Meet the Other Phone. Flexible and made to last.

Meet the Other Phone.
Flexible and made to last.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Brexit

Westminstenders: On An Election Footing

966 replies

RedToothBrush · 25/07/2019 16:22

Boris Johnson has set out his strategy.

He is challenging remain Tories to put their money where their mouth is, or to shut up.

His majority, soon to be just 1, is fragile but he intends to tough it out.

His Cabinet, is to all intents and purposes an ERG take over of the Tory Party, not unlike the Momentum take over of the Labour Party. And Johnson is looking to purge the party of its liberal wing, whilst pretending that he is liberal to make it acceptable to long term loyal Tories who might still waiver and merely vote for the rosette or like the veneer of respectability.

It has been made clear to Tory MPs that they will have to sign up to a No Deal Strategy should a snap election be called - or face the prospect of deselection. Disloyality will not be tolerated as Hunt's Cabinet backers all found out when they were sacked rather than be allowed to resign as Grayling was.

Instead Johnson reaped his revenge bringing back quitters and disgraced MPs as a deliberate 'fuck you' to moderates and remainers.

His message is clear and made all the clearer by the appointment of Dominic Cummings.

Today the Treasurery opened the piggie bank and told all departments to prepare for no deal. That is what is going to happen.

Parliament can not stop no deal. Johnson will drive it through regardless, even if its technically illegal. The default of no deal makes it an impossible juggernaught to stop without triggering a GE before the 31st October.

Technically speaking there are just 3 parliamentary days left this can be done.

And a GE is no guarentee of stopping no deal anyway. Cummings coming on board spells it out. Its a campaign strategy to reinvigourate the Leave Campaign and make all the promises that were made before. Of course there is no way of implimenting any of these before 31st October, so they just sound nice and people will believe them because they want to believe them. They want to trust and have hope for the future.

Yet with no trade deals and third party status, and crippling gridlock at ports and extra red tape for exporters and importers to deal with, it is inevitable that the economy will take a big hit. And Johnson's promises are expensive. His £39 billion he wants to withhold, is peanuts in the scheme of things and given what he is proposing.

The plan might sound nice, but it doesn't actually add up.

If we want a deal we will STILL have to sign up to conditions that Brussels sets out EVEN IF we no deal.

Meanwhile the US is ready and waiting to fleece us, because we aren't prepared to admit this and are too proud to see that this is a better option than have corporate American feast on the bones of the British economy.

Human Rights and Workers Rights are very much in the cross hairs with this. Health and Safety standards that have been set by London and then imposed on the EU will be burnt.

All the while the EU will be blamed for our own folly.

The worst thing is, people will actually buy it too.

Things are going to get a hell of a lot worse in this country, not because we lack optimism and hope, but because our egos are too big and we have been too idealist rather than recognising very real obstacles and finding ways to overcome than rather than just trying to ignore them. We will find out all those Paragraph Cs in good time the hard way because of the lack of attention to detail.

PFI and outsourcing will look like minor hiccups when the shit hits the fan.

I do hope that the puritians of the Labour Party and the Liberal Democrats and the Remain Referendum Campaign are happy. This is also their mess. They have spent 3 years naval gazing and still don't understand nor know how to respond. This is where a General Election becomes a very real danger because they are clueless as to how to combat a reunited Leave campaign.

Be careful what you wish for going forward.

OP posts:
Thread gallery
22
placemats · 27/07/2019 19:33

What a pleasant person you are @NoWordForFluffy

NoWordForFluffy · 27/07/2019 19:37

There is an LSE blog that claims the HoC could also Revoke, but this is disputed by most other legal opinions I have read.

I just read that, BCF. Shaky ground, I'd think.

Though as there isn't anything written in stone about how we deal with this, then I'd like to read more legal opinions. Do you have links, @BigChocFrenzy (yes, Google is broken!)?

@placemats, when you deliberately use a wrong name for a person, you're being disrespectful. Therefore, you're not that nice yourself.

placemats · 27/07/2019 19:40

I don't get emails when you @ me.

I will not take what entails being a nice person from someone like you

Fluffy. I'll save you the email alert.

placemats · 27/07/2019 19:46

Alsohuman Smile

placemats · 27/07/2019 19:48

Your reasoning and comprehension skills lead me to decide you're a leaver.

Which is nice.

Please listen to yourself. Would you say that to someone in real life? I certainly wouldn't.

I really don't mind if people mispronounce my name, in real life that is. It totally wouldn't bother me.

BigChocFrenzy · 27/07/2019 19:51

fluffy Until the Miller case, it was thought that the PM had the right to Invoke on his own as well

The reason given in the Miller decision that Parliamentary approval was also required was that Invoking removes rights (e.g. FOM)

BUT
Even that case was considering whether Parliament was required as well as the PM, not instead of.

Until Remainers became desperate, noone had suggested that treaties could be handled without the PM
International treaties are totally different from domestic law, where the HoC has more powers

Under our Constitution, it is the PM under inherited powers from the Monarch, who makes or breaks or modifies international treaties

The Miller case has shown that the HoC can block a PM doing this under certain circumstances,
but no case has yet been brought to ask if the HoC can do this itself without the PM

BigChocFrenzy · 27/07/2019 19:54

Also, if anyone e.g. Jo Maugham, wants to go through the courts to clarify this, they have left it very late to do so

BigChocFrenzy · 27/07/2019 19:55

The one weapon the HoC have left to stop No Deal is to get rid of this PM via VoNC and choose another PM within 14 days, who would Revoke

HesterThrale · 27/07/2019 19:59

Is Dominic Cummings eye-wateringly rude, or what? (About the ERG.)

twitter.com/jdportes/status/1153948902418239490/photo/1

placemats · 27/07/2019 19:59

But the MSM is explaining this new Government (yes, I know it is) as if leaving on the 31st October is a 'campaign'. It's not a 'campaign'. Johnson & Co have inherited May's mess and no amount of power washing will get rid of it. It can't be swept under the carpet. Hiding your head under the sand isn't a good idea.

Perhaps Fluffy thinks I'm stupid because I'm Irish and quite obviously anti DUP.

placemats · 27/07/2019 20:06

Dominic Cummings is an agent provocateur.

LonelyTiredandLow · 27/07/2019 20:16

BCF I'm with you. We need a GE before B.Day with a LDem majority to revoke. It's the only direct way, based on a vote with a clear intention that hasn't changed for 3 years. It is far clearer than the leave vote ever was, that's for sure.

JustAnotherPoster00 · 27/07/2019 20:19

We need a GE before B.Day with a LDem majority to revoke

We know thats just a fantasy right? Theres is no way LD's are gonna get enough to be the majority but what you are gonna get is a condem brexit

LonelyTiredandLow · 27/07/2019 20:19

Ah well Cummings has his fave people as work colleagues once more then Grin

He's just an angry little man who can't stand being told No IMO.
You would think having a child would make him think a little more about what he is leading this country, and his potential grand children, into.

LonelyTiredandLow · 27/07/2019 20:21

Just yes, I agree it seems a little too far off to be a realistic option, but it would do the job (one of the few real ways of getting it done).

tobee · 27/07/2019 20:27

Oh I was really enjoying myself on this thread , I've been relying on you for my news, not yet being able to look at the msm for some days now although ds has just given me a resume of other stuff:- a fraudulent clown 🤡 on a cruise ship? And now everyone's descended into arguing and insults again!!

tobee · 27/07/2019 20:28

Stupid cross out fails there!!

LonelyTiredandLow · 27/07/2019 20:31

That cruise ship though; enough to make you mentally promise yourself you'll never ever consider going on one. I felt weird waving a flags at a Proms style event last summer...that cruise would be my idea of hell. So many pink people. So many men with no tops on. The smell of sweat was almost palpable.

I'll stop there.

tobee · 27/07/2019 20:37

Envylonely

Peregrina · 27/07/2019 20:37

We need a GE before B.Day with a LDem majority to revoke

With the best will in the world, I don't think that is going to happen, but with LibDem, SNP, PC, Green and a rump of Labour it could be possible.

LonelyTiredandLow · 27/07/2019 20:41

Yes, I am sure LD won't get a majority but I do think they could ignore any calls not to revoke - my friend thinks they would call another ref but I disagree - LD have been bitten by not sticking to their manifesto before.

LonelyTiredandLow · 27/07/2019 20:43

tobee I'm assuming that is not a emoji Wink
Is there a dripping stinking armpit emoji?

NoWordForFluffy · 27/07/2019 20:47

Perhaps Fluffy thinks I'm stupid because I'm Irish and quite obviously anti DUP.

  1. I didn't know you were Irish;
  2. Even if I had, I'm not racist so don't think that Irish = stupid;
  3. I've not noticed you being anti-DUP. But then I've not really noticed your name at all until this thread, and maybe the last one. So I've literally no idea about you, other than the impression you're giving on this particular thread.

Anyway, I can't be arsed with you any more.

Thank you, BCF. I knew the Miller case had asked the question and that some people want the judgment to say something it doesn't. It would be interesting to test what the HoC was allowed to do without the government / PM agreeing.

If JM thought there was a solid case for him to argue that the HoC could act unilaterally, I would have expected this to have been exploited before now. However...the indicative votes suggested that support wasn't there to revoke anyway.

I'm thinking that there may be plotting from all factions during this break. While they may not be sitting, I do think that there will be loads of head scratching / legal brain storming going on!

Iambuffy · 27/07/2019 21:03

Jesus fluffy

I'm like you!!??

I must repair to some some sort of retrear and rethink my entire life view! 🤣🤣🤣

(Only kidding. You're awesome and sane)

DGRossetti · 27/07/2019 21:08

Oh ffs, can we please forget Roman Britain?

Or maybe the reverse. There's nothing about the current situation any Roman wouldn't recognise from their own history. An elite is trying to establish an imperial line.