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Brexit

Westminstenders: Election Special 3

999 replies

RedToothBrush · 13/12/2019 09:43

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CendrillonSings · 13/12/2019 21:15

Alsohuman

Me too, it’s really nice to be reminded that all Tories aren’t vile, goady, gloating little humbugs.

If you didn’t insist on being wrong about everything, you wouldn’t make it so easy for us! Grin

Do tell me more about how everyone loves Corbynite socialism and will totally vote for it.

BoreOfWhabylon · 13/12/2019 21:17

pmk

Alsohuman · 13/12/2019 21:17

🎶🎵🎶🎵🎵

TheOliphantintheRoom · 13/12/2019 21:17

Honestly, you need to take a step back and think about what 'thick' means

What makes you think I haven't given it a lot of thought over the years? In the context I used it (vox pox contributors) I am referring to people who are giving opinions which don't seem to be informed by anything other than the right wing press or BBC headlines without even questioning them. It's patronising of you to suggest that someone needs to be "operating at the level of a superstar LSE politics Professor" in order to seek out information to make a decision.

I was going to post something about why the Northern working class really aren't thick

I know they're not - I'm one of them.

But I can't really be arsed arguing anymore. I'm making myself sit through Newsnight later then that's it. Tomorrow I'll have a long walk with the dog then throw myself into Christmas preparations. Merry Christmas Westminstenders Xmas Smile

DGRossetti · 13/12/2019 21:20

Meanwhile, in an attempt to blot out reality without the heavy sedatives, we caught the first of the new "Grand Tour". Not as off topic as it might seem, when you see the stark reality of how changing climate is affecting real people in the real world. With Jeremy Clarkson cycling along admitting it's all happening.

Perspective.

yolofish · 13/12/2019 21:26

you know what cendrillon?

there are 'leavers' and then there are leavers.

all you do is post goady shit so no one respects you. on the other hand, louisecollins is prepared to engage and argue her case - we don't necessarily agree with her, but I think virtually everyone on this thread respects her input.

think on eh? (sorry, just had to put that out there... scroll on by etc)

SplitterBug · 13/12/2019 21:30

Some people mentioned Johnson could theoretically now afford moving towards a softer Brexit as he doesn't "need" ERG votes.

But what do we know about the new cohort of Tory MPs? What tribes do they fall into? In what proportions?

Sconio123 · 13/12/2019 21:32

Another thanks from here to LouiseCollins28 for the kind words

Haven't agreed with you much in the past, but you have shown yourself to be a decent human..

Unlike that other thing that keeps hanging around like a bad smell.

ArseDarkly · 13/12/2019 21:32

goady, gloating little humbugs

Brilliant use of the language Alsohuman - I can really picture the little buggers, bit like those slow fat flies that get trapped in your home in the Autumn, bump around on your windows then die on the sill.

Yolofish - there's no 'thinking on' for that one, it runs on bile and feeds on its own shit. Have to' feel a bit sorry for it really, it's got nowhere to go and can't even enjoy the massive Tory win it thought it wanted.

Poor wee gloaty humbug Sad

Jezebel101 · 13/12/2019 21:37

I'm a Brit (and also Irish since 2017) in Spain. I'm gutted but not surprised to be honest. I will be at the immigration office on 2 Jan to change the nationality on my residency card to Irish and when (eventually) my application is processed, I will be taking Spanish citizenship.

I think it's very dishonourable to use the privilege of being given Irish citizenship as a stepping stone to Spanish citizenship. It's not to be abused or used like that, surely? It puts little value on it.

It's sad to see GB engage is such a massive act of collective self harm and I completely understand the desperation many must feel seeing their country debase itself to the standards of debate and public discourse that the US has degenerated to since Trump was elected. I fear for the worst, but hope the best for the UK, although I don't think the UK will survive this new era with Scotland as a part of it. I suspect things will go badly with the EU negotiations with BJ at the helm, as ever. And nothing will be his fault, it'll be the EU (and probably specifically the Irish, those picky fellows who selfishly don't want a return to bombings and shootings), for not bending to his demands. He wants Brexit, but he wants EU states to pay the price of it.

Bleak times indeed, good luck to all. Even those who visited this darkness on their own country.

yolofish · 13/12/2019 21:43

*Yolofish - there's no 'thinking on' for that one, it runs on bile and feeds on its own shit. Have to' feel a bit sorry for it really, it's got nowhere to go and can't even enjoy the massive Tory win it thought it wanted.

Poor wee gloaty humbug*

Yes Arse I know you are right, but I just had the urge to bite back tonight [wine}

BirdandSparrow · 13/12/2019 21:50

I think it's very dishonourable to use the privilege of being given Irish citizenship as a stepping stone to Spanish citizenship. It's not to be abused or used like that, surely? It puts little value on it.
I don't know what you are talking about. And it seems you don't either. It's not a stepping stone.
I applied for Spanish citizenship in Jan 2017. I found out I was eligible for an Irish passport in summer 2017 (mother born in Belfast). So I applied for an Irish passport.
I have been waiting for my Spanish citizenship for 3 years now and it is still sitting in a drawer in Madrid somewhere. I have a photocopy of my application, that's it. I expect to have to wait another 1-2 years.
My residency card says British as that's the passport I got it with 20 years ago. So I'm going to have it changed to say Irish, as well as simply holding an Irish passport. Because pretty much everything here is based on your residency card.

AuldAlliance · 13/12/2019 21:52

Am a bit late, as I had friends, French and British, round tonight, numbing some grief with wine and trying but failing not to mention the GE.

Re John Smith:
He seemed to be PM material for some of the same reasons, I think, that Starmer and a few others do.
Because he wasn't entrenched and dogmatic but had principles and, if pushed, would come down clearly on one side of an argument. It's hard to imagine him approaching Brexit in the same way as Corbyn has, faffing about trying not to commit to anything. He'd have put paid to the anti-Semitism in the party. Perhaps ruthlessly, but it'd have been done.

And he was eloquent.
Few politicians are good speakers these days, but - to follow up on the "are Scots different?" debate earlier - Scottish politicians currently seem more eloquent than other UK politicians, IMHO.
I have noticed it before, listening to Alyn Smith, Nicola Sturgeon, Mhairi Black and others. Maybe it's because their use of language and their cadence are like mine, as a Scot, but I think it goes beyond that.
Boris waffles and lies; Gove talks shite and it's OK if yesterday's black is today's white; JRM condescends and insults; Corbyn havers.
Many Scots politicians are more precise, yet at times lyrical and therefore apparently heartfelt, in their use of language. They don't arse about and take people for fools.

Don't get me wrong, there are English MPs who are equally good: Jess Phillips, for instance, Yvette Cooper, Keir Starmer. Jo Cox was another. And Grieve and others who were ousted in favour of the bullshit brigade. Bercow, despite his failings.
People who have the courage of their convictions and the ability to convey them, cogently and convincingly.

Language does matter, fundamentally, to some - perhaps to a dwindling few.

I don't think very many of those who voted Tory think, deep down, that BJ is an honourable or a dignified PM. They are dimly aware that he's talking shite a lot of the time and that he is a condescending, entitled, lazy arsehole. But while he seems to be the least worst option, that'll do.
Sorry for the rambling post. Blame the French red wine...

ArseDarkly · 13/12/2019 21:53

Know what you mean Yolo! feel free to go and have another cathartic scream in the 'Fuck You' thread! Grin Wine

Piggywaspushed · 13/12/2019 21:54

I agree with you auld but Gove is Scottish! Or does he not count?

ListeningQuietly · 13/12/2019 21:55

Corbyn was a come to me
candidate
The world needs an I come to you
person
by Monday

AuldAlliance · 13/12/2019 21:57

Piggy, so was Tony Blair, in theory...there's a few black sheep in every herd ;)

AuldAlliance · 13/12/2019 21:58

I suppose I should say "is", not "was"...

Piggywaspushed · 13/12/2019 22:00

Tony was a Geordie really , when it suited him.

Peregrina · 13/12/2019 22:01

How Scottish are Blair and Gove? Isn't there a sort of Scotsman (mostly) who really thinks they are honorary English?

tobee · 13/12/2019 22:03

Out of interest, where do posters consider the south starts?

TatianaLarina · 13/12/2019 22:03

I don't think very many of those who voted Tory think, deep down, that BJ is an honourable or a dignified PM. They are dimly aware that he's talking shite a lot of the time and that he is a condescending, entitled, lazy arsehole. But while he seems to be the least worst option, that'll do.

They’ve made a pact with the devil though. Not that that BJ is the devil - more a deluded, dishonest, malevolent, shifty little turd.

It’s a bargain-without-knowing - either the true agenda or its consequences.

Apart from the disruption that Leave will bring over the next few years. I grinding slow analysis of people gradually realising they’ve been had will be very boring to watch.

AuldAlliance · 13/12/2019 22:06

I think for the likes of Blair and Gove, Scottishness is an optional extra, to be mentioned when it suits, but conveniently forgotten the rest of the time.

TatianaLarina · 13/12/2019 22:06

I’d say the south starts at Gloucestershire/Oxfordshire/Buckinghamshire.

RedToothBrush · 13/12/2019 22:08

The South starts when I get to m5 or the m1.

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