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Brexit
Original poster

Westminstenders: Off he pops to Brussels

942 replies

RedToothBrush · 09/12/2020 07:55

Alex Andreou @sturdyalex
There's no way Johnson has not already decided whether or not to concede on Level Playing Field. Which makes the trip to Brussels dressing. Whether it will dress a concession as "I have saved us" or No Deal as "I tried my best" remains to be seen. But the choice is already made.

Amanda Cole @amandajanecole
What's your gut feeling, will he put his job ahead of the country? Given his past self serving form?

Alex Andreou @sturdyalex
I think he is so cornered - and has done so badly on Covid19 - his instinct will be one last, double-or-nothing throw of the dice. Only no deal does that.

The issue is that coming back with a deal will earn him much heckling and zero back-slapping from his peers. But no deal will earn him just as much heckling, but also plenty of back-slapping. What I don't know is just how ominous the departmental briefings he's getting are.

Its also worth noting the following:

Mujtaba Rahman @mij_europe
I understand @BorisJohnson wanted @EmmanuelMacron & Merkel to join his phone call with @vonderleyen last night, but she rejected the idea

So even yesterday he was STILL looking to undermine the EU and split its leaders. After all this time and the number of times he's tried this on.

Have no doubt that a) everything will be blamed on Macron (probably personally, with Conservative hardliners coming out calling for the public to boycott French cheese and wine - I'm serious btw) and covid b) covid provides a handy distraction at least for the moment. It will be used accordingly - that means its possibly now not in Johnson's interest to stop a spike in January. All efforts will be put into the vaccine rollout for PR but thats going to hit the breaks fairly soon. No doubt the EU will be blamed for that too.

What I'm not anticipating is another full lockdown. I think at least parts of Greater Manchester will now get out of T3 on 16th December. Traffords numbers look exceptional and I think it politically impossible for Johnson to keep it in T3. Its Graham Brady's patch and Manchester as a whole looks far far better than T2 London.

Anyone who gets out of T3 before Christmas won't go back into it. I'm not anticipating London to go T3 unless No Deal turns really ugly and its useful to quell civil unrest.

I think if we head into no deal then tight restrictions won't be used for covid reasons no matter how bad the hospitals get - it will only be about civil unrest, it will all be about keeping the economy going - backbench revolts are what scare Johnson most, and he's already said no more Tiers after the start of Feb.

We shall see what the day brings...

OP posts:
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DGRossetti · 13/12/2020 15:16

Let's hope Johnny foreigner can't rustle up 5 fishing boats eh ?

DrBlackbird · 13/12/2020 15:35

Just got caught up with the last few pages and after smugly feeling I had finished getting any necessary extras in, I am now thinking that I have to rush back out to get oj and lemons.... and water purification tablets. Anything else?!

,,,actually considered what they would do in the zombie apocalypse!

My DD does this all the time. She has a list of who's on her team and who isn't and why. The only reason I might be included is because I'll be the slowest runner. Grin

Peregrina · 13/12/2020 15:48

Who needs water purification tablets? During the war people were told to boil their water for 15 minutes. Of course by then quite a bit would boil away...... Just saying.

DGRossetti · 13/12/2020 15:52

@Peregrina

Who needs water purification tablets? During the war people were told to boil their water for 15 minutes. Of course by then quite a bit would boil away...... Just saying.
Stills are medieval technology.
NoCryingInEngineering · 13/12/2020 16:06

Texas Independence has been A Thing to be Talked About for a long long time. Not a particularly serious Thing, but it's fair to say there is a sizeable proportion of Texans who would say they are Texan rather than American if asked. Probably a higher proportion than in some other states but I only really know Texas so that may be unfair.

The state v federal areas of control & influence probably flavour the debate a bit differently than even the Scottish independence debates here. And a big chunk of the Texas independence movement would also want independence from Austin.

ListeningQuietly · 13/12/2020 16:07

TBH I'm not too worried about water purification because I've already got 750 gallons of rainwater in store :-)

DGRossetti · 13/12/2020 16:13

Texas Independence has been A Thing to be Talked About for a long long time

Since before they joined the Union I suspect Grin

There are fascinating parallels between the US where it quite OK to be a Texan and an American, and England where it's become forbidden by law to be English and European.

I know that there have been various odd pushes for various states to secede over the years - they're as old as the US. What caught DBs eye was that Brexit had been picked up by some as a disaster to be avoided if they were to really push for independence. Not that it's in any way a reality. Unless there's the appetite to pick up the Civil War pretty much where it left off ?

NoCryingInEngineering · 13/12/2020 16:24

A running joke with a friend of mine while I was living over there was "didn't you take Texas History in school?"

And of course there remains a significant Not English segment of the UK population. Even if the majority still believe English = British

DGRossetti · 13/12/2020 16:28

I suppose it's inevitable that Brexit news causes Mark Francois to trend ?

veeeeh · 13/12/2020 16:29

Talks to continue after THAT phone call. Hmmm. This will go down to the wire as predicted.

I think I am getting a little more positive, otherwise why would everything not have ended today.

There are some dramatics and optics afoot.

DGRossetti · 13/12/2020 16:43

@NoCryingInEngineering

A running joke with a friend of mine while I was living over there was "didn't you take Texas History in school?"

And of course there remains a significant Not English segment of the UK population. Even if the majority still believe English = British

Since before the first IndyRef, I've tried to be careful using "British", and "English" when trying to write about things to make sure I'm being specific and correct.

Bearing in mind (as I was frequently told at school) I'm only half English. So am surely allowed some leeway ?

bellinisurge · 13/12/2020 16:45

Hard rolling boil for a minute. Having first filtered out obvious particulates through a t Shirt or similar.

It's a fun way to pass the time.

NotJustACigar · 13/12/2020 16:48

Lemons are in season and your can buy then directly from farmers in Spain via crowdfarming - I'm seriously thinking of ordering a big box and preserving them (I've ordered mangos, oranges and persimmons from there before and all have been lovely). They say they'll arrive before Christmas, also.

DGRossetti · 13/12/2020 16:52

Given that no one really knows what "a deal" is supposed to look like, there's plenty of scope for both sides to claim to have prevailed at the end.

veeeeh · 13/12/2020 17:04

@DGRossetti

Given that no one really knows what "a deal" is supposed to look like, there's plenty of scope for both sides to claim to have prevailed at the end.
A deal means No Deal is gone. How long it might take to get the deal in place in another story, but let us hope that something other than the awful vista will be decided soon.

Anyway to pick up your point, each side will get something, but EU will not compromise on LPF and standards I think.

I suppose there will be a de facto extension as I understood that the decision had to be made by X date in order for EU to ratify it pre 31 December.

NoCryingInEngineering · 13/12/2020 17:05

@DGRossetti there is certainly something in all the various independence debates where there is a huge gap in understanding between those that are comfortable having >1 identity and those that aren't

ListeningQuietly · 13/12/2020 17:09

Mark Francois is trending because he has been cleared to attend the HoC next week
shall we say

ListeningQuietly · 13/12/2020 17:11

Just had a V V happy message from BigChoc about the SCOTUS / Texas ruling
She is well but staying well clear of our mess Grin

prettybird · 13/12/2020 17:38

Watching Sky News just now: BJ is definitely getting off on the adrenaline and attention that he is getting from the "Will We/Won't We No Deal" Drama. Envy

His smirks demonstrate that he thinks it's all a jolly jape Angry

DGRossetti · 13/12/2020 17:39

Australia's former prime minister Malcolm Turnbull has warned the UK to be "careful what you wish for" when it comes to EU trade.

quiteathome · 13/12/2020 17:42

For him it is a jolly jape. He and most of his ilk have enough wealth to weather the storm. It won't really affect him.

veeeeh · 13/12/2020 17:47

@quiteathome

For him it is a jolly jape. He and most of his ilk have enough wealth to weather the storm. It won't really affect him.
The leader of the country should be looking after the country's interest, not just his own and his cronies.
Original poster
RedToothBrush · 13/12/2020 17:57

Just added to the bbc news homepage

www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-55293595
Britons told not to stockpile food ahead of January

Bit fucking late for that!

(incidentally that suggests to me they know there is a lot of it going on...)

Past caring I'm afraid though. I have no faith in this government not to fuck it up!

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SabrinaThwaite · 13/12/2020 17:58

Since before they joined the Union I suspect

Texas has been under six flags. It makes Texans ... different.