The Silence is Deafening

[Crankley]

For the last however long, I have read threads and posts by Remainers stating confidently that the Prime Minister wanted a No Deal, would get a No Deal. Here are just a few quotes. Some Remainers may recognise their own predictions:

'He is going to give us No Deal and then fuck off into the sunset with millons in bungs from his crooked mates,'

'I'm pretty certain on no deal...'

'I fully expect a No Deal Brexit.'

'Bojo will 'deliver' no deal and then F off into the sunset'

'Boris Johnson and your disingenuous divs - How dare you try and spin a NoDeal'

'He was elected to not get a deal and to make his supporters feel good about the fact the had stuck it to the man (or something).'

There are lots more if you want them.

Now he has obtained a deal, where are all the threads by remainers? Do any have the the guts to hold up their hand up and say 'I was wrong'?

Bellini, I was in the Alms when you visited and immediately reported back to westminstenders where the Alms had moved to. You did not give the impression of coming with a friendly attitude.
Please show me the specific post where you were called a rat and needed to be removed by disinfectant. I have looked back and can't find it. Please enlighten me.
All I did was exercise my democratic right to vote. I have never asked anybody to "shut up" or consent. But, clearly being civil is too much to ask.
You are glad the fishermen are "pissed off". Why? Do you want the UK to fail? Will that make you happy? I am puzzled.

Wincaroo, which empty cliches am I sprouting?

@yellowspanner

The silence is far from deafening. Many of us have been celebrating. I am sure there would have been parties had it not been for Covid. There really are some nasty, bitter people on here who just want to talk the UK down. Some of you clearly despise the UK and hate to see it successful. I am not nasty about remain voters but the vitriol towards leave voters is disturbing. Why must you call people such nasty names. Can't we just disagree in a civilised way.

In most leave v remain discussions I've seen, remainers try to get leavers to explain the benefits of leaving, and argue that we are going to lose so much. Leavers responses are "you lost, get over it", like it should be perfectly easy to "get over" having a whole set of rights removed from you. My problem is no one ever being able to present to me real tangible benefits of leaving. Often there is a misunderstanding in how the EU works (the "unelected bureaucrats" stuff), and a retort of "do your own research". There have been many reports and pieces of research brought out since 2016 clearly demonstrating that as a country we will be worse off in a multitude of ways. Even JRM admitted it may take "a generation" to start to see any benefits. No one can tell me who is actually going to pick the strawberries etc, clean the local hospital, provide care in the care homes, now freedom of movement has been removed. So I find it really hard to be nice and reasonable with leave voters who really can't tell me anything about how this is actually going to make things better for me, and more importantly my kids and their kids (not just me and mine, everybody else too).

@akerman

Seems that the fishermen are pissed off with the deal

Fishermen all over EU are pissed off with the deal too. Yesterday's FAZ had an article about how the German fishermen feel they've been sold down the river by their politicians. That's the way it goes in negotiations.

@yellowspanner , it was deleted. And no I didn't screenshot it because I foolishly thought you were all grown ups.
And if you didn't think I was trying to build bridges then you have no chance talking to people much more hardline than me. As for my "reporting back to Westminsterenders " the clue is in the building bridges or do you think building bridges means turning into a craven Brexiteer.? You've got a lot of work to do if you can.
You lot can have all the fun you like now - like a soggy biscuit session- if you alienate people like me, you are going to have a hard time with this "let's come together" bollocks.

As for my "reporting back to Westminsterenders " the clue is in the building bridges or do you think building bridges means turning into a craven Brexiteer.?

Come on Bellini Leavers had taken themselves off to a quieter corner of mumsnet so that we could discuss in peace, under new usernames, without any of the usual suspects tracking is down and piling in with their 'your thick' type comments. What you did when the question was asked on Westministenders 'where have all the leavers gone they aren't on the Brexit Board'? Was to signpost exactly where we were and then voila, all your chums piled in. That is not bridge building.

Again, I persisted in the Arms to stop any excesses. I also said you lot hadn't disappeared as was claimed but were still talking. As is your right on a public board.
But if you want to be a snowflake about talking to people, that's your problem. It's not as if you were hiding in the knitting section ffs.

The Arms isn't a ducking g "quiet corner of Mumsnet ". What children!

@yellowspanner

Wincaroo, which empty cliches am I sprouting?

Well I wasn't strictly accurate. Apologies. It would be great if you could respond to my other points though.

Didn’t Boris want 80% of the fishing rights and got 25%, wouldn’t call that a win.

Also the deal doesn’t include financial services which makes up a huge proportion of our exports.

Can someone explain why that is good for us?

Again, I persisted in the Arms to stop any excesses. I also said you lot hadn't disappeared as was claimed but were still talking. As is your right on a public board.

The Arms isn't a ducking g "quiet corner of Mumsnet ". What children!

We weren't on the Brexit Board though were we? Hence people were asking where we were.

And calling people 'Snowflake' isn't childish?

No I can’t explain that, but it does show again how civil agreement is arrived at. I’d like to see the crystal clear evidence, fully dated with authenticity checks, that everyone who voted leave on a 52-48 slim majority desperately wanted exactly the deal, down to the last dotted I and crossed t, that has been negotiated by an elite crew of Eton cronies.

If you want control of this island, and have now got it, what are you going to do with it? I would hope you’d join me in trying to ensure, or at least calling for, decent livelihoods for all with decent housing, decent opportunities that are not dependent on birth status and wealth, welfare rights in case of sickness, and so on. How do we secure those now? This is our island you’ve said - so protect those forests and the seas around.

@ineedaholidaynow

Didn’t Boris want 80% of the fishing rights and got 25%, wouldn’t call that a win.

Also the deal doesn’t include financial services which makes up a huge proportion of our exports.

Can someone explain why that is good for us?

I've asked this too. I'm waiting for a response.

I really do not get this, 5% extra quota per year is pathetic!

European Fisheries Alliance 24 December;

"Gerard van Balsfoort, Chairman of the European Fisheries Alliance remarked: “Details of the deal notwithstanding, it is clear from what we know that this is a dark day for the European fishing industry. The loss of a significant part of our fishing rights, built up over many generations of fishermen, is a huge blow..."

fisheriesalliance.eu/eu-fishers-are-paying-a-high-price-for-a-brexit-agreement-the-present-deal-is-a-significant-blow-and-leaves-them-facing-an-uncertain-future/

“We were appalled at the EU offering 25% of the annual catch value to the UK which in NPV represents close to €1.6 billion..."

fisheriesalliance.eu/1010/

This is a squirrel Clavinova - yet again. The question wasn't are the Dutch, Danish and French fishermen pissed off, but how is getting 25% a success when you asked for 80%?

But you have WON. You have got your Brexit. All yours.

Martin Daubney
@MartinDaubney
THREAD ON FISHING: I've spent hours poring over the #BrexitDeal

• There are 87 species of fish subject to shared EU/UK quotas

• In 2020, across them all, UK gets average 33.6% of quotas

• In 2026, it "rises" to 35.92%

So the UK gets just 2.32% more fish after Brexit

^>> So the UK gets just 2.32% more fish after Brexit

All those people on here a few days ago thinking sod the fish, let's just get the deal. Now the only thing they've got left to complain about is the fish. Must be really annoying .

This is a squirrel Clavinova - yet again. The question wasn't are the Dutch, Danish and French fishermen pissed off, but how is getting 25% a success when you asked for 80%?

We were using the 80% as leverage for something else?

So the UK gets just 2.32% more fish after Brexit

Good luck to those EU fishing communities expecting compensation from the EU then - no chance.

Again, you weren't in Knitting. You were called The Brexit Arms - as it is now. You kept cropping up in Active. A bit shit at hiding.
Perhaps Parler or Reddit might be the forum for you. Or call yourselves "Can I mix acrylic with wool?". Then no one would find you or everyone would assume you wanted to be left alone if they had the misfortune to come across your thread.
I thought you were proud to be talking openly about your stuff. Not ashamed. Not hiding.
Obviously the Arms is the kind of pub that doesn't welcome "those " kind of people. There's a word for people who behave like that @yellowspanner . I wonder what it could be.

In all fairness I was laughing just skimming the outline of the deal.
BJ should have remained a decent blowjob instead of a British Prime Minister if he calls this a victory and a great deal.
He screwed up the financial services. The pride of London, the City.
If any part of a product contains non-EU parts, look forward to paying customs.
Students and universities- no Erasmus, no EU grants.
Anyone working in the EU will need to have their qualifications re-certified.
My bet is, many companies are switching to plan B and looking to find ways of getting out of Britain.

And to my knowledge, there's still no decent trade deal for Britain in sight with the US etc. They were all waiting for the EU deal to see what leverage they have over Britain. Because the time of Britain being the financial and economic superpower is over.
Everybody thinks BJ pushed Germany into submission but in reality Germany were just trying to save the UK from self-destruction to keep the balance and peace in Europe. They learned from their history, unlike Britain.

Come 4th January we should see all those countries running in just to sign the trade deals we were told were on the cards.

As for keeping the peace in Europe. It won't be long before a Leaver jumps in to say it was nothing to do with the EEC/EU, it was all NATO.

Trade deal with the US - yes, the wrong man won. I did enjoy seeing Johnson wriggling there and Biden's entourage helpfully reminding him what he'd said about Obama.

Again, you weren't in Knitting. You were called The Brexit Arms - as it is now. You kept cropping up in Active.

I don't think we ever cropped up in active.

NiceGuyNeddie Mon 20-Jan-20 00:23:18
Looks like the Arms is winding up anyway. Wonder where they'll go next? Maybe blast off into space pausing only to write 'Nothing can stop us now!' across the sky..

Peregrina Mon 20-Jan-20 08:48:32
You say the Brexit Arms is closing?

Bellinisurge Mon 20-Jan-20 08:52:44
The Arms is now Westminster Arms and is in the Politics topic

Cue pile on, that's not my idea of how to build bridges.

I'm leaving it there now, happy to go back to chatting 🐟

We were using the 80% as leverage for something else?

And what did we get?

Tariff free access for goods, where the UK runs a trade deficit, and sod all for services, where the UK runs a trade surplus?

Don't drag me into the Brexit Arms debate. I posted once only on there and that was by accident.