Westminstenders: War and Weirdos

[RedToothBrush]

With weirdos set to run No10 and Trump seemingly having started a new war in the Middle East, 2020 already looks set to be a cracking year.

To start off your year, it turns out that chinese curse about interesting times is actually a fallacy...

en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/May_you_live_in_interesting_times

Happy New Year.

May we make 2030...

Yes - Frank, it does appear that many things things need to be clarified for many people, the Erasmus programme amongst them.

Now is the time that all who have concerns should put pressure on and get their concerns heard. All heads and persuasions should be involved in this - to get not only the best 'Leave Deal' but do as much as they can to form the UK Society that they wish to live in.

That is one of the Positives of Brexit - take this opportunity to form the UK you want to live in.

Until one of the posters who thinks its a good idea clarifies WHY they think it is a good idea
in Tangible, Measurable terms
The Brexit vote was only ever about immigrants for (I would now saw most) people. Even Ann Widdecombe just said as much.

form the UK you want to live in
If more people now think leaving the EU is a bad idea than the contrary, what do you suggest they do to "form" the UK they want to live in?

What about those who'd like to vote on whether they still want to be part of the UK and whose PM has just said, unilaterally, that they can't?

Where are the margins of manoeuvre to be found? (Other than in soundbites?)

There was a brief discussion about wanting erasmus continuity earlier but that wasn't a brexiteer contribution - for all I know they may want nothing to do with erasmus, horizon etc

Brexitiers want nothing to do with the EU, that's the whole point, they want to go back to the UK/EEC relationship pre 1973.

UK remains subject to all EU regulations 1 Feb 2020- 31st Dec 2020 (at earliest), but without any power to change the rules. I think they call that Brexit-in-Name-Only. I am baffled that 31st Jan 2020 is treated like a celebration moment. Do they realise they are celebrating BrINO?

Liam Fox was on radio today saying that FTAs weren't that important in trade negotiations. when Leave often campaigned about how useless EU was at negotiating "FTAs".

Auld, my best suggestion is that people look towards themselves to find their answers and not rely and look for others to provide answers for them.

Ken already knows their answers to Brexit questions and all about those that voted for it so he/she is already sorted.

"What about those who'd like to vote on whether they still want to be part of the UK and whose PM has just said, unilaterally, that they can't?"

I honestly don't know what you are referring to.

hate I am referring to the fact that the PM has just today said he will not consent to a second IndyRef despite the circumstances having changed drastically since the first one and Scotland being taken out of the EU against its expressed will.

TBH, I have little idea what you are referring to when you say people have to look to themselves for answers. If a gvmt you didn't vote for is driving the healthcare system into the ground, what do you do? Your own hip replacement?

That is one of the Positives of Brexit - take this opportunity to form the UK you want to live in.

Alea iacta est

Which the people who have decided what Brexit will look have already would understand as easy as they breath.

Oh please let the bell ringers go on strike. And that pro Brexit volunteers take their places with, say, 30 min training (to be on the safe side).

That is one of the Positives of Brexit - take this opportunity to form the UK you want to live in.

I wanted told live in a country that was part of the EU.
I didn't think the UK was perfect but I reckoned it was doing okay.
I don't see how I'm going to agree with the direction of travel that any Brexiteer thinks is a good idea.

I find that asking Leavers what they're looking forward to just produces answers of 'That's already been explained many times'. No specific bullet points.

Hate Now is the time that all who have concerns should put pressure on and get their concerns heard. All heads and persuasions should be involved in this - to get not only the best 'Leave Deal' but do as much as they can to form the UK Society that they wish to live in.
That is one of the Positives of Brexit - take this opportunity to form the UK you want to live in.

I think the problem is, nobody is listening to those concerned people, and hasn't done for 3.5 years. (And I thought the Brexiteers knew exactly what to do to get the best Leave Deal.)

Giving the people who wanted to remain in the EU the responsibility of 'forming the UK they want to live in' is a bit rich.
Most Remainers probably want the UK to be roughly the one that we had 4, or 10, years ago.

Hateisnotgood
That is one of the Positives of Brexit - take this opportunity to form the UK you want to live in.
And what realisable, understandable and measurable changes would you like brought in as a result of Brexit?
What will make it a success for you ?

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/eu_referendum_2016_/3795702-Westministenders-Canada-Plus-and-the-Transition-Phase?watched=1

New thread.

"take this opportunity to form the UK you want to live in"

Brexit enables those who want to tear away rights and standards to do so

The British Trump can create Singapore-on-Thames

Otherwise, if people do not want to tear all those safeguards away, there was nothing stopping them reforming the UK without going through Brexit

The best 'Leave Deal' will still be inferior to EU membership

What advantage or purpose is there in tearing up our relationship with the trade bloc that takes 45% of our exports
and gives us trade deals with other countries for about another 25% ?

Is this really all about cutting back on E27 immigrants - who are already being replaced by non-EU immigrants,
with much less security than E27 immigrants had and from countries with much lower wages
.... so more exploitable

What's the bloody point ?
Except to create a more compliant - and cheaper - workforce

So I won't shut up about the disaster that Brexit is

and in particular about the hardship and the running down of the NHS that nearly 10 years of Tory govt have caused and which BJ / cummings is continuing,

I'll continue to be "negative"
because there is very little to be positive about

Brexiters have not been able to show that Brexit can improve anything
or even to have actual plans or aims to make life better for ordinary people

It's all arm-waving or telling us to stop being so negative
Well give us something concrete to be positive about

The most popular reason for Brexit is so we don't have to hear about Brexit any more. It's like a mad teenage impulse. Let's shave our eyebrows off and drink half a bottle of Tabasco.

my best suggestion is that people look towards themselves to find their answers and not rely and look for others to provide answers for them

What a shit suggestion! are you for real?
If i'm being dragged out of something i want to stay in, then i'd have thought the very least i can demand is the idiots explain why?
But they can't, most wouldn't be able to spell "Sovereignty" if their lives depended on it.

my best suggestion is that people look towards themselves to find their answers and not rely and look for others to provide answers for them.
I voted for the answer I wanted.
Until I am given testable evidence that I was wrong I shall campaign for what I want

I wanted to live in an outward-looking international UK where my children would not be abused for being foreign. I had that. Now I don't.

Hate you are basically saying, as so many Leavers do, that the 48% should shut up and get behind Brexit like good little sheep. Not going to happen.

What a shit suggestion! are you for real?

Going by previous bilge-posts, no.

Spitting Image / Police said it well:

Every bomb you make
And every job you take
Every heart you break
Every Irish wake
I’ll be watching you…

Every wall you build
And everyone you've killed
Every grave you've filled
All the blood you've spilled
I’ll be watching you…

This is one politician who won't stop fighting just because the Tories won a GE

Labour's Alf Dubbs was on the Kindertransport, that brought Jewish refugee children to Britain to escape the Nazis

Child refugees: peer refuses to drop fight to keep protections

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/jan/14/child-refugees-peer-refuses-to-drop-fight-to-keep-protections

Ministers summon Alf Dubs to urge him to drop amendment to withdrawal agreement bill
.....
Lord Dubs, who has been fighting for improved protections for child refugees travelling alone since 2016, said
it was disgraceful to use child refugees as a “bartering chip” with the EU,

describing the move to drop the family union rights from the withdrawal legislation as a “betrayal of Britain’s humanitarian position”.

I'm a fan of Alf Dubs, too.