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Brexit
Original poster

Do all 365 Tory MPs want the same kind of Brexit

112 replies

fedup21 · 13/12/2019 16:51

Is it now just a case of Boris suggesting stuff and the Tories nodding it through or is there likely to still be lots of disagreement?

OP posts:
ListeningQuietly · 15/12/2019 19:43

MysteryTrip
How is the weather in your time zone ?

Peregrina · 15/12/2019 21:05

I think you have a rather distorted view of history MysteryTrip. Hitler thought that the UK would sit out his war, since we had allowed him to take Czechoslovakia with no opposition. When we did then declare war on Germany after his invasion of Poland he was taken by surprise. After France fell, contrary to common belief 'We' i.e. the UK were in it alone, were not, we then had a huge Empire which we relied on to provide troops and food, but they do rather get written out of our glorious 'We won' history. The US, as in WW1 were the Johnny come latelies to the war, not joining in until Pearl Harbor was bombed at the end of 1941, by which time we had had over two years of war. Hitler had already made a mistake and gone to war with Russia in June 1941, and by opening up this eastern front, took the pressure away from the western front.

Ireland was officially neutral although did allow us to overfly their country. I personally knew Irishmen from the Republic who served in the British Army,

AuldAlliance · 15/12/2019 21:25

I fail to understand the logic of claiming that no one in the US cares about the civil war in Ireland because it was so long ago and then promptly stating that the US will give the UK a trade deal because they saved the world from the Nazis together almost 80 years ago. (Even were one to accept the latter statement as fact...)

ElfAndSafeKey · 15/12/2019 22:10

Who cares? It took from 1939 to 1945 to prevent the World from being controlled by Nazi Germany. UK and US collaboration in WWII saved the world

You seem to be missing some vital bits of history.
Firstly, the Nazi stronghold began in 1933, in Germany. Austria was annexed in 1938. The Nazis didn't come from nowhere. It took the UK until 1939 to grow a pair of balls and tell them to stop invading other countries (ironic, really).
Second, the contribution of Russia to the ending of the war in Europe can not be understated, even if their methods were evil.
US wouldn't have given a fuck what was happening in Europe if Japan hadn't bombed pearl harbour, forcing them to declare war on the Japanese empire. Germany then declared war on the USA.

Peregrina · 15/12/2019 22:39

Quite ElfandSafeKey - the US attitude until they were forced into the war was 'why should we help Britain shore up its Empire?'

ElfAndSafeKey · 15/12/2019 22:42

The USA did benefit quite a lot from the post war loans to Britain though (finally paid off in 2006, IIRC).

MysteryTripAgain · 16/12/2019 06:36

How is the weather in your time zone ?

Same question was asked by Bellinisurge. Maybe you are the same person using different names?

I am in UK at moment. Timing was perfect. I was able to; vote for for Boris, see Labour get their worst election result since 1935 and Jo Swinson lose her seat.

Best of all was that those who had preached for 3 years that people had changed their minds over Brexit were proved to be wrong. Conservatives won by miles as they were the only party who recognised the will of the people was to leave the EU.

MysteryTripAgain · 16/12/2019 06:39

Ireland was officially neutral

Thought so

MysteryTripAgain · 16/12/2019 06:51

I fail to understand the logic of claiming that no one in the US cares about the civil war in Ireland because it was so long ago

This is answered by;

US wouldn't have given a fuck what was happening in Europe if Japan hadn't bombed pearl harbour, forcing them to declare war on the Japanese empire

Ireland is a population of an 5 Million. How will their demise in the event of a no deal departure by the UK from the EU impact the US economy whose population is 300 million?

Suggest you watch the QT episode of 4 April his year. It was stated that Ireland had dangerously overplayed their hand and that a no deal would have much more dire consequences for Ireland than he UK. A statement that the Irish MEP, Meread McGuiness, did not deny.

There was much laughter when one of the panel members stated if EU wants a border in Ireland let them get on with it.

Piggywaspushed · 16/12/2019 06:54

I am totally failing to understand what Ireland's role in WW2 has to do with anything.

MysteryTripAgain · 16/12/2019 06:56

The USA did benefit quite a lot from the post war loans to Britain though (finally paid off in 2006, IIRC)

Correct and that is the shared history between UK and US which is much more recent and remembered than the influx of Irish into USA centuries earlier. Also UK has supported US in modern warfare. Can’t remember Ireland doing the same?

Piggywaspushed · 16/12/2019 07:04

Is it really all about war to you??

MysteryTripAgain · 16/12/2019 07:05

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

Peregrina · 16/12/2019 08:38

Irish government who signed article 50 didn’t know what they were doing.

Which Irish Government was this? Theresa May signed it. When was the British Prime Minister last also the 'Irish' Prime Minister?

At least with this statement you have shown yourself to be completely ignorant.

MysteryTripAgain · 16/12/2019 08:53

Article 50 was signed in 2009 by all EU members. Tony Blair was UK PM at the time. Nothing to do with Theresa May.

Another desperate remainer clutching at straws trying to argue that Brexit should be cancelled.

Peregrina · 16/12/2019 08:54

May signed this in 2017.

Peregrina · 16/12/2019 09:08

A Remainer who knows a bit more history than some. Not one who believes that because they didn't see it, it didn't happen.

MysteryTripAgain · 16/12/2019 09:22

May signed this in 2017

Invoked in March 2017, but Article 59 was passed by EU in 2009.

MysteryTripAgain · 16/12/2019 09:23

Article 50, not 59

MockersFactCheckMN · 16/12/2019 10:23

Ireland was officially neutral.

As the saying went at the time, 'Sure we're neutral, but who are we neutral against?'

The answer to that question as far as De Valera was concerned came when he offered official diplomatic condolences on the death of Hitler, but not for Roosevelt.

Regarding the Americans, they did get a lot out of the UK in loan repayments, but not nearly enough to cover what they stumped up to pay for Labour's wefare state, NHS and all.

AuldAlliance · 16/12/2019 11:24

Mystery, you truncated my post, which doesn't help your credibility.

I suggested that it was illogical to claim the Irish conflict is ancient history no one gives a shit about if you then go on to claim that US/UK allegiances in 39-45 are key to understanding people's motives.

Peregrina · 16/12/2019 11:41

AuldAlliance - the problem for the UK is that they believe that the US/UK alliance from 1942 to 1945 does make the relationship 'Special'. The US doesn't think so, and hasn't done since 1945.

ListeningQuietly · 16/12/2019 11:52

Scroll on by

Piggywaspushed · 16/12/2019 11:54

I am finding your anti Irish sentiment quite unsettling mystery .

There were Irish soldiers who fought in WW2 and lost their lives.

Your demeaning of the Troubles is astonishing. The British treatment of Ireland is one of the biggest single contributory factors to Ireland's non participation in WW2.

On the whole, though, I can't even really follow what your argument is.

CrissmussMockers · 16/12/2019 13:13

Many brave Irish volunteers in WW2 who were ostracised after 1945 and only recently officially recognised.