Westminstenders: Pragmatism versus Purity

[RedToothBrush]

There is one question for the HoC in the next week and that's will you persue pragmatism or purity?

May looks as if she is being sidelined after a backbench withdrawal of support, the DUPs withdrawal of support and an omminous silence eminenating from the Cabinet.

Her speech on Thursday where she pitted the people against parliament has been her last mistake. She's now a danger to the country's stability and the safety of MPs.

The priority for the week is to pass the SI to change the UK exit date from 29th March to the EU's new terms.

After that, with May's deal stuffed due to lack of support and a Bercow ruling it looks like we are facing some sort of indicative free vote. This seems to be being supported by ministers in government regardless of leave or remain.

The prospect of a Tory Leader Election contest looms. It remains to seen if that can happen in the next three weeks with so much else at stake. But this is the Tory party.

The penny seems to be finally dropping about the reality of leaving the EU and how we leave the EU. A week before we were due to go. The incompetence of Parliament is laid bare in all its glorious full scale.

The Mary Rose exhibition at the Portsmouth Historic Dockyards is excellent - loads of info on the crew including facial reconstructions etc.

It's on the to-do list. Last time we were that way was 'vanning days with DS and I don't think the exhibition was open. DW has a happy memory of being able to crawl around HMS Victory - sadly no longer possible.

It's fascinating how when you stick a spade in the ground, you realised how much of our "history" is more a record of propaganda. Which makes me curious as to whether there was a Remain/Leave bias amongst people in professions like that where all sources of evidence get minute scrutiny ?

For all the UKIP shite, what the fuck were Roman Africans doing in Britain ? That's some seriously impressive multiculturalism going on there. In the greatest empire the world had seen up until that point. Is it too controversial to suggest they're causal ?

Found this off Laura Kuenssberg:

Graeme Cowie
@woodstockjag
Key Brexit debates in the Commons this week:

CONFIRMED
Monday - “Next Steps”

HIGHLY LIKELY:
Wed/Thurs or (possibly) Fri - SI on changing “exit day”

ANTICIPATED BUT UNCONFIRMED:
Tues/Wed or Thurs - a 3rd meaningful vote

DEPENDS ON MONDAY RESULT:
Wednesday “Indicative Votes”

Wed/Thurs or (possibly) Fri - SI on changing “exit day”

Didn’t somebody say the SI would have to be brought by Tuesday at the latest as it takes a few days to implement, go through the Lords etc?

Im hoping the 1 good thing thats going to come eventually off the back of this hopefully PR by I dont think thats coming yet is that the HOC eventually under a future government is going to legislate for greater powers if the executive decides to go rogue as this 1 has

Not sure why the fuss over the SI ? Parliament can simply pass a retrospective law legalising whatever wasn't legal at the time, to head off any court challenges.

They've done it before, lest we forget.

Article on today's possible amendments

www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/brexit-vote-today-theresa-may-deal-letwin-amendment-explained-a8838321.html?amp&utm_medium=Social&utm_source=Twitter&__twitter_impression=true
Brexit: Which amendments are MPs voting on today?
Letwin amendment would pave the way for ‘indicative votes’ on wide range of Brexit options

Votes expected to start at 10pm tonight

In least-surprising-announcement-on-this-thread news - I’m confused.

Why are we waiting until Wednesday, Thursday or possibly even Friday for the SI?

OK, cross post. So the SI doesn’t matter at this stage DG?

Yes I watched the Mary Rose programme. Utterly fascinating and better than I expected. It makes you wonder just how much white washing went on during the Victorian Era.

We know so little of our past but think we know a lot more than we do.

Why are we waiting until Wednesday, Thursday or possibly even Friday for the SI?

Because Theresa May is prime minister and the Tory Party are in government.

?

Must make a note to watch that documentary. I love things like that.

Both Francis Pryor and Mary Beard have been tweeting the petition and encouraging people to sign.

Re: History
Am always surprised that 'The Plantagenets' are hardly studied in the English History Curriculum considering that they inspired Shakespeare and that the Lancastrian and Yorkists are branches of the family.

splasho.com/petitions/index.php?petition=241584&sfns=mo

See

Exhibition at the NPG on Shakespeare and Plantagenets.

The above message was meant to say see the petition as a graph updating in real time.

So the SI doesn’t matter at this stage DG?

Not quite what I said .

Ultimately, parliament has no restrictions in law. Nothing can override it Not even international law should it so decide. So if a few weeks down the line, there emerges a court case around the fact that a certain state of affairs existed at the time which the lack of an SI made the government liable for, then parliament can simply pass a law saying "that was the law a few weeks ago" and stop the case.

It's pretty much what they did when Workfare was found to be unlawful. They scuttled back and passed a law making it lawful and thus making sure no one could sue the DWP for it.

There are only two real sanctions on what parliament can do. Royal assent (or lack thereof) and the impact in international relations. Ultimately parliament can repeal the ECHR - or any statute law, and pass a law breaking a foreign treaty (e.g. GFA).

The ECA (European Communities Act) 1972, which is scheduled to be repealed on 29 March, makes all EU law binding

Since the extension to 12 April is an international agreement, we'd still be in the EU, but in even more of a muddle than now
(yes, it is possible)

The SI is to change the date from 29 March to whenever - or to leave the date unspecified this time, which would infuriate Brexiters !

The Monday SI deadline came from multiple, usually reliable sources e.g. the Times, FT, Guardian

However, there are ways round most things when a PM is sufficiently authoritarian

I just hope she hasn't been outsmarted by Brexiters - or herself

The deadline might even be because the civil service, HMRC, the judges, courts etc need a bit ot notice about which set of laws to use from 30 March ?

Love the graph.

And of course, the ERG will go full blast to obtain an HoC vote for No Deal on 29 March or before 12 April - v unlikely to succeed -
but if they did then that would apply

Parliament can simply pass a retrospective law legalising whatever wasn't legal at the time, to head off any court challenges.

But would that not put any kind of decision made prior to the SI at risk of legal challenge? Or give TM an excuse to ignore whatever parliament instructs her to do —not that she needs one—?

Genuine question. I’m just a measly EU citizen forced into an intense crash course in British politics. And I’m terrified.

The deadline might even be because the civil service, HMRC, the judges, courts etc need a bit ot notice about which set of laws to use from 30 March ?

The scope for unlawful arrest or imprisonment is interesting. Of course wrongful convictions aren't compensated anymore, so it's not too much of a worry to get it right anyway.

Much more interesting will be the instructions given to the systems handling data ....

But would that not put any kind of decision made prior to the SI at risk of legal challenge?

Yes. But as I said, as long as parliament passes a law making it legal then then it's legal.

I was a tad incomplete upthread. The only other thing parliament cannot do is to bind a successor parliament. Which is one of the reasons we have treaties between nations. Like the GFA, for example.

Just dropped an email to my Tory whip MP pointing out that the current number of signatures on the revoke petition eclipses his majority by a factor of 15

www.independent.co.uk/voices/theresa-may-brexit-no-deal-article-50-revoke-house-of-lords-kennedy-bill-a8834141.html

The House Of Lords have a plan to revoke Brexit.
Maybe better informed minds than mine could look at it.

In his constituency, obviously. My maths isnt that bad!