Can any genuine non-goady posters who voted for Brexit answer some of the following questions please?

[Spittingchestnuts]

I would prefer to avoid a goady thread if at all possible.

I'm British but I live outside the UK and I'm interested to know - now Brexit is "done" (almost) - why current discussions about it on Mumsnet and elsewhere on UK sm and in the press, are not more focused on what the UK will be doing after 1st January when the transition period comes to an end should we have no deal, and even if we do? (I'm thinking more about policy and direction rather than possible goods delays at borders but those are important too.) Is anyone who voted for Brexit prepared to admit that they are worried with the New Year looming so close and so little information coming from the government?

Some regular pro-Brexit posters on here seem to have blind faith in Boris Johnson's government and a strong belief that life will automatically be better outside the EU despite the fact that, apart from a few vague witterings about greater flexibility and increased sovereignty, we almost have next to no detailed information about it. The lack of detailed facts available is scary actually. As far as I can understand it, Brexiteers voted for a "vague notion" sketched in the briefest of terms by a proven liar and his cohorts with next to no detail or shading. If you think this interpretation is unfair, can you give me more details as to why? What concrete things did you vote for as opposed to the things you voted against?

To date, the UK government have been very vocal about what they don't want and how they don't want to be shackled to EU rules, but have been less forthcoming about what they do want and how these changes wiil translate in to legislation. We've rejected rules and policies that are roughly aligned with a Christian liberal, centre-leaning social democratic model that focuses on high product standards and good basic employment protections, so where will we go now? In a different direction presumably?

So what will the laws and policies be that distinguish ourselves from this EU mould? 52% of UK citizens voted for them so can any of you please explain them? We will presumably be steering to the right of where we are now? Given that Brexit was championed by the right wing of the Conservative party who want lower taxes, less state intervention, I would say that that's a logical conclusion, but is no one particularly alarmed by this prospect? Can anyone who voted for Brexit but doesn't view themselves as particularly right wing , explain this to me?

I know it is said that some Brexiteers voted for improved public services, and for more money being invested in the NHS etc? Can anyone explain how Boris will manage to recruit more nurses, more police, and have better environmental standards, while presiding over a low tax economy or "Singapore-on-Thames"? Does no one recognise a potential conflict between these two positions?

And now we want to trade more with non-EU countries that are geographically further away, how will be, practically and logistically, manage to do this without undermining current UK efforts to be more environmentally friendly?

And what about the "small" matter of Scotland voting to remain by 62%? And Northern Ireland by 55.8%? Is anyone who voted for Brexit even mildly concerned about what affect a Conservative government, based in Westminster, imposing a divergence away from Europe they didn't want, on citizens of Scotland and N.Ireland, will have on the unity of the UK ?

It's probably too much to hope for but I would love some non-goady genuine pro-Brexit posters to explain some of this to me. As I love and miss the UK, and have lots of family there, and there are 20 days until the new year, these questions are occupying my thoughts and keeping me awake at night.

"We will issue licences to fish and theses will be under our control not the EUs"

We already did this. Then they sold them. To EU based fishing companies.

That's what happens when the EU is in charge. Things go wrong. Thank God we're out.,

@HannibalHayes

"We will issue licences to fish and theses will be under our control not the EUs"

We already did this. Then they sold them. To EU based fishing companies.

Precisely. UK fishermen can come the old soldier all they like, but you can't actually sell a fishing licence then complain you, er, can't fish commercially anymore. Scarcely the fault of the EU.

That's what happens when the EU is in charge.

Er, the EU weren't in charge of those licenses.

FFS, don't just make shit up and blame it on the EU.

Or don't be stupid

There is still a lot of bitterness about fish. Particularly from older people who were around when the government snatched British fish away from them and flogged them to the EU. The British fishing industry was decimated and a lot of people still want revenge. They’re rubbing their hands with glee at destroying EU fishermen’s livelihoods the same way British fishermen’s livelihoods were destroyed.

when the government snatched British fish away from them and flogged them to the EU.
What are you talking about? The government didn't "snatch" any rights, the British fishermen sold them - to foreign buyers.

the British fishermen sold them
The individual fishermen didn’t have a choice.

OP I’m just posting to let you know that people like me do exist, who voted Leave primarily in the hope that it would be a huge protest vote that would shake things up in the status quo in the UK which wasn’t great for many people (to be honest it never occurred to me that Leave had a hope in hell of actually winning - ignorance you recall the polls did not predict it at all). All the desperate crises that have had a light shone on them now due to COVID were there in the making well before the Leave vote. I had a hope that part of that shaking up process would be getting rid of the PM and government at the time (which was achieved) and hopefully replace that with a kinder more centrist type government way left of Cameron let alone May and Boris, either from the Conservatives or via a Lib Dem/Labour general election win. I could see the sort of government we unfortunately have today coming a mile off and wanted to avoid that, but my vote likely hastened it as things took a crazy turn into hardcore right wing which I didn’t see coming (perhaps I should have but I didn’t). I realise that in hindsight and knowing the way things have worked out now that this thinking seems laughable, and I did not realise at the time what a huge right wing billionaire class juggernaut was behind the whole thing, but genuinely those were my intentions with my Leave vote.

I share all of your concerns and I thoroughly regret my vote but I can assure you I didn’t vote that way because I’m racist etc. Please remember that the political climate at the time was actually quite different, like when you say how could anyone who voted leave think Boris would not just look after alll his private school billionaire chums, in fact I don’t think at that time anyone dreamed that Boris would ever end up PM. I wanted Cameron out, would never have dreamed it could get worse. Remember it was also supposed to be an advisory vote and nobody at all was talking seriously about a hard Brexit back then.

The thing is, I’m not sure that there are lots of others out there who are Bregretters like me, polls suggest otherwise - but I suspect part of that is the sunk cost fallacy issue. It’s clear to me that it will be a disaster for the country unfortunately.

I believe the fisherman. They're honest. Their livliehoods were destroyed by EU overfishing. Now the waters are to be patrolled by the navy.

@rachelbloomfan

You were lied to. Repeatedly. The shame isn't yours. The shame is on those who lied to get your vote knowing that it was for their benefit only, and not for yours. They are the ones who should feel ashamed.

Unfortunately, it's become very clear that they have literally no sense of shame at all. Sociopaths.

Those who made the wrong choice because of lies are just among the majority of this country who are going to suffer from this con.

Those who still support it, even though it is evidently a right-wing coup, and a devastating attack on our democracy are the ones to be held to account, and in contempt.

I believe the fisherman. They're honest.

Yes, they honestly sold their fishing rights.

Bunch of muppets...

The individual fishermen didn’t have a choice.

That's not what you said. Are you no longer saying the government "snatched British fish" away from our fishermen because it's not clear?

I believe the fisherman

I do too, Goves parents sold their fish merchants business, due to collapse of fish stocks, pre fish quota sell offs.
Aberdeeens Tory MEP says the Icelandic cod wars and overfishing killed the local fish industry.

A Newlyn fisherman says a no deal brexit will wreck the cornish fishing industry as they will lose their eu markets.

Easier to blame the EU than accept that there is not enough fish and what there are, have to be conserved with international ie uk/eu agreements.

The individual fishermen had no choice it was part of the CFP. We lost control of our fishing and with luck should be able to take it back.
I wasn't lied to. I voted to be out of the EU. We have left and I am delighted.
What we are now doing is realigning our relationship.

The individual fishermen had no choice it was part of the CFP.

The CFP did not state that they had to sell their fishing rights to other countries. THIS IS SIMPLY A LIE

PLEASE STOP REPEATING SUCH UNMITIGATED RUBBISH

@Viviennemary

I believe the fisherman. They're honest. Their livliehoods were destroyed by EU overfishing. Now the waters are to be patrolled by the navy.

Their waters have been patrolled by the navy for a very long time. At least three decades.

We have a tiny fishing economy. Most British trawlers operate in the North Sea catching cod. Nothing to do with quotas or overfishing.

Nothing to do with Brexit and everything to do with Johnsons blustering propaganda. He really does fancy himself as a latter day Churchill, doesn’t he?

The problems with fishing quotas in the UK all started when the then government choose to attach quotas to boats so if you sold the boat the quota when with it. Thus anyone wanting big bucks for their boat, rather than scrap it could sell it and make a mint. other countries didn't allocate the quotas like that.

Quite interesting to look at where British registered boats fish. Most are not in UK waters.

The whole thing is a red herring (sorry). Fishing is a tiny part of our economy. Trawlers operate outside our territorial waters. There is no battle to be had.

Well have to hope Ireland and Iceland don’t want to send EU navies after our vessels....

And if Scotland gained its independence, there would be virtually no English or Welsh fishing.

So, @corcory, not really anything to do with the EU then...

Game Workshop, which to the best of my knowledge caters to men who like to paint models of trolls and hobgoblins, is worth 3x as much to the UK economy, as fishing.
The fact that we're going to stand or fall by fucking fishing quotas, is totally insane.
No-one is 'delighted' this is happening, by the way, because no sane person could be. It's just a load of posturing from an ever-dwindling number of Brexiteers who can't bear to admit this has been a colossal mistake.

So let me get this right:

The (tiny) U.K. fishing industry sells much of its catch to the EU.

With a no deal outcome they won’t be able to as tariffs will make its products uncompetitive.

So there is a massive question mark over its viability in that scenario.

Which bit of that have I got wrong?

PoorMansPaulaRadcliffe, agree totally - if we lose out on a deal because of fishing my rage level will rise to incandescent. It's also obvious on this thread how few leavers understand the reality of the fishing industry.

There was a poster on MN that said that if the UK enforces its coastal waters and destroys the french etc fishing industry, they will blockade Calais.

I think this is more than possible so dangerous times ahead, all because we voted in the idiots.