5:2 Diet Thread! Number 9, welcoming the new year...

[GreenEggsAndNichts]

The continuing thread for those of us following either the 5:2 diet or the alternate-day fasting diet. Both are two versions of Intermittent Fasting, which you can read more about here.

The 5:2 diet was featured on Horizon in August 2012, and essentially requires you to fast for 2 non-consecutive days per week. The other 5 days, you can eat what you like. Alternate-day fasting is just how it sounds; you fast every other day. By "fasting", we mean that we keep our calorie consumption very low, around 500 calories on average, on those days.

I know a number of people lurk on this thread, as this is currently quite popular. Please just jump in and post if you're new- we won't bite. Well, maybe on a fast day. You'll find a lot of support here.

Here is a list of links to get you started with this way of eating. Please let us know if you find a new article or some other information online:

First things first, here are links to some of our previous threads: most recent one before that another one etc!

Another thread which breadandwine has started is a good resource for some of the links and tips that get lost in these big threads. In addition to sharing links, we try to condense some of our top tips for fasting there. Keep in mind, we all do this differently, so these are just tips, not rules. This might be a good place to catch up with us if you're feeling a bit lost!

frenchfancy has a recipe thread over here, please post any low-calorie recipes there so they don't get lost in these bigger threads!

Here is the link to the BBC article regarding Michael Mosley's findings, which was featured on Horizon.

B&W has found a new link to the aforementioned Horizon programme here. If you're keen to see it, watch it soon, because BBC has been quick to find these copies and shut them down online. We're hoping they'll re-play it again soon. I know these threads are popular, maybe they'll read my request.

A blog post here gives some of the scientific explanation for why this way of eating helps you to not only lose weight, but improve your all-around health.

A Telegraph article which comments on the diet and gives a brief overview.

A study discussed here gives commentary specifically addressing the effect of this diet on obese people (both men and women), with regard to both health and weight loss. ("After 8 weeks of treatment, participants had an average 12.5 lbs reduction in body weight and a 4 cm decrease in waist circumference. Total fat mass declined by about 12 lbs while lean body mass remained relatively constant.) it also mentions "Plasma adiponectin, a protein hormone that is elevated in obesity and associated with heart disease, dropped by 30%. As did LDL cholesterol (25%) and triglycerides (32%).")

Important link if you are currently your ideal BMI: this appears to suggest the benefits for women at a lower BMI might not be seeing the same health benefits that are found on men at their ideal BMI.

And for those already fasting, here is a link to 100 snacks under 100 calories. We tend to favour lots of hot drinks during the day (count your milk if you use it!)

Another food link, here is a link to the BBC Good Food site, with a list of low-calorie soups.

We mentioned BMR and TDEE often. Total Daily Energy Expenditure (TDEE) quantifies the number of calories you burn in a day. This measure is best estimated by scaling your Basal Metabolic Rate to your level of activity. TDEE is critical in tailoring your nutrition plan to desired fitness goals. Here is a link to a calculator to help you figure out how many calories you should be eating in a day. (This is a new calculator to previous threads, this one seems to give me approximately the same results the last one did, but without the virus warnings on my browser!)

A BIG THANK YOU to all who have been contributing, btw. Most of us are learning this way of eating as we go along. All of the links above have been posted by others in our previous threads, and they've been very helpful. Sorry if I haven't given credit where it's due, but it was just enough of a job getting all the links re-copied and back into one post.

Come join us, and tell us about your experiences with this diet!

matilda
If you are still having trouble getting off diet coke (even after reading B&W's link) try doing it slowly by cutting it down each week. Restrict yourself for a while then drop it down again until you no longer need it. I expect this sounds obvious but this is what I did years ago as I too was addicted to D.C. To the point where I was carrying a can around the house with me all the time

Breadandwine I'm about half way through the film so far and it's very interesting. Thank you for letting me know about it. Yes, it is helping to put me off drinking diet coke. Also scary how aspartamine (how do you spell it?!!) is in so many things. I drink options hot chocolate and it's in that too.

filly I guess that maybe I'm chicken but I know I would get so down watching my weight go up, so I always weigh myself every Monday morning. My first fast day is Sunday so psychologically the next morning is good for my brain, then I fast again on Thursday.
Each Monday my weight has either gone down (mostly) or stayed the same (occasionally) so I never ever get to see any increase

virginposter Now that is a diet coke addiction if you were carrying a can around with you all the time! How much were you drinking and did you have any side effects stopping? Can you tell me all the positives for stopping drinking it please - any difference in energy levels, weight loss? (It all helps!)

Hi everybody. I don't post often but I have been following the thread. I'm having a bit of a difficult day today. Not with the WOE - that is going great! But my husband said today that he wants me to stop fasting. We are going to TTC from next month and obviously I have no intention of fasting while I am pregnant or there is a possibility that I might be. But I really objected to the way he implied I am losing weight irresponsibly and might be deficient in nutrients!

For what it is worth I eat mainly soup on fasting days to keep my veg intake up, and a reasonable balanced diet on eating days. So I think that my overall intake of nutrients is likely to be fine. I have been taking prenatal vitamin supplements since last October too.

I have gone from a BMI in the overweight category (27.75) to normal (22.8) on this WOE and I am so pleased with myself. Surely starting pregnancy a healthy weight is also really important?

Sorry for the rant, just feeling a bit down about this.

Fily lots of us weigh every day - it's not a problem, the fluctuations don't magically disappear on the 7th day of a weekly weigh in, you can still get an odd result whatever day you weigh in, mostly due to fluid retention and you never know which day your body is holding fluid. Around my totm i gain up to 4lbs of water. The key is to know that the body can hold onto quite a bit of water for many reasons. If you have stuck to the diet then have faith.

Noting your daily weigh ins can help too because you very quickly begin to see a pattern, as long as the general movement is downwards you're losing fat or winning the battle of the bulge!

matilda sorry it was back in the 90?s, after I returned from USA where I lived for 2 years and became addicted then, so it's hard to remember all the details of how I felt but I did it and haven't touched a drop since then as I now know it to be evil. There are a lot of links on these threads which lead to info on how bad it is for you, it's just a question of finding them.
I expect you will feel so much better and your body will begin to work properly after you stop poisoning (hope that's not too strong a word) it. But you may feel a bit off for a while especially as you are doing 5:2 too which sometimes makes some people feel a little 'off' at first, hence my suggestions to wean yourself off it slowly. Hope this helps.

Thanks virginposter it does help. I am really going to try to cut down and one day (hopefully soon) stop altogether. I've had one can this morning and that's it so far today. It is very addictive and some days I've even had more than 3 cans and I'm concerned that over the years I've been drinking more and more. Poisoning isn't too strong a word for it!

Souper I'm in a similar position re: TTC soon. I agree, surely you're better off starting a pregnancy at a lower weight!

I do take a multivitamin as well as a Vit D + calcium supplement. I think at the very least the vitamin D supplement is important, many of us are avoiding dairy on our fast days and unless we're making it up with other calcium-rich foods, we probably aren't getting enough. (And I'm sure not getting any D this winter with the lack of sun!)

I think it depends on how he said it. I understand the annoyance; I dislike being "told" to do anything. In your case, it depends on his approach, I think!

And good for you for losing that weight!

greeneggs thanks for replying. Yes, as you say, it was how he said it. Because I was basically agreeing with him, I have no intentions of continuing to fast after, say, next week. I suppose it is because this WOE is 'new' and not studied. I doubt anyone would blink twice if I had been doing WW or SW prior to conception. Argh!

coming on for inspiration - am having a proper fast day today, which I usually do at work but am snowed in at home (office closed) and my dds have just made themselves a large meal of sausage, mash, onions and yorkshire pudding .

I need this fast day to get me back on track before the weekend so can't cave in now... will now brave the kitchen and get a herbal tea!

I think there will be a lot of people for a fair while who will think this WOE is unhealthy. Unlike eating plentiful healthy(ish) home cooked meals and snacks through the day which have left me obese!

They are only looking out for our well being...in their own way.

I'm hoping to get to target weight and the TTC soon after. And hopefully will have learnt better eating habits generally to keep in a healthy weight throughout pregnancy.

Catsrus- i won't cave in if u wont. Mama- agree, such a mantra around must have breakfast, good to eat 6x a day etc etc. well, no actually!

Hello to you all!

Please be gentle with me, I am a de lurker that now feels she knows you all ....I've been following you all since thread 6 (which feels like only a few days with the speed this thread goes)!

To give you a bit of background, this is my 3rd week of 5:2, and as of this morning ( although it was a fast day yesterday!) I have lost 3lbs of my total 22 pounds to lose. I started at 11 stone 8 and want to get to 10 stone (I'm 5 feet 6 and slightly over my BMI)

I wanted to get your thoughts on how you cope with feed days? Strange question I know, but since I started I have had no problem with fast days at all. i leave my 500 cals for an evening meal now and I'm lucky I guess, but I did work up to it...first week leaving breakfast out until 12, second week leaving it until 1.30 and this week not bothering with lunch at all. I've never had any problems and only get hunger pangs around 10.30 and 3.30 which are easily sorted with a peppermint or ginger tea. I don't drink tea or coffee and haven't had a soda drink in years, so withdrawal from caffeine or sugar hasn't been a problem.

However......by the time a feed day rolls round, well....put it this way, I am sitting here now with glass of red, having finished off a box of cheese straws earlier and almost half a flake celebration cake that was left over from Xmas!! I just can't seem to stop eating, when on my fast days I have so much self control!

Now I know this is just undoing everything. My TDEe is 1700, so I know that my calorie deficit has to take this into account as well and I can't just let myself go, but does anyone have any advice for me? I guess I'm an all or nothing gal!

Thank you for all your support whilst I have been stalking you all....some great advice and inspiring stories on here! I hope I can contribute in time.

Oops....what I mean is I leave breakfast out totally and had lunch a later and later times until this week when I haven't had it at all!!
Sorry for confusion!

I didn't cave in Salbertina I didn't even pick at the bits of cheese on the discarded grater in case it gave me the taste for it - I moved their debris into the sink and added soapy water to the pan that had the remnants of mashed potato in it. .

A mug of orange and coconut herbal tea with a half teaspoon of honey to make it feel like a treat has done the trick. As I don't really have a sweet tooth this won't set me off at all - the bits of cheese might have! If I last 'till 6pm then I will have done 22 hrs on liquid only. I've got through the weak moment and am feeling fine - not hungry at all now. weird isn't it?

Well done for de-lurking betterlate - now, sit down and tell us what your triggers are. Clearly you can fast but you need to get the other days under control. If it were me (which it's not, I know) I would increase the fast days as much as you can - definitely to 4:3 if you can't manage alternate days. The more you fast the better you get at listening to your body and what it really needs rather than what your mouth would like to taste. I love my red but do find it lowers my self-control re eating - particularly, for me, savoury food not sweet. That cake would not be tempting (unless I was very drunk ) but the cheese straws would be all gone once I'd had one after a glass of wine.

If you did 4:3 could you limit the wine drastically to just one day? (NOT suggesting binge drinking here!) or maybe 2?

It's early days yet and 3 lb is a good loss in 3 weeks if you are doing 5:2 and eating that much on non-fast days - just think what you might lose if you kept to your TDEE for at least 2 of those non-fast days! On the plus side you are getting the health benefits from fasting so at the very least just stick with 5:2 and see how it goes.

Thanks Catsrus! (Sorry, don't know how to 'bold' you on an iPad!). Some sage advice there. Tbh, I was thinking of going to 4:3 next week and seeing how I go. I did wonder if a lot of it might be psychological in that I have found a WOE that means I can 'eat what I want, when I want' on feed days. Of course that isn't what it actually means, but try telling my head that! I think I will definitely go with the 4:3 and hopefully my head will catch up with my stomach's actual signals at some point in the future...3 weeks in is a short period of what (I'm hoping) will become a WOL, so I have to be patient with myself.
As for my triggers...well funnily enough, I don't drink alcohol generally during the week. My last drink before the glass I'm having now was last Saturday, and I am usually a savoury girl, but it was my OHs 40th last week and his big party on Saturday, (hence the alcohol), so lots of sweet, picky things in the house...which me being me...justifies eating them due to said fast day yesterday! :)

Welcome Betterlatethan and glad to see your initial success. I get similar problems with the 'normal' days probably down to my total lack of willpower and seemingly having no 'off' switch. I find the only way round it for me is to avoid having things like crisps or cheese or biscuits in the house.

Laska, was going to bite the bullit today and buy 'Franks extra hot' but they only had the original type....but I will take it on sooner rather than later

Ezzza yeah toast is a real problem for me too, can't take my own advice though and not buy the bread in the first place...keep telling myself it's good for me. Bordercollie, mentioned up thread about grains and how in effect for some people they switch the hunger switch on, definiately seems to apply in my case...but doesn't stop me from buying it

Catsrus, hope you get thru it, remember temptation comes in waves and does fade AND more importantly how great food will taste tomorrow WHEN you get through tonight

By the way Catsrus, I notice you are having a wobble on your fast day today...have you tried sparkling mineral water? I notice someone else said it recently, but did you know that fizzy water is what all the pro-cyclists use when they need to loose weight for a race as it literally fills your stomach up? I've just finished reading a book by one of Lance Armstrongs teammates, and he mentions it! It might help you...
Hope you managed the herbal tea...I can recommend the lemon and ginger that twinnings do! :)

The cyclistist.....I am hoping that all the food from our party will be gone in a few days, and I promise they won't return! But you are right....it's temptation that is the problem, which is strange when I can literally turn my nose up at it all on a fast day ( well...maybe after a quick sniff! ;))

yeah that's why this WOL works so well for me. The 'desire' to eat is so much less on a fast day. Bad habits I know, but it's just the way I am

Matilda - i haven't cracked it completely (tbh, haven't really tried to) but I brought my dc habit down to a controllable level by setting some really strict parameters around it. In my case, that means a strict maximum of 1 can a day, and only if I'm having lunch in the office (or to drink mid afternoon). On other days I'm not allowed any, even if I'm working at my desk all day at home. These days I sometimes even find my lunchtime can is still open and full (and slightly flat....yuk!) on my desk by the end of the day...so stick at it and you'll get there.

Snowkey, interesting point about fluid retention. I must have drunk my own weight in hot water and herbal tea on Wednesday, mainly in an effort to stay warm during an all day workshop in a freezing office....that may have had an impact. I was seriously unimpressed when the scales hadn't bugded even 0.1 lbs on Thurs morning! Let's see how Monday goes....

Ezzra I love the Dragonfly range - especially the Roibus chai...mmm....:) :)

Does anyone have any information about spelt and rye bread compared to normal grains? We make our own bread most days and I have a range of flours....and a feeling that spelt bread is supposed to be 'healthier' (or at least gluten free). Is this all in my head?!

catsrus
Your orange and coconut herbal tea sounds delicious, are there any calories in it (coconut)?

And for those on ipads, to make words bold just type a star then the word then a star as it says just below the message box you type in

Made it, phew! Early night now

Hi all, well 3 weeks into 4:3 and lost 9lbs and 2.5" off the waist. Really chuffed with that but like betterlatethan have been struggling to keep feed days under control. It's those damn carbs calling my name so am making a very concerted effort today to have a healthy eating day with a small treat after dinner. Am off to investigate the links further up, hope you're all keeping warm and that your day's going as you planned and if it isn't there's always tomorrow