The Silence is Deafening

[Crankley]

For the last however long, I have read threads and posts by Remainers stating confidently that the Prime Minister wanted a No Deal, would get a No Deal. Here are just a few quotes. Some Remainers may recognise their own predictions:

'He is going to give us No Deal and then fuck off into the sunset with millons in bungs from his crooked mates,'

'I'm pretty certain on no deal...'

'I fully expect a No Deal Brexit.'

'Bojo will 'deliver' no deal and then F off into the sunset'

'Boris Johnson and your disingenuous divs - How dare you try and spin a NoDeal'

'He was elected to not get a deal and to make his supporters feel good about the fact the had stuck it to the man (or something).'

There are lots more if you want them.

Now he has obtained a deal, where are all the threads by remainers? Do any have the the guts to hold up their hand up and say 'I was wrong'?

@yellowspanner - it’s clear from your post you really have no grasp of trade at all despite your claim to work in it. But I can’t be bothered to argue with you on Boxing Day when I’m full of chocolate and even if I did you wouldn’t listen.

@flashbac

Completely agree

Heard a good summary. A no deal would have been a loose, loose for both the U.K. and the EU. The deal we have is a win compared with a no deal but for the U.K. going forward it’s a loose as the U.K. needs the EU more than they need us.

But the comments about Capital gains tax that yellowspanner just spouted, is the sort of rubbish picked up by the Daily Mail and presented as a Big Win for Brexit.

Er, like the Covid vaccine, made by Germans of Turkish descent and produced in Belgium and licenced by the UK under EU legislation was bigged up as 'Whoo hoo, look how wonderful we are now that we aren't controlled by the EU."

spanner please read jasjas's post from 14:36 today. This is happening right here, right now. Its the tip of the iceberg.

Thank you flashbac for making my point for me. I didn’t ask about any of the arguments and yet I got it both barrels. You don’t even know how I voted

'Spanner.
You are missing one glaring flaw in your argument, if it is such a loose agreement as you imagine, why didn't we just go full no-deal?

I mean 100% fishing quota back in house, able to state aid with zero consequence, can lower environmental, employment rights or anything else for that matter or increase them too!

Why tie ourselves to an EU/UK court of arbitration and all those pesky rules which cover 2000 pages of A4.....if it so benign?

Yes, i thought it was CS, no one else could continually get ECJ mixed up with ECHR.

If they're so confident of their position, why the need to name change?! Other than having been banned, obvs!

Op your right there were lots on here saying those things and on sm

Also you can't say its worse than the deal we had before because its a deal out of the eu , and we are free to arrange other trade deals on our own etc
Its not comparable because its not the same thing , the deal we had before involved being in the eu , many didn't want to still be in the eu and regardless he has agreed a deal, only time will tell if it is a good deal

For those who care about fish, the amazing thing is how little the EU gave up (including after 2026). This table has the shares and you'll need microscope to spot any significant changes.

So in the end it really was "so long and thanks for all the fish".

A big round of applause for Macron and his travel ban; without Manu the U.K. might have fought a bit harder for their fish.

Robbinbanks - you didn't have to name change, you could have just asked for a password reset, it's a fairly straightforward process and means you could then have posted under your usual name.

Otherwise, it does look a bit hypocritical to call out posters previous usernames whilst hiding behind a new one yourself.

Just sayin, as you were

Who exactly have name changed?

For people who have supposedly got what they wanted, they seem a bit sore.

Our name changing friends were all excited by the Withdrawal Agreement and then stopped being when the various Brexit loving rags started bitching about it.
I suspect more of the same shortly. We could even open a sweepstake on the day it'll start.

I name change frequently. I am fully aware of the difference between the ECJ and the ECHR.
I am very happy today and we toasted Boris with champagne on the 24th.

Toasting a liar. Excellent taste, there.

Arbitration

We were clearly expecting some sort of arbitration mechanism with a deal - it was in our negotiating strategy/draft text;

"How might a future trade agreement be enforced?"

"Both the UK and EU draft texts of the proposed FTA provide for dispute resolution to be referred to a panel of arbitrators, should "consultations" fail to resolve the matter. Additionally, the UK draft provides for a mediation procedure (but provides no detail), whilst the EU draft provides for the possibility of "accelerated consultations" for certain matters (again, these are not specified, nor is the relevant procedure). The key substantive difference is that the EU proposed text provides for the arbitration panel to refer issues to the CJEU where a point relating to the interpretation of EU law is involved..."

"THE ISSUE OF CJEU INVOLVEMENT"
"Clearly the EU's proposals for involvement of the CJEU cross one of the UK's red lines..."

www.traverssmith.com/knowledge/knowledge-container/brexit-a-qa-on-the-proposed-euuk-trade-deal/

For those who care about fish, the amazing thing is how little the EU gave up

They're not selling it well:

"The Irish Fishermen's Organisation say the Brexit agreement concluded today has "failed" Irish fishermen." ...

"Make no mistake - we will be seeking compensation from our EU colleagues to put right this grievous wrong." ...

"Taoiseach Micheál Martin has admitted some ground was given when it came it fishing."

"There were some concessions at European Union level on that but we will work with the fishing community to support the fishing community."

www.irishexaminer.com/news/arid-40196673.html

"German Agriculture Minister Julia Kloeckner warned of “painful cuts” for the European Union’s fishing industry due to the trade deal the bloc has reached with the United Kingdom. Kloeckner, a member of Chancellor Angela Merkel’s Christian Democratic Union, said she would have liked the cuts to be “significantly lower” ...

www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2020-12-25/germany-laments-painful-cuts-for-fishing-sector-in-brexit-deal

I am fully aware of the difference between the ECJ and the ECHR

No you don't.

My brexitier friends see the 'deal as betrayal, we are very much still tied into the EU's orbit.

Macron played a blinder and showed the no-dealers what their ideal would look like, Johnson then capitulated.

Really stunningly good deal - I was not expecting it. Luckily Ursula and Mutti sidelined the nauseous little creep Barnier and the posturing charlatan Macron to deal directly with the UK team. Boris did it! Definitely a new optimism for the New Year.

Also you can't say its worse than the deal we had before because its a deal out of the eu , and we are free to arrange other trade deals on our own etc

We had excellent trade deals with other countries whilst in the EU. One of the problems is that, despite having had over four years to sort new ones out, they have been pretty conspicuous by their absence.

We had excellent trade deals with other countries whilst in the EU. One of the problems is that, despite having had over four years to sort new ones out, they have been pretty conspicuous by their absence.

14 December -

"Liz Truss is the unsung hero of post-Brexit trade deals—she’s sorted out 57 of them."

"In the last week came agreements with Canada, Kenya, Singapore, Vietnam, Switzerland, Norway and Iceland."

inews.co.uk/opinion/brexit-trade-deal-liz-truss-hero-794748

In the medium term Brexit will turn the U.K. economy more than the Covid pandemic. Scary future.

Liz Truss is only an unsung hero to the Brexiters. She has managed to get rollover deals, so we are not as worse off as we might have been. I gather the only genuinely new deal is one with Japan, and it's debatable how much value it will give us.