as well)
Hold for a count of four, then release, breathe, and repeat the whole thing a couple more times.

at eatriskier's dh not getting to the kitchen in time before it closed!

Doesn't a pelvic bridge with clenched buttocks tighten the pelvic floor as well?

Do boots still do the pelvic floor exerciser?

Helles
I will not be able to go through life without ever being tired so I need to find some way to cope without using sugar to keep going.
Caffeine is your friend.
That and improving your sleep : remove all electronics from your bedroom, only read in bed, make sure it gets dark enough, make sure it gets quiet enough, make sure it gets cool enough in the middle of the night. If you and DH are keeping each other awake (I'm a snorer so I know) make use of the spare room so that you both are rested.

Lol TIP Caffeine is your friend
I have been caffeine-free for years because it makes me feel or even be sick.

remove all electronics from your bedroom, etc
The only things keeping me awake are hormones. Happens every month

Hmmm. I'd keel over without caffeine. OK, another tack, have you tried breath control exercises at the end of the day to click your melatonin clock?

cuckoo that's rotten luck & embarassing / very inconvenient of course. Probably just something that will correct itself in time, but do visit your GP rather than trying DIY repairs.
I heard from the lifting community that we females do have a very small risk of prolapse if lifting too heavy a weight (pushups in your case ?) . This risk increases for those who have given birth / are over 40 yrs, but remains small.

Not entirely sure. I do have a bed time routine which allows my breathing to slow. Is that what you mean?

Good FD finished with 270 cals. My evening fasted spin went well - I had loads of strength & energy, so ramped up the resistance.

I expect most know the tip to help release the fat reserve: a double espresso ( no sugar) 15 mins before training.

Whatever tricks we try, the body is very miserly with the fat reserve, so won't release it as quickly as we need for training. This is why one runs out of energy, long before the damn fat cushion is burnt.

Helles Are you eating sufficient of the good quality low-sugar carbs, e.g. quinoa, brown rice, buckwheat ? I know when dieting trying to lose weight one thinks of reducing starchy carbs, but we all need different amounts for good energy, health, mood etc.

I expect you manage several portions of different veg too on NFDs. Do you take a multi-vitamin & mineral and a B-complex ?

Hi everyone,

So I've decided to start fasting this Thursday for the first time ever I really hope it goes well.

I picked up my hula hoop today and wow it seemed much harder then I remember. Maybe because there is more fat now?

How often do You all weigh yourself? I remember someone saying hide the scales for the first three weeks? As I know if I'm not loosing weight I will be disheartened

Hi rubbish Excellent, go for it !

Be prepared for a few attempts until you manage 500 FDs. For my first 52 round in Spring I was usually 750+, but that's fine to start. Funnily after a few months maintenance without FDs, they are quite easy now. Give yourself time to adjust and you can do this.

Best of luck !

Hi rubbish. Thursday is, like Monday, a popular fasting day so you'll be in good, supportive company. If you know you'll be derailed by no change on the scales then I suggest taking your start weight and measuring your vital stats (waist at navel, waist at narrowest point, hips, boobs, upper arms, thighs etc) then putting your scales and tape measure away for a few weeks.

I weigh each week (the morning after my second FD) these days but last year when I began losing weight I only weighed monthly, sometimes every three months. Certainly it took the stress out of weightloss for me (very useful when I plateaued for several months!).

((((((((Ladies))))))))) a.k.a The 5:2 gynae consulting team

Thank you ALL so much for your advice, kind words and back pats. I am going to get started on wee squeezing and downward dog first thing. Am actually squeezing as type. Will give my pelvic updates weekly along with weigh in results. Lol at some of your comments!

Lol at MissStrawb farleys rusk

and Lol at Wrigglebum jumping jacks farts

I prob was a bit over enthusiastic with them as I do tend to launch myself into things at 100mph! Your fault - you lot and your Jillian gushing! I just wanted to know what it was like to get shredded.

Helles you poor thing. I look like a junkie week before due and (also have noticed week before a cold too) and struggle so much to get through each day, so can only imagine your pain. Cold sores and ulcers does sound as though you are very run down, so perhaps you should take a trip to G.P.
Forget 5:2 and get yourself sorted first, as each one will no doubt make the other feel worse, and no point pro longing your misery. Don't binge crap though all the time as will make feel worse in long run, get some stodgy comfort food in you and plenty of rest when can.

- Please help selves to appropriate gift.

Made it.

506. Exhausted, bloody freezing and slightly grumpy.

Had the best slice of 400g wholemeal loaf with Marmite on at 4 though. Nothing I've eaten for a long time has tasted as good as that slice of toast!

I'm going to bed now, thinking of all the lovely recipes (love mushrooms and cauliflower) and convincing myself that 3 kids, DP, the cats and a dog don't need a guinea pig to keep them company.

Cuckoo that is an actual thing you can get from exercise, I think it's from bouncing a lot (running trampoline etc) GP tomorrow, or maybe the practice nurse?

See you tomorrow guys

Jumping jacks are also good if you haven't pooed for a few days. Thirty jumping jacks have me belting up the stairs.

Re carbs. Wholemeal toast with morning egg, wholemeal cous-cous some lunchtimes - beans or lentils on others, potato and vegetable mash on evenings is a fave. Defo carbing. Take vit d during the dark half of the year and zinc every day. Get my five a day (various colours) mostly on veg.

It really is just hormones. The gp says I can have sleeping pills (no thanks) and I have a hormonal implant to try and level things off. Roll on the menopause!!

Bigchoc - did you still loose weight when you ended up at 750 cals?

Bssh - was your weightloss very slow then? How much did you loose on average per week?

rubbish no my weighloss wasn't particularly slow but I'd never been a weigher so weekly weigh-ins didn't come naturally to me. Also, I'd never been a dieter as such until last year and didn't want to become obsessed by the scales. When I plateaued I didn't actually know I'd plateaued until after a few months! So I blithely kept doing as I was doing (which was my normal weightloss diet back then of daily calorie restriction), weighed in, got a shock at still being same weight but carried on as usual and lo and behold a few weeks later I started losing again. Anyway, that's a very long winded way of saying: don't weigh often if you don't want to but be consistent and patient with weightloss.

Rubbish Yes, with 750 FDS I lost 10 lb in 12 weeks in spring. Any reasonable attempt at FDs will bring you health and weight benefits. I maintained the lower weight easily.

YMMV (Your Mileage May Vary): you may lose more quickly if you are younger than I am, or have a BMI > 25, or if you are not as greedy on NFDs as I am .

rubbish anecdotally the average loss for 5:2 seems to be 1 lb a week so it's not a quick way to lose but it is a healthy and sustainable way to lose.

Well done kickass . Also, you've motivated me to buy some Marmite after umpteen years - thanks !
All FDers today: enjoy a luxurious NFD Tuesday.

Oh no I just worked out my bmi is 27.1

PS kickass the cats and dog might appreciate guinea pig on toast - their version of marmite ?