Westminstenders: It's like a bloody aviary

[RedToothBrush]

From Flamingos to Yellowhammer and Black Swans.

The Tory Remainer is now a Dodo. Instead the party in inhabited by disaster capitalist Vultures. Jeremy Corbyn, meanwhile, has been labelled by the right wing press as a Chicken. The SNP would very much like Boris Johnson to be a Jailbird. The LDs are keen to sing like Canaries about the contents of BlackSwan. The Br

And the Tower of London is starting to get very jumpy about the whereabouts and location of its Ravens.

I would not, however, advise eating urban wild pigeons if things get desperate, from what I know of their health.

Because he generally ignores what his party wants and goes with his own agenda.

As much as Boris ?

When I said Sam Gymiah becoming a libdem not very exciting I was referring to the fact that people guessed it and he was at least halfway there anyway.

I listened to him hosting On The House podcast (as recommended on here) it was good listening (although a bit under edited) But was a fun week they were reporting on - MPs losing whip etc etc. also my lifelong socialist mother met S.G and said he was lovely for a Tory.

the EU did say they'd be happy to negotiate a new deal if a new PM drops red lines

You’ve lost me there BCF

I specifically recall arguing exactly that with you back in March, ie if we changed our red lines I though we could negotiate a new WA and you insisted it wasn’t possible.

Are you talking about the WA here?

Because no ‘deal’ has been agreed yet so how can we negotiate a ‘new’ one?

The Can Can has been followed up by 'the marching song of democracy' ... the BBC has gone all subversive. Also there is a flying flamingo in the crowd.

That link showing Corbyn supporting a PV was from Tuesday, after parliament was suspended and after voting against a GE - prior to that I’m not aware of him committing to it

He's been committed to it since at least July, and before did vote for a second vote, but didn't commit to which side he would campaign for. Maybe you need to expand your reading sources?

As for why people would still vote for Tories, read above. There are still plenty who blame all their woes on immigrants and the EU, and these people don't care what facts are presented to them.

"what if Labour, as a Party, is neutral?"

It worked brilliantly in 1975 when Harold Wilson did that - and he was the canniest PM in my lifetime

All these objections are coming from people whose main belief is hating Corbyn
He's certainly not my choice, but he's far better than No Deal

As much as Boris?

As much as I despise BJ he has actually sacked those who don’t agree with him.

Corbyn just does his own thing regardless.

Some pp keep obsessing about Corbyn and on his position if we ever get the chance of a PV

However, it's quite likely that BJ will resign rather than request an extension

in which case all this Corbyn hatefest is doing is increasing the likelihood that the Rebel Alliance cannot agree on an alternative PM
i.e. No Deal on 31 October and a GE later

Listen Times change & the political map changes.

You may not have noticed but the Conservative AND the Lib Dem policy has changed.

I think you need to examine this inbuilt loathing/mistrust of change you have. I think it's based on a misperception of the deep imbalance towards Platonic Idealism that still runs through Western culture.

I like Newman's take on this: to be perfect is to change. He was, I think, right about this. Material things, including political things, change. It's our nature. And it's not evil. In fact, it's a kind of arrogance and a self-loathing to judge that change as though it is the failed attribute of the Divine.

He's been committed to it since at least July, and before did vote for a second vote, but didn't commit to which side he would campaign for. Maybe you need to expand your reading sources?

Clearly I do, but given July was 6 weeks ago and the referendum was 39 months ago, it’s possibly forgivable

Gyimah fillibustered the Turing Bill, he purposely blocked a bill that would have pardoned men prosecuted for being gay. There's nothing moderate about him.

Mail

That's interesting to know MrsMaisel.

These threads are amazing!

I'm serious about the change thing, you know.

I do think we see people who change their minds as wicked, disingenuous, lacking in conviction.

But there can be virtue in it.

And I think we give way too much credence and credit to values such as inflexibility which can really be authoritarian and a bit nuts.

It was twelve weeks ago BearBehind. And it's not like you've not been incredibly vocal throughout that time.

And we know you're a Tory. You voted for this shit shower, not us. You need to own the damage you caused.

fromJapan
Tory policy is disaster capitalism
LibDem policy is Bollocks to Brexit
Labour policy is ........

My MP is Labour and I think he's great, but he is too moderate for Momentum so is threatened with deselection
BUT
the seat is a marginal so momentum are being eejits

as are Corbyn / McLuskey and the ultra dangerous Milne

Everything comes back to Brexit!

I was listening to a podcast about plane crashes yesterday (yes, I know) and the host was talking about a pilot and co pilot with tonnes of experience flying, having made a decision, not changing that decision, despite good reasons to do so. And then killing themselves and over a hundred passengers. And the host mentioning human beings being psychologically hard wired to not change their minds once they've decided on something.

Bear I said new "deal", not WA

We very probably can't negotiate a new WA even in 2 or 3 years,
but we could in that time negotiate a very solid framework for a 3rd pillar EEA, Norway++
to put in the PD

If there is a solid majority in Parliament supporting the negotiations, then it would pass

*It was twelve weeks ago

Even if you say it was from 1st July it’s not 12 weeks. My point was it’s been more than 3 years to get this far so a few weeks isn’t life changing.

And we know you're a Tory. You voted for this shit shower, not us. You need to own the damage you caused.

I was a Tory. And it wasn’t because of their promise of a referendum. I didn’t cause this damage - those who campaigned and voted Leave did.

What’s with this obsession with blaming people now anyway?

Bear Do you share Cendrillon's preference for No Deal with BJ rather than Corbyn as PM ?

The selection process is mandatory. I think Labour was unusual in that it was the only Party without some way of deselecting MPs.

I think most of the ballots have returned votes to re-select sitting MPs without a re-selection. I suspect your MP will be fine.

Again - people seem to be painting the selection process as some evil, mad plot. It's not. It was a genuinely popular policy - not just with the more out-there wing.

I said new "deal", not WA

But there is no ‘deal’ now so how can there be a ‘new’ one?

As you’ve repeatedly said, the WA has to pass before we can get onto negotiating anything else.

I posted upthread the link to Corbyn promising a PV in May whatever the Brexit deal