The 5:2 Diet Thread number 19! Cup of tea? or three?

[GreenEggsAndNichts]

The continuing thread for those of us following either the 5:2 diet or the alternate-day fasting diet.

The 5:2 diet was featured on Horizon in August 2012, and essentially requires you to fast for 2 non-consecutive days per week. The other 5 days, you can eat what you like, or approximately your TDEE (see explanation below). Alternate-day fasting is just how it sounds; you fast every other day. By "fasting", we mean that we keep our calorie consumption very low, around 500 calories on average for a woman, 600 for a man, on those days.

You'll find on these threads we use a number of acronyms. If you're new to the threads, or Mumsnet in general, they might not make much sense.

WOE/WOL = Way Of Eating/Way Of Life. We use this term instead of "diet" as many of us see this as something to do in the long term.

MFP = My Fitness Pal, a website many use for keeping track of the number of calories they're eating.

TDEE = Total Daily Energy Expenditure, quantifies the number of calories you burn in a day. This measure is best estimated by scaling your Basal Metabolic Rate to your level of activity. TDEE is critical in tailoring your nutrition plan to desired fitness goals. Here is a link to a calculator to help you figure out how many calories you should be eating in a day.

ADF = Alternate-day Fasting, as it says on the tin, fasting every other day rather than 5:2.

Michael Mosley has a website to accompany his new book on the subject. Please go check them out, as he's the whole reason most of us are here!

I know a number of people lurk on this thread, as this is currently quite popular. Please just jump in and post if you're new- you'll find a lot of support here.

Here is a list of links to get you started with this way of eating. Please let us know if you find a new article or some other information online:

First things first, here are links to some of our previous threads: most recent one before that another one!

Another thread which breadandwine has started is a good resource for some of the links and tips that get lost in these big threads. In addition to sharing links, we try to condense some of our top tips for fasting there. Keep in mind, we all do this differently, so these are just tips, not rules. This might be a good place to catch up with us if you're feeling a bit lost!

frenchfancy has a recipe thread over here, please post any low-calorie recipes there so they don't get lost in these bigger threads!

If you've been at this a while and are moving on to maintaining your goal weight, there is a thread here to discuss that.

Here is the link to the BBC article regarding Michael Mosley's findings, which was featured on Horizon.

There's a link to the aforementioned Horizon programme here.

A blog post here gives some of the scientific explanation for why this way of eating helps you to not only lose weight, but improve your all-around health.

A Telegraph article which comments on the diet and gives a brief overview by Dr Mosley himself, very informative if you're just starting. (I highly recommend this for an overview)

A study discussed here gives commentary specifically addressing the effect of this diet on obese people (both men and women), with regard to both health and weight loss. ("After 8 weeks of treatment, participants had an average 12.5 lbs reduction in body weight and a 4 cm decrease in waist circumference. Total fat mass declined by about 12 lbs while lean body mass remained relatively constant.) it also mentions "Plasma adiponectin, a protein hormone that is elevated in obesity and associated with heart disease, dropped by 30%. As did LDL cholesterol (25%) and triglycerides (32%).")

Something to consider if you are currently your ideal BMI: this appears to suggest the benefits for women at a lower BMI might not be seeing the same health benefits that are found on men at their ideal BMI.

A BIG THANK YOU to all who have been contributing, btw. Most of us are learning this way of eating as we go along. All of the links above have been posted by others in our previous threads, and they've been very helpful. Sorry if I haven't given credit where it's due, but it was just enough of a job getting all the links re-copied and back into one post.

Come join us, and tell us about your experiences with this diet!

Well new low today after fasting yesterday, down to 10.1.5, starting weight was 10.10, have done 8 fasts. Had a weekend full of eating crap and snacking too, so feeling good! Craving carbs today though, so probably all back on tomorrow.

Hi guys thanks for advice.

still new to this diet and intrigued by scence as

science says under eating means body conserves fat.

I havent manged a day on 500 yet been around 700-800 so wondered if 4,3 with slightly more calories would work as well to compensate for extra calories eaten on fast days?

or is 700-800 just too much on fast days.

as healthy advice says dont go below 1200cals a day.

I been really down about weight lately.
I know I need more willpower.

used to do sw lost weight at fisrt but not towards the end.

reading about people doing consecutive fasts and zero cals sounds bit extreme for me.Guess we all have to find the right diet for our lifestyles.

I had crappy week so far hence why think found it hard.
need to do a food shop.

will be having normal non fast day tommorow.

mam sorry you're feeling down about food and weight. It can be hard to feel positive at times.
I can only share my own limited knowledge and experience.

The maximum calories for a fasting day for a woman is 500.
I find it easiest to have my calories in the early evening (we eat supper with 2yo ds at around 5pm). Because:
If I have breakfast or lunch the hunger starts.
It gives me some room to play with. I can have my soup and an apple and a yogurt and still come in

Welcome to all newbies, wow, there's so many of you!
Today I was going to have as a fast day but got to lunchtime and just decided "sod it, I'm hungry so I'm going to have lunch". It doesn't matter in the slightest as both tonight and tomorrow's nights dinners are 500 cal friendly so can switch it about as I please.
One of the great things about this woe is the flexibility. Love it!

Hi mam I suppose if you did 3 days 700-800 and 4 days TDEE then you would have a calorie deficit of around 3500ish depending on your TDEE so you would still lose around 1lb a week. But I'm not sure that you would get the fasting benefits.

If you are interested in getting the helth benefits from fasting as well as weight loss then you can always start that way and work your way down to 500 cals or increase your fasting window.

bohoec, MFP will shock you. I'm amazed at how much more than 2000 cals I could put away if I carry on like I have been doing, especially when I though 'oh, I've messed up now. Will have to start again on Monday.'

Mam, I really found that going the first 24hrs with zero cals helped. I think of I'd have given in earlier in the day I would've eaten too much.

mam 700 cals is a really good start. One of the old timers B&W started on 1000 cals on fast days and kept it up for several months before dropping down.

For the health benefits try and maximise the number of hours between eating. 24hours is the ideal but there are good benefits even after 16 hours.

Thanks guys think with me I need to work down to 500cals.

Think I can do it but thought 800 not totally end of world.

as some diets its like come off plan im doomed may as well stuff my face for rest of day.

still unsure how people dont overcompensate on non fast days and go bit mad therefore reducing weekly defecit.

I had high cal lunch today 400cals.was cheese and tomato salad sandwich on small loaf bread 87cals per slice.

have had 3coffees 100cals
lots of water whcih need to keep up as dont drink enough..

Will do another soup later and still be over but hopefully even out throughout the week

frenchfancy did she still lose weight on 1000cals?

will aim for 16hour gap at least twice this week.tommorow being normal day.

can then resume thur and friday as have hectic weekend.

im sure over time get easier.

i havent felt as hungry wanting everything in sight yesterday or today.

have meeting this evening so that ties me up distracted.

proably have to walk 2miles this afternoon for school run.

I know im a snacker out habit/boredom.
most of time my meal choices quite good.

havent even weighed mysel at start as scales broke.
hope to make it boots tommorow.
need to measure myself.

emilythorne loe your name by way-revenege fan?

thats fab weightloss.

dotty this diet appeals as is bit more flexible and non restricting.

Thank you for telling me what you have all lost! It spurs me on and I will def start my first fast day on Monday. I just needed to know that it was actually going to work before I embarked.
I have fasted before (am a Christian) so I am hoping this wont be too tricky, although I've never done it rsgularly. So looking forward to getting back to my original size.

Fasting today, second one this week... Think I'm going to do 4:3 again this week, not because of losing more weight (although I need to!) but Because, for some reason im finding nfd a bit more of a struggle again. Not sure why as I've been doing this for 3 months but suddenly I'm craving crisp, chocolate, cake and chips! So this way at least I can give myself a little leeway if I give into temptation. Saying that though if I binge nowadays at the most ill be 400 cals over tdee whereas pre 5:2 I reckon I'd be nearer 1000cals over if not more as I just didn't seem to have a stop button. Now it seems I have found my stop button

Has anyone found they are losing weight from places differently than before? I fit into a pair of tight trousers that previously only fit when I was 9Ib lighter than today, and if I Remembering correctly they didn't fit well then but they seem to now! Bit confusing really?...

Hi NoFork, I'm in the same boat, need to lose 3 - 3.5. Already lost 10lb in 3 weeks despite loads of cake inbetween. You will be fine .

I'm doing ADF (one day on, one day off) as I'm less likely to sabotage it by 'forgetting'.

twinmama I'm going a bit mad on my NFDs too. I think it's because I've been doing this since Feb, losses have been very slow and steady and I'm now comfortably fitting back into my clothes and feeling happy with myself again.
Healthwise I could do with shifting another 3-4lbs but I think my sense of urgency has waned somewhat and I'm getting a bit "comfortable" and therefore reverting to some old bad habits.
It's always this phase of any woe that I find tricky, getting past my "I look and feel ok" phase and moving on to actually looking properly slim!

Still hanging in there, somehow. Feeling so hungry today though, so much so I keep thinking of giving up. I have been trying to keep busy but it's hard, mind keeps coming back to food and my tummy rumbles.

Am seriously doubting whether I'll make the full 36 hours or whether I should have a 500 cal meal this evening.

dotty I know what you mean, for me it's the dreaded complacency that gets me everytime, I lose a bit then reeeeelaaaaax. Although its not as bad this time I'm still doing it, I guess after years of behaving a certain way it will take awhile to reset bad habits. Still at least this woe is easy to continue long term unlike others, so at least slips can be rectified fairly painlessly!

mam don't kick yourself for going above 500. All that nay happen is you might lose a little less quickly than you may if you hit 500. Or the pure shock of dropping those calories may mean you lose well anyway. On my first day I had no clue about what contained how many calories so waited until dinner and had a load of ham and some chicken broth. I figured out mfp and now plan in advance what ill eat. Was so relieved I could have 3 meals still. And then worked my way back to just having broth at night.

Hi BsshBossh She has not lost weight since she started - 5'6'' and about 8st 9 so obviously doesn't need to !

She does the standard 2 days at approx 500calories eating only once a day and the rest of the week eats 2 or 3 good meals a day, rarely eating between meals ( Tip would love her!). She doesn't calorie count at all and packed away a hearty breakfast at 5am.

She wants the long breaks between eating as in our line of work it's the dementia links which are the main motivation.

Congratulations on your success by the way

30 day squat challenge. Day 3 done

Thanks mehefin. Your colleague is quite inspirational. Dementia is one of the benefits that keeps me going with fasting even though I'm at goal weight. Direct her over here to Mumsnet . She doesn't need to be a parent.

afternoon

i think conflating people fasting with EDs does a disservice to both eating disorders and fasters tbh. they are vastly different. someone who is going to get an eating disorder can yes be triggered by weight loss programmes - that is true for calorie restriction of any kind and i don't see how it is more true for fasting than any other. yes they could say oh i'll do another fast another equally they could say oh i'll cut down to 1200, now 1000 now 800 a day.

eating disorders are a condition not solely about, and in some cases barely at all about, food and weight and there need to be more factors at work than, 'i went on a diet'.

those of us doing zero fasts can realistically get enough hassle and negativity in real life without it coming onto the threads iyswim. fasting is obviously not suitable for people with eating disorders and when we've had someone on the threads who did appear to have an eating disorder several of us were quite vocal about that and encouraged her to address it and get help rather than continue.

the idea that a healthy adult in good mental health choosing to fast for a day is somehow dangerous is erroneous. i'd also question whether the 'saints' who fasted had eating disorders. there is a long tradition of fasting in spiritual contexts that can't just be written off as undiagnosed eating disorders.

i have done some zero fasts - i don't have an eating disorder.

am finally managing a fast today so far after not doing one for ages. agree with whoever said it gets harder when you look 'ok' and feel ok and can slip into complacency.

mam, you're doing fine :) Work your way down to 500 calorie fasts but don't think about going beyond 5:2 for now. You'll be surprised at how effective 5:2 can be - as long as you're moderate on non fast days. If you try to do more feeling the way you are I think you're setting yourself up to fail and I suspect what you need right now is to feel positive about you and your eating. It might take a bit of time to get into the swing of things but you are taking a fantastically positive step towards a new way of life and you'll be feeling more healthy and positive in no time at all.

Keep posting here, we'll get you there

Last month I was busting out of my size 18s and fitting quite comfortably into 20s, which as someone who used to be an 8 was really downheartening. So I started 5:2.

I don't know what possessed me, I really don't but I've just randomly gone upstairs and tried on my 'inspirational' size 16s. I only fit in them! And not in a breathe in way. And not just in one pair. Complete and massive .

saf maybe that's the time to reread some of the non weight related health benefits for added motivation

Yes mam big Revenge fan.
You're doing well BTW. As others have pointed out, many ppl start above 500 cals and gradually reduce this. The thing that attracted me to this WOE, aside from the health aspects, was its flexibility and do- ability. So if it becomes unsustainable it's no longer attractive.
IYSWIM.

well done eagle - that's great

yeah mehefin good idea. sadly i forgot the shopping was coming today and i've just put it all away and suddenly i'm ravenous and about to eat. i had mentally quit the second i realised who was at the door.

i'm so not in the right headspace at the minute! any excuse.