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Brexit

Westminstenders: 30 days to save us all!

970 replies

RedToothBrush · 23/08/2019 00:28

It's quite remarkable to watch the British press atm.

It's like it doesn't understand English. Well only if its English spoken by foreigners.

Merkel made the observation that the UK had spent two years looking at the Irish border but had failed to come up with a workable solution, and now Johnson has waltzed in and made statements about how the backstop must go, and only has 30 days in which this can be achieved.

The British press writes this up as Merkel giving the UK a deadline to come up with a new solution.

Which is nonsense. The UK have a deadline to save itself, from itself and that's 31st October. This is a self imposed deadline.

Meanwhile comes out with the Brexiteer smack down that he didn't think the UK wS leaving the EU to regain its sovereignty only to become a vassalage or junior partner to the US.

Both these ideas being the result of leaving the EU have long been key issues. From before the ref. Both have been the UK's to solve in order to get the terms the UK wants from a deal.

The referendum was about choosing to align with the EU or to ditch that and rights and align closely with the US. Then Trump happened and the sell on this got harder, but still essentially the same. And it continues.

And then there was the Irish border. The magic solution to Brexit that doesn't break the GFA. I personally think there isn't one as long as the DUP have their red lines about the Irish sea.

So here we are. More than 3 years after the ref.

Leavers still have no plan. Apart for charge headlong over the cliff. Remains still have their heads wedged up their own backsides and also, after spending months criticising every one else on social media anyway who makes a stand again this bull shit.

Yet the newspapers fail to report what Merkel said or why the UK has this issue in the first place. Its an ongoing exercise in national delusion and self denial.

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DGRossetti · 24/08/2019 12:28

I wonder if a change of tack, and pointing out how Brexit will force the UK into having to back environmental vandals (like Brazil) might reach the parts other messages have so far failed to reach ?

With a caveat that I am getting a little teed off with this sudden Damascene awakening of green issues 40 years after my DM was getting into self sufficiency "to save the planet". I can now totally understand the comment about teenagers in the 60s thinking they invented sex Grin.

(My DF was less than impressed with DMs efforts, nothing that he had done everything possible in his life to avoid farming, as "it's fucking hard work". The irony being he's now quite happy growing his grapes, tomatoes and cherries ...)

woman19 · 24/08/2019 12:43

I wonder if a change of tack, and pointing out how Brexit will force the UK into having to back environmental vandals (like Brazil) might reach the parts other messages have so far failed to reach

It's happening already: extremely useful alliances being forged.

RedToothBrush · 24/08/2019 12:57

Beth Rigby@bethrigby
NEW: Tusk says Johnson won’t want to got down in history as “Mr No Deal Brexit” & warns EU “will not co-operate” on No Deal Brexit > So no mini-deals to ease No Deal exit. But also says EU“willing to listen to ideas that are operational, realistic & acceptable” to member states1/

The success of Macron/Merkel bilats (just reiterated by Tusk) is their willingness to engage, however futile that may prove. Gives PM bit of space with anti-No Dealers: They now split with some wanting to give him more time & others set on trying to block No Deal early Sept 2/

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woman19 · 24/08/2019 13:08

Being Mr Rainforest Destruction Collaborator looks even worse.

Stanley Johnson (Head of Prevention of Pollution Division at the European Commission from 1973 to 1979) will have told him that.

DGRossetti · 24/08/2019 13:33

Being Mr Rainforest Destruction Collaborator looks even worse.

Mind you, we can use that a bit. I was amused at yesterdays news (I briefly caught a bit of radio by mistake) where they were playing up how Boris was just as hardline as Macron and Merkel, following it immediately with Bolsonaro noted it was "unhelpful" in trade discussions.

The EU can afford to be hardline and hardball. The UK most definitely cannot.

Incidentally, anymore on the Galileo replacement ? No, I thought not.

BackInTime · 24/08/2019 13:36

I was as shocked as most of you when I heard the referendum result, but I do hope the UK does leave and makes a success of it — although not at the expense of peace on this island.

I seriously hope his application goes straight to the bottom of the pile along with any other hypocrites that voted Leave but don't want to deal with the inconveniences. FIL is a vocal Leaver who has been ignorant beyond belief about Ireland and NI (they should know their place and what's the big deal about a borderHmm) yet he is considering getting an Irish passport (his DGM was Irish) to avoid any inconvenience when he travels. I have made it clear if hie does this I will probably not speak to him for a long time.

woman19 · 24/08/2019 13:48

Latest Brexit trade talks with Brazil could ‘put rainforests at risk

Britain is sleepwalking into global ecological disaster if it continues with post-Brexit trade talks, campaigners have warned. Some of the worst fires in modern history are continuing to burn across the Amazon rainforest and the country’s right-wing leadership is being held largely responsible. Despite this, minister Conor Burns is currently in Brazil on a trade mission and has been accused of ‘cosying up’ to the government

Campaigners are urging the UK to follow other European countries in condemning President Jair Bolsonaro’s environmental record and suspend talks while the fires rage. Friends of the Earth campaigner Guy Shrubsole told Metro.co.uk: ‘The government needs to be putting the crisis of the Amazon front and centre of any discussions they are having about trade. ‘They need to say “we won’t do a deal with you if you are effectively condoning burning the lungs of the world.

Michael Gove talked about delivering a ‘green Brexit’ and so we should have no part in it. ‘There seems to be a global race to the bottom with this government by having discussions with ministers that are keen to see the Amazon exploited.

Environmentalists and academics have blamed the Brazilian government, under far-right President Mr Bolsonaro, for a sharp increase in Amazon deforestation. The climate change sceptic swept to power in January promising to open up the Amazon to mining and farming. His rhetoric is said to have emboldened farmers to burn large sections of the rainforest for beef and soy production. Camila Veiga of the Brazilian Association of NGOs said: ‘The fires are the consequence of a policy of environmental devastation, of support for agribusiness, of increasing pastures.’ Scientists have recorded more than 74,000 fires in Brazil this year – an 84% increase compared to the same period last year. They can now be seen from space and have plunged the largest city Sao Paulo into darkness because of the thick smoke. In total, the blazes have created a layer of smoke estimated to be 1.2 million square miles wide. Mr Bolsonaro sacked the head of the National Institute for Space Research (INPE) when the figures on fires became public

Yesterday he attempted to blame charities for starting fires in a bid to ‘make him look bad.’ Overcast and dark sky at Paulista Avenue, in Sao Paulo, Brazil, on the afternoon of August 19, 2019, with cold and light rain

The President has largely ignored international concern over the destruction of the Amazon, which covers some 2.1 million square miles. It is home to one million indigenous people, three million species of plants and animals and is key to tackling global warming because of the way it absorbs carbon dioxide and releases oxygen. Large fires have now been burning for around three weeks and an area the size of a football pitch is said to be lost every minute

Relations between Europe and Brazil are at a low, which has worried the powerful agriculture sector. Last week, Norway joined Germany in halting $60 million worth of Amazon protection subsidies, accusing Brazil of turning its back on the fight against deforestation. French and German leaders have also threatened not to ratify a trade deal between the European Union and Mercosur countries (Argentina, Brazil, Paraguay and Uruguay) to pressure Brazil into complying with its environmental pledges within the Paris Climate Agreement

^But the UK is attempting to forge closer ties and Metro.co.uk has learnt that earlier this week it launched a £20 million ‘trade facilitation programme to help Brazilian companies to export. It is part of a larger four-year programme in Brazil that will see the UK invest up to £80 million. Trade Policy Minister Conor Burns visited Rio de Janeiro and Brasilia and met with Marcos Troyjo Brazilian Special Secretary for International Trade and International Economic Affairs. The Department of International Trade said in a statement: ‘As the UK prepares to leave the EU on October 31, fast-growing markets like Brazil will provide significant opportunities for both UK businesses and households.’

Labour have condemned Mr Burns – a close ally of Boris Johnson – for failing to speak up during his trip. Shadow trade secretary Barry Gardiner said: ‘While Bolsonaro lets agribusinesses burn the Amazon, this week a UK Government minister has been busy cosying up to the Brazilian President’s officials. ‘Instead of posing for photographs with far-right Brazilian politicians, ministers should be calling on Brazil to do everything they can to protect the rainforest. ‘The Government must insist that Brazil honours environmental clauses in existing trade agreements and fulfils their commitments under the Paris Agreement

Campaigners have also said the latest move was a regulatory ‘race to the bottom’ as the UK tries to quickly do business pacts before Brexit leaves us without our biggest trading partner. Malaysia has offered Boris Johnson a ‘historic opportunity’ to strike a deal – provided the UK lifts restrictions on imports on palm oil imposed by the EU because of the crop’s environmental impact. The US has also promised the UK would be ‘first in line’ for a partial sector-specific deal. But this has prompted fears there would be a lowering of safety standards, highlighted by the potential mass importation of chlorinated chicken

Jeremy Corbyn to meet with other parties to hatch plan to block no-deal Brexit Mr Shrubsole said: ‘Brexit has increased our desire to do trade deals but it is causing us to be desperate. ‘We are not thinking about protecting our high standards or following good practice in terms of environmental protection, safety standards or human rights

Read more: metro.co.uk/2019/08/22/latest-brexit-trade-talks-could-put-brazil-rainforests-risk-10614537/?ito=cbshare?ito=cbshare

I'd sort of got used to brexit meaning no human rights, food, medicine, ability to get off the island.

But the no oxygen thing is really worrying.

Lucky that Greta Thunberg, ecology activists and the Green Party aren't on the rise across britain and the EU. Wink

Labour quick of the bat here, too, fortunately. Smile

DarlingNikita · 24/08/2019 13:52

PMK. Thanks Red.

wheresmymojo · 24/08/2019 14:18

Does anyone have Times access to read this article about Rory the Tory?

Have used up my free views this month

www.facebook.com/147384458624178/posts/2848111621884768?s=535681690&sfns=mo

missclimpson · 24/08/2019 14:47

I am just back from our annual village lunch (rural France). Up until now people have rolled their eyes a bit and joked about Brexit, but today everyone I talked to was saying what a catastrophe it is, how awful it must be for us etc. We have lived here for fifteen years so know everyone well, but the outpouring of sympathy took me by surprise.

BigChocFrenzy · 24/08/2019 14:54

BJ / No Dealers are UK Marmite - v popular in England, despised in Scotland, unpopular in NI

Britain Elects@britainelects

Westminster voting intention:

CON: 32% (+2)
LAB: 22% (+1)
LDEM: 20% (-)
BREX: 12% (-2)
GRN: 7% (+1)

CHUK: 0% (-)
UKIP: 0% (-1)

via @YouGov, 20 - 21 Aug
Chgs. w/ 14 Aug

======
BJ gives massive SNP surge, maybe winning nearly all seats as in 2015:

Scotland

SNP 46%
Lib Dem 16%
Con 15%
Lab 9%
Green 6%
Brexit 4%
Oth 3%

BigChocFrenzy · 24/08/2019 14:57

misclimpson I've also had a lot of sympathy, but here seem no worries about what will happen to Germany.

Obviously no German worries about food or meds, but at most a shrug about the economic impact.
So much for the Brexiter insistence on "but cars ....."

orangeshoebox · 24/08/2019 15:13

I'm in the netherlands
there is some worry about workload at the ports.

but atm more annoyance about the drunk tourists this weekend tbh.

DGRossetti · 24/08/2019 16:34

.

Westminstenders: 30 days to save us all!
theoriginalmadambee · 24/08/2019 16:38

Just checked Maersk freight, they are down-playing problems with uk ports massively. Have been since February. If I'm lucky I may get some insider information on their non official view of how to deal with this.

Have worked for them previously, I'm sure they have plans in place, but they will never tell though.

woman19 · 24/08/2019 16:41

DGR up till mid 2000s? there was an excellent eco research and Forest protection going on in Brazil. Just like what the King of Israel Wink has done to National Parks and Climate Change scientific research in US bolsonora is just the same but more dangerous because of where he is.
In Brazil.

woman19 · 24/08/2019 16:49

Our lovely Khan's London is becoming more and more adorable as this crisis goes on.

Westminstenders: 30 days to save us all!
DGRossetti · 24/08/2019 17:25

Maybe another hint of where no-deal is going ?

Incidentally, (as usual) you can completely ignore the shitrag that is the Mail and it's mysterious polling of "psychologists" in this matter.

Speaking for myself, I'll defer to my Ph.D toting DB, who once commented "the closer something is to you genetically, the less of a good idea it is to eat it".

Although unlike the average Daily Mail reader, I can also remember how BSE and CJD started.

DGRossetti · 24/08/2019 17:25

And typically, managed to forget pic for above ....

Westminstenders: 30 days to save us all!
NoWordForFluffy · 24/08/2019 17:40

Jesus, DGR! Fuck that. I'd go veggie - even vegan - before that!

Outsomnia · 24/08/2019 17:46

Cool the jets and lighten the histrionics lol.

Fight the fight to keep us in EU or at worst have a WA that keeps the peace in NI and all that. NO DEAL should be off the table stat.

That is my hope and wish. Obviously I would love to stay within the EU, but I may have to accept a compromise if it is not happening.

RedToothBrush · 24/08/2019 20:19

www.independent.co.uk/voices/northern-ireland-troubles-violence-police-bomb-dissident-no-deal-brexit-a9075286.html
Northern Ireland is already spiralling out of control but no one is paying attention
Scenes reminiscent of the Troubles are already happening – even before a no-deal Brexit threatens to throw fuel on the flames

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RedToothBrush · 24/08/2019 20:22

DH: DS wants to go to X. There's cheap trains to London on X day in November. Do you want to go?
Me: Have you lost your mind? There no way I want to go to London the week after 31st Oct.
DH: Oh. Yes. Its not a good idea is it?

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Hoooo · 24/08/2019 20:46

68 days....