In all likelihood, what do you think will happen?

[Holidayshopping]

I have spent months hoping for a PV and then May revoking A50, and I still would like that to happen, but I’m starting to think now that she thinks there are too many people who just want Brexit no matter what!

I THINK that there will be an extension and then still no one will be able to agree on a plan. I can see a General Election being called soon as well-maybe with increased support for a centralist party?!

"Surely, annoyance with EU red-tape was a main driving force behind the Conservative Brexit Campaign - not xenophobia as you seem to think. Odd that you didn't know that"

Red tape will increase following brexit even with a very favourable deal.

The driving force behind it was immigration, the driving force behind UKIP's rise was immigration.

Vote leave heavily targeted people with the Turkey joining and 75m immigrants coming here adverts.

Clearly you both know more than the Institute of Cancer

Where does the Institute of Cancer say that cancer drugs should be tested on kids who don’t have it, as your article suggests should happen?

Children’s cancers have received little in the way of new treatments, a finding the authors put down to drug companies failing to invest in these rare conditions

Indeed, for-profit companies don’t tend to invest millions in things that won’t return a profit. That’s why there’s orphan drug status that gives financial incentives to do this. In the EU it’s easier to gain marketing approval for an orphan drug.

Sorry my mention of 900 lost EMA jobs upthread should have been 1,000 according to The Guardian and the pharmatimes...Steve Bates, chief executive of the BioIndustry Association. The decision “means a 1000 high quality jobs leaving the UK, disrupting a thousand families as a direct result of Brexit, with implications for thousands more. Businesses now need certainty. The best way to do this is by an early agreement to a transition timeframe and continued close regulatory co-operation.”

http://www.pharmatimes.com/news/emamoveelondonslosssisamsterdamssgain1212096

Also I'm a bit confused - did we need to leave the EU because Cornwall tourism was suffering?

I thought that The West Country struggled to cope with any more tourism?. All 66 million of us just don't fit in there for our summer holidays? There's not enough acccomodation on Air b n b.

Visit Cornwall (tourist board) stopped promoting certain beaches because of acute overcrowding.

Cornwall hit by 'tourist overcrowding' amid UK heatwave www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-cornwall-45147541

Let's quote Clavinova's link:

Richard attributes the booking mania to weather, Brexit and investing in technology.

“Last year’s sunshine definitely had an immediate effect, with visitors keen to organise their 2019 holidays well in advance,” he said. “Brexit is the other major factor, especially with all the uncertainty around whether or not a deal will be in place before we leave the European Union at the end of March.

“People who normally take their dogs abroad, for example, are worried that their EU pet passports will no longer be valid - meaning they’ll need to plan months ahead if they want to take their pets away with them. Cornwall is a much safer choice of destination in those circumstances – and one that doesn’t involve prolonged customs checks and potential air and sea transport problems.

“The weak pound is clearly playing a part in holiday decision-making, too, as it’s making it more expensive to venture beyond the UK.”

Weak £ making holidays more expensive, doubts about taking pets abroad, worries about customs checks.

OK - good weather, not necessarily repeatable this year, but a product in part of global warming, which few MPs in the UK seem interested in.

Plus the firm has innovated. I wonder if landladies in Blackpool and Skegness will report increased bookings?

It doesn't quite fit with 'We hold all the cards'. 'They need us more than we need them'.

It would however be an extremely ill wind if absolutely no one benefitted.

mmmmmmm the Conservative Govt campaigned to stay IN the EU

OK - Conservative Brexiteers and other business people (not necessarily the ones listed below.)

EU red-tape has been a problem for decades.

www.gov.uk/government/publications/cut-eu-red-tape-report-from-the-business-taskforce/cut-eu-red-tape-report-from-the-business-taskforce

Many reports have been written about removing European rules, including by European governments and the European Commission.

This isn’t the first such report and it won’t be the last.

Yet for all the reports, change is still needed. We therefore call on the British and European governments, on the European Commission and the European Parliament to implement our findings. For while this report is written by businesspeople and for the British government, its recommendations, if implemented, will benefit all of Europe, helping firms start, employ staff, grow, expand, innovate and export.

•Marc Bolland - Marks & Spencer
•Ian Cheshire - Kingfisher
•Glenn Cooper - ATG Access
•Louise Makin - BTG
•Dale Murray, CBE - Entrepreneur and Angel Investor
•Paul Walsh - Diageo

Businesses have repeatedly called for relief from an endless stream of new EU regulations, rules and requirements which create unnecessary complexity and costs in their day-to-day operations

We have seen numerous examples of legislation being brought forward by Brussels which does not add value–for example, overly prescriptive requirements around safety signs, or how olive oil may be provided in restaurants.

We also see EU rules which are disproportionately costly for business–especially small businesses–without any evidence of benefits.This seems to be particularly prevalent in proposals stemming from negotiations between the social partners. For example, recent proposals on ergonomics and on hairdressers would have placed extortionate costs on SMEs if implemented. Legislation which is brought forward through the social partners process must be subject to all of the same checks and balances as other proposals.

And all too often we see the EU adopting a highly risk-averse approach to new and innovative technologies and products. If we are to remain globally competitive, the EU must not introduce unnecessary barriers and restrictions which stifle innovative industries.

etc. etc.

Yes, a number changes were implemented on the back of this report - but perhaps the EU should have acted sooner. EU red-tape is listed as one of the Euro Myths - clearly it isn't.

Sorry my mention of 900 lost EMA jobs up thread should have been 1,000 according to The Guardian

The EMA's annual report for 2017 states 60 employees with a UK nationality - the rest come from all the different EU member states.

We actually see numerous examples where a rule is made in Brussels, which the UK as a member has agreed to, shock horror, might easily have proposed itself.

We have also seen UK governments happy to slash existing red tape e.g. H & S rules - Grenfell anyone? Rules which had roughly been in place since the Great Fire of London. Clever hey?

The EMA's annual report for 2017 states 60 employees with a UK nationality - the rest come from all the different EU member states.

Your arguments are wearing thin Clavinova, my Danish dentist's wife who still works for the EMA, was also Danish. They had lived in the country for at least 17 years that I knew of, that being the time my dentist was with his practice, but had been in the UK for a few years before that. Prior to working for the EMA, his wife had been a GP in the UK. I don't doubt that others were similar i.e. living, working, paying taxes in the UK and would have continued to do so for a good few years longer. But only British jobs matter! Instead the Brexit zealots have chased out well qualified medical staff.

Peregrina

Instead the Brexit zealots have chased out well qualified medical staff.

You are being overly dramatic.

I have lots of lovely friends, acquaintances and a few relations
from all over Europe (most of them professionals) - they are not remotely wound up about Brexit as you are.

The red tape argument is rubbish.

Dig deep into it and you find that a large p[proportion of the costs attributed to the EU are international agreements such as the Paris Climate agreements and others.

Then you have things like the data protection act, and others which are on things like rules of origin, protected status etc.

When you get down to the ones "we" would like to cut, it always turns out to be employment and health and saftey regulations.

However leaving the EU seems to be making busiensses think that there would be more red tape too.

www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2018/09/13/business-fears-swamped-red-tape-no-deal-brexit/

You really are a patronising arse for someone with such little intellect Clav.

There are recruitment crises going on in the NHS and other industries because of Brexit.

www.independent.co.uk/news/business/news/brexit-hurt-recruitment-uk-firms-skill-crisis-cbi-a8660941.html
www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2019/01/03/economy-stasis-brexit-uncertainty-reigns-recruitment-crisis/

The travel industry is massive. It is more than Cornish cottages.

Holiday companies & airlines all provide people with jobs. They are reporting being hit hard atm.

The EMA's annual report for 2017 states 60 employees with a UK nationality - the rest come from all the different EU member states.

I thought that was what was implied upthread, but then I thought "surely people aren't as callous as to genuinely think that hundreds of people having their jobs disrupted doesn't matter if they're foreign" - but nope, my first thought was correct and seeing who posted it, I'm not surprised.

That's leaving aside the knock-on effects of losing the expertise, the wider businesses and economy, the disruption for families.

And while I'm at it, I wouldn't mind checking the line of reasoning again: EMA is bad and holding Great British Medicine back, because EU red tape ￫ therefore EMA leaving is a Brexit benefit ￫ but we're hoping to pay to rejoin it ￫ paying to rejoin the EMA is also a Brexit benefit?

Brexit puts 25,000 travel industry jobs at risk, coalition warns

"The SBIT survey found British companies are likely to post around 7% fewer British staff overseas this season. Roles affected will largely be held among the 18 to 24 age bracket".

"Companies further stated apprenticeship or training programmes would be affected too, resulting in less training and job opportunities for young people."

www.ttgmedia.com/news/news/brexit-puts-25000-travel-industry-jobs-at-risk-coalition-warns-15033

The young pay the price.

Come on you don't really expect clav to have an argument that makes sense do you?

Oh and the cost of setting up a UK medicines agency will be significantly higher than that of the EMA, and involve a vast amount of increased paper work, most likely to have regulatory alignment with our biggest market - The EU- and be a rule taker anyway.

Copy and paste arguments to come...

"surely people aren't as callous as to genuinely think that hundreds of people having their jobs disrupted doesn't matter if they're foreign"

As far as I can tell, the Dutch government have offered a generous relocation package to EMA staff - over and above other EU contender countries/cities - which is probably why Peregrina's dentist is following his wife to Amsterdam and retiring. Many of the EMA positions are 5 year contracts - staff are probably used to coming and going.

As I've already said - the EMA have left town already - it's rather a moot point now.

You really are a patronising arse for someone with such little intellect Clav.

Love you too Boris.
Actually - I'm going out for lunch soon .

{Actually - I'm going out for lunch soon }
'Leavers' have been out to lunch for 3 years.

Right, so the EMA leaving is a Brexit benefit because:

1. We want out of the EU anyway;
2. They're holding back our Great British Medicine with red tape;
3. We don't give a shit about foreign nationals suffering disruption so out of hundreds of jobs and knock-on effects, only 60 British citizens are actually worth thinking about;
4. But it's great for foreign nationals to get relocation packages;
5. It's also great for us to consider paying to rejoin the EMA despite (1) and (2)...

Hey, this is fun - can we do one of these lists of oxymoronic Brexit Benefits for Galileo, EURATOM and so on?

For what it is worth I just looked up the EMA 2017 report and it confirms
before the move EMA agency staff numbered 908: 645 women, 263 men and yes those 908 potentially losing their jobs came from a range of nationalities.

Of course some staff are able to move to Amsterdam but that's still up to 900 families still potentially not working and spending in the UK.

But its pretty absurd though to just look at the EMA and try and minimise the jobs lost due to Brexit though isn't it? I don't know why anyone would try and deny the absolute fact of severe job losses? The government's own report estimates that:

1. On a No Deal - a minimum of 2,800,000 jobs will be lost.

2.On a comprehensive free trade agreement a minimum of 1,750,000 jobs lost. 3.On a single market softer Brexit a minimum of 700,000 jobs lost.

But of course the job losses are already snowballing.Do look at this if you haven't already...

docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/e/2PACX-1vTIPx0lI6pb-3Tn-3D6uNJNyKcCd-A8uPMxViagyJAR9T87ZmnSdAEPCzp5ljlNYoUNdxJiJqQdBm7b/pubhtml?fbclid=IwAR1vjCtN5KsttCkeOyBqiit9M0Ot7DOEqMTul9AgepPuDcTALZnafM5cqqk

Clavinova - there are issues with EU regs affecting businesses that do not export to europe, however, the businesses they do deal with may well export or import from EU.

The whole point of the EU is that a business in Plymouth can sell to Paris as easily as it can to Peterborough.

Anecdotally, a business friend of mine, says the rules and regs from the UK govt are far more onerous than those originating from the EU..... he exports to EU and has laid off 15 workers (all British!) as he has shifted warehousing to mainland europe.

No matter how many times asked, no leaver seems to be able to come up with concrete advantages but to be fair to you, you've given it a good go! maybe a 3/10.

.

Red tape arguments are a complete non starter. Running a country involves plenty of red tape whether you being to a particular trading bloc or not.

When any Tory talks of doing away with red tape -they want rid of workers' rights or goods standards. Some regulations mean slightly less profit to be made because certain standards for workers or consumers have to be met. Why do we want to do away with standards?

Does anyone remember the employee shareholder scheme admittedly brought in under George Osbourne -not Phillip Hammond.
It was in the Growth and Infrastructure Act 2013 and nothing to do with the EU. It was entirely Westminster derived. Basically an employee shareholder could give up certain employment rights in exchange for £2,000 of tax free shares which were exempt from capital gains tax. it was a complete regulation nightmare. There was loads of fuss over it in an HR context. Only for the government to remove it quietly in 2016 because take up rates were so low due to the absurd complexity.

The amount of legislation and regulation needed for Brexit is of an unimaginable scale.

redtape

Clavinova
What is this Institute of Cancer of which you speak?
sounds about as real as Brexit planning.

Is it just a coincidence that Welsh holiday cottages are advertised when I'm on these threads. Cornwall is fully booked you see.