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Brexit

Northern Ireland troubles *title edited at OP's request by MNHQ*

90 replies

ZNation · 08/04/2021 18:17

Could someone help me with the troubles in Ireland and why Brexit has provoked this ? What the issue is and are people generally against Brexit in Ireland?
I have tried to google before anyone says but I don't understand.

OP posts:
XDownwiththissortofthingX · 08/04/2021 20:07

Lol at the ''EU's brexit deal''

wow

Risible, isn't it?

What's more galling is Arlene Foster bleating about this, when her lack of political acumen did more than anything or anyone else to enable a full-on hard Brexit. How's that £1billion bribe helping now Arlene?

Fool.

ListeningQuietly · 08/04/2021 20:08

ZNation
The Good Friday Agreement en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Good_Friday_Agreement
Stopped people killing each other
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Troubles
By removing the border
Between
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Northern_Ireland
and
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Republic_of_Ireland

Its one of the strangest international borders in the world as it went from
Fortress to Erased

Brexit fucked that all over : As soon as the UK said it was leaving the Single Market
a compromise had to be reached.
It was
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brexit_and_the_Irish_border
But Liars in Westminster told folks otherwise
and this
news.sky.com/story/why-has-violence-broken-out-in-northern-ireland-12269636
is the result
Sad

UhtredRagnarson · 08/04/2021 20:10

Well for starters- it’s Northern Ireland... Hmm

UhtredRagnarson · 08/04/2021 20:11

I can see your googling was a massive success when can’t even get the name of the country right.

Peregrina · 08/04/2021 20:57

Perhaps OP should ask MN to change the title of the thread.

Straussful · 08/04/2021 21:01

It is embarrassing to the UK how little the ordinary man or woman know about this situation IN YOUR OWN COUNTRY.

These (currently) are loyalist thugs rioting. Loyal to whom you might ask? To the United Kingdom and the Crown. Who cares about them? Seemingly not the British or the Crown. This is a situation created by Britain and now they want to pretend it's not happening and wash their hands of the mess they have made.

I have heard it said (on Irish radio) many times in the past 24 hours: if this was Bristol or Brighton or Birmingham it would be headlining news bulletins and making the front page of newspapers, instead there has been deafening silence and questions like this OP.

Scarlet for ye.

IsFuzzyBeagMise · 08/04/2021 21:18

Don't feel sorry for asking the question, op. At least you cared enough to ask.

It's awful to see this kicking off again. The rioters look so young too.

UhtredRagnarson · 08/04/2021 21:19

The rioters look so young too.

They are. They are children being egged on by grown men filming it from the sidelines, out of harms way. It’s disgusting. Those children should be very angry with the adults around them.

IsFuzzyBeagMise · 08/04/2021 21:31

@UhtredRagnarson

The rioters look so young too.

They are. They are children being egged on by grown men filming it from the sidelines, out of harms way. It’s disgusting. Those children should be very angry with the adults around them.

It is disgusting.
vera99 · 08/04/2021 21:33

Brexiteers were continuously warned 'Project Fear' that smashing the status quo vis a vis Northern Ireland was playing with fire. But onwards they ploughed into the valley of death. The greatest political triumph of my lifetime was peace in Ireland and the clown Johnson has lit the fuse. I wouldn't piss on him if he was on fire in fact I would look for the gasoline.

Their biggest mistake for the DUP, however, was actually believing a single word coming out of Johnson’s mouth. When he got on stage and said that NI wouldn’t be treated any different than the rest of the UK the DUP were in a party mood. They genuinely believed that there would be customs points on the border with the Republic of Ireland. Some of the lower dregs of loyalism even called for a wall to be built around the border. Then they were stabbed in the back and are currently blaming everyone - the Irish government, the EU, Boris, the Conservative Party, literally everyone but themselves for the mess they have helped to create. At least they know now to never trust a Tory.

CliffsofMohair · 08/04/2021 21:40

Don’t apologise for asking OP. At least you are aware enough to want to know why this is happening. I live in the south and I’m still confused as to the complexities - but the ever present themes are still there - appalling, manipulative, self-serving politicians and poor, under resourced, marginalised communities, who cling to tribal/religious/community identities that stopped serving NI as a province as long, long time ago.
Arlene Foster’s tweet last night was akin to something Donald Trump would have put out. It had shades of appeasing the Capitol Hill invaders.
Westminster should hang its head except it is incapable of that level of reflection. It simply doesn’t give a shit about NI. No better illustration of this was Brexit. It was barely mentioned in England during the referendum.

UhtredRagnarson · 08/04/2021 21:41

The greatest political triumph of my lifetime was peace in Ireland and the clown Johnson has lit the fuse.

Ahh don’t worry, he’s “deeply concerned” about the current situation in NI. So that’s alright then. His job is done, his conscience is clear.

UhtredRagnarson · 08/04/2021 21:43

Everyone was warned. Brexit would cause the breakdown of peace in NI. And here we have children being water cannoned in the streets. But I guess that’s just silly NI up to their old tricks and nothing to do with anyone who voted for brexit.

vera99 · 08/04/2021 21:47

His only concern has only ever been himself he betrays anybody who is foolish enough to give him their trust. When Covid passes as soon it will the carnage he is creating will be laid clear so the flags/statues/ immigrants narratives will get injected with steriods - 'look over there not here. He might just get away with it. We are living through perilous times sadly.

TerribleCustomerCervix · 08/04/2021 21:47

Arlene Foster’s tweet last night was akin to something Donald Trump would have put out

I actually thought it was a spoof account when I first saw that tweet.

I mean the Bobby Storey funeral was a massive misstep from SF, but on the scale of criminality it’s clear that rioting, burning out a bus and throwing petrol bombs rates sliiiiightly higher.

bongsuhan · 08/04/2021 21:51

Here is another good Twitter thread that describes the background basics:

twitter.com/PatricKielty/status/1045782711816708096?s=19

TookHerForADrinkOnTuesday · 08/04/2021 22:06

@UhtredRagnarson

Everyone was warned. Brexit would cause the breakdown of peace in NI. And here we have children being water cannoned in the streets. But I guess that’s just silly NI up to their old tricks and nothing to do with anyone who voted for brexit.
It’s so bloody upsetting! Water cannons out, streets full of kids. In 2021.
widthofacircle · 08/04/2021 22:09

So it's no surprise that there's another excuse for violence in Belfast and other places, sure you can point to Loyalist anger over a consequence of Brexit involving a so called border either in the sea or on land on the island of Ireland but the real reason for the violence of the last fifty plus years is marked this year with the one hundredth anniversary of the partition of the island of Ireland by the United Kingdom.
I speak as an English former soldier who served in Belfast in the seventies, this country of ours created the problem, we occupied Ireland, we took land from Irish people and gave it to Protestant people who were encouraged to leave Scotland and England and settle in Ireland displacing the Irish people in their own land, we created a political system of gerrymandering to allow the Protestant minority on the island to wield the power, they had the best jobs and housing for example, it was this situation in the sixties which gave rise to the troubles.

UhtredRagnarson · 08/04/2021 22:13

It’s so bloody upsetting! Water cannons out, streets full of kids. In 2021.

Yep. Water canons, police dogs, warnings of impact rounds being fired. Meanwhile grown men shouting to the kids “hit the dogs with bricks” tell ya what mate, why don’t you go and try and hit the dogs with bricks and show us your face while you’re at it. Nah, far braver to tell children to do it. Angry

AfterSchoolWorry · 08/04/2021 22:15

@Lipz

NORTHERN IRELAND. We the Republic are not part of NI.
Thanks, it's not in Ireland.

It's in Northern Ireland which is the UK.

vera99 · 08/04/2021 22:18

Oh yes the British Empire policy of divide and rule was very effective - we are not perfidious Albion for nothing and then we walk away wash our hands - we reserved some of our cruellest policies for our nearest neighbour from Cromwell's atrocities to the Great Famine and beyond - it's no wonder some republicans called the Union Flag the butcher's apron. NI had handle with extreme care plastered all over it - then came Brexit supercharged with covid shot into tribal feudal communities. It is the 'loyalists' that are stirring the pot at the current time one can only hope the nationalists stay their hand and sober heads win the day.

Where is the flag of England?
Go North, South, East or West
Wherever's there's wealth to plunder
Or land to be possessed!
Wherever there's feeble races
To frighten, coerce or scare
Oh, you'll find a butcher's apron
The English flag is there

It waves above blazing hovels
Where Africa's victims die
To be shot by explosive bullets
Or wretchedly starve and fly
And where the pirate harries
In the isles of sovereign seas
At the peak of the hellish vessel
The English flag is free

The Maori often cursed it
With its bitterest dying breath
And the Arab hath hissed his hatred
As he spat in its fold in death
And the helpless Hindu feared it
And the Kenyan did the same
And the Irish blood has stained it
With a deep and indelible stain

(Chorus)
Where is the flag of England?
Go North, South, East or West
Wherever's there's wealth to plunder
Or land to be possessed!
Wherever there's feeble races
To frighten, coerce or scare
Oh, you'll find a butcher's apron
The English flag is there

It has floated o'er scenes of pillage
It is flaunted o'er deeds of shame
It has waved above foul marauders
As they ravished with sword and flame
It has looked upon ruthless slaughter
And massacre dire and grim
And it's heard the shriek of victims
Drowned in the Jingo hymn

Where is the flag of England?
Seek lands where natives rot
Where decay and assured extinction
Must soon be a people's lot
Go search for once-glad islands
Where death and disease are rife
And the greed of callous commerce
Now battens on human life

(Chorus)
Where is the flag of England?
Go North, South, East or West
Wherever's there's wealth to plunder
Or land to be possessed!
Wherever there's feeble races
To frighten, coerce or scare
Oh, you'll find a butcher's apron
The English flag is there

Where is the flag of England?
Go sail where rich boats come
With shoddy and loaded cottons
And beer and Bibles and guns
Go where brute force has triumped
And hypocrisy makes its lair
In your question you'll find the answer
It was or still is there

(Chorus)
Where is the flag of England?
Go North, South, East or West
Wherever's there's wealth to plunder
Or land to be possessed!
Wherever there's feeble races
To frighten, coerce or scare
Oh, you'll find a butcher's apron
The English flag is there

SheriffCallie · 08/04/2021 22:20

As others have already explained, the issue isn’t brexit per say. Remaining in the customs union/single Market wouldn’t have triggered so many diffiulties.leaving these meant that we were leaving the trading bloc and a border would have to be erected somewhere. On land is problematic (for nationalists), and with so many roads etc. In the sea is also problematic (for unionists) and due to tariffs (we’ve had loads of online deliveries refused).
But, as it is, Boris agreed to a sea border and the unionists are unhappy as they feel neglected/abandoned by Westminster, and this goes against what they were initially promised. Who knew Boris was a liar??! Hence the riots. I know a few people have linked to the Bobby storey PPS decision but tbh that’s what the DUP want us to believe. That hasn’t been the narrative around, building anger, since Jan, in the way that the sea border has.

QpopTYUIop9 · 08/04/2021 22:22

OP if you really want to understand it you’ll have to go back 800 years or so to when the British started their ongoing campaign of occupying Ireland. It’s shocking that kids at school in England don’t learn this history, it’s the next door neighbour. Brexit has cast salt on a very old wound, but the politicians in favour of Brexit bumbled on regardless. Maybe because they didn’t study the history.

N4ish · 08/04/2021 22:28

It’s desperately sad. The vast majority of people in the UK (including Westminster politicians) couldn’t give a damn about Northern Ireland. The same for most people in the Republic - if they could take a scissors and cut NI off from the rest of the island they’d be thrilled.

terribleg · 08/04/2021 22:29

The troubles aren’t in Ireland. They’re in NI ie. the UK. It amazes me that British people still don’t seem to understand this. It’s a UK problem, not an Irish one.

Yup