Active discussions

Meet the Other Phone. Flexible and made to last.

Meet the Other Phone.
Flexible and made to last.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Talk
Brexit
Original poster

Westminstenders: Stuck in the Middle With TIGGERS

991 replies

RedToothBrush · 20/02/2019 14:20

Well I don't know how we got here tonight.
We've got the feeling that something ain't right.
We're so scared as we leave the EU
And we're wondering how we'll get out of this stew

Antisemites to the left of me!
Dog Whistles to the right!
Here I am stuck in the middle whilst we leave the EU.

'Cause I'm stuck in the middle whilst we leave the EU.
And I'm wondering what it is we should do.
It's so hard to keep this smile from my face.
Losing control and running all over the place.

Clowns to the left of me!
Jokers to the right!
Here I am stuck in the middle whilst we leave the EU.

When you started off with rights
And you're starting to wonder if thats for life.
And all the politicians come crawling
Slap you on the back and say
Please . . .
Please . . .
Vote Leave and back EU Withdrawal

But we see it makes no sense at all.

Best to keep your money offshore
Than to visit the bookstore

Deniers to the left of me!
Islamaphobes to the right!
Here I am stuck in the middle with you.

Its finally happened. FINALLY.

MPs have seen that their leaders have lost the plot and are hell bent on destruction and politicial ideology ahead of practicality and will justify the unjustifable in the face of democracy and they have jumped ship.

Enter stage left and stage right: The TIGGERS - members of The Independent Group.

Will there be more. Hard to say no. It seems almost certain there will be more.

Will it make a difference? Difficult to call, but these MPs would be driven out sooner or later. Such is our accelerating politicial polarisation and narrowing of views. This is their last stand. They have nothing left to lose on a personal level.

Whether you agree with the TIGGERS or still look to the other parties for policy, I do think that the emergence of the TIGGERS marks a feeling of optimism and much needed hope for many many Remainers / Moderates, even if it ultimately does fizzle out.

A reflection from 2017: People voted for Corbyn because they were looking for Hope. When he's failed to deliver that, its led to disillusionment and he can not pull the same trick again at a future GE. This makes that doubly so. People are STILL very much looking for that hope. If Brexit does go tits up in a big fashion, then what happens? To what direction do people look? I'm sure there will be the bitterest of recriminations, but... hope is a big deal. We need something...

Tick tick tick. 37 days til Brexit.

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/eu_referendum_2016_/3492426-Westministenders-Abbreviation

OP posts:
Thread gallery
42
OhLookHeKickedTheBall · 20/02/2019 15:24

thanks red
pmk

DGRossetti · 20/02/2019 15:25

What - if any - effect would all 11 tiggers resigning their seats simultaneously have on HoC arithmetic and upcoming votes ?

Peregrina · 20/02/2019 15:27

The Red Tiggers just seem to be whining rather like the ones who tried to stage a coup against Corbyn a couple of years ago*. The Blue ones appear to stand for something - I particularly liked the paragraph in their letter about how no attempt was made to build a cross party consensus and the 48% were alienated not sidelined.

  • Not that I have much time for Corbyn, because I don't. I didn't have time for the Blairites either.
DGRossetti · 20/02/2019 15:29

Not that I have much time for Corbyn, because I don't. I didn't have time for the Blairites either.

And yet Blair is - whatever else you want to say - the most successful Labour leader ever. 3 consecutive election victories.

TalkinPeece · 20/02/2019 15:29

@PleaseComeBackSafe
The
Independent
Group
Get
Excitable
Reporting

Original poster
RedToothBrush · 20/02/2019 15:30

TIGGERS just because the party initials are TIG and it just lends itself to calling members TIGGERS. It's easy to remember and refer to rather than being long winded. I just saw someone joke about calling them TIGGERS on twitter but to be honest, it just works.

OP posts:
Original poster
RedToothBrush · 20/02/2019 15:32

What - if any - effect would all 11 tiggers resigning their seats simultaneously have on HoC arithmetic and upcoming votes ?

No deal more likely? They'll probably support Cooper Boles and I would imagine, with a gun to their head support the WA.

OP posts:
borntobequiet · 20/02/2019 15:33

TIGGER is also sort of anti-KIPPER.

DGRossetti · 20/02/2019 15:36

TIG welding is (checks) Tungsten Inert Gas welding. So plenty of scope for mashups of (obsolete) light bulbs, bright sparks, not doing anything - chemical or otherwise, hot air ...

ChiaraRimini · 20/02/2019 15:40

Whatever you think about Tony Blair there is no way we'd be in this mess now if he was still PM or indeed if a Labour moderate was Leader, which is why I backed the failed attempt to get rid of Corbs.

Ellie56 · 20/02/2019 15:46

MPs feel that the Conservative parliamentary party had worked hard to be accommodating to Brexit views of Soubry, Allen and Wollaston.

Yes, but let's be clear - these are the same people who think they are making headway in negotiating the backstop. Grin

HazardGhost · 20/02/2019 15:48

PMK...

Is it just me but do the Tiggers remind you of old style politicans even though they are pushing for change? I'm not excited by them, what little of them I've heard and I'm bored... it's because they are sane. My brain just goes yup politician when's Grey's anatomy on? whereas for the past few years since the Cons got in my poor brain has been WHAT'S GOING WRONG HERE? THESE PEOPLE ARE DOING SERIOUS HARM. PAY ATTENTION HAZARD

Three cheers for the return of boring politics that I don't particularly need to be invested in. (And yes I knnnnow one must always be politically active yada yada...but i shouldn't have to be this into it because they are threatening food and med supplies. The latter should never be an option ever.)

Anyway.... I'm ill in bed today (dont ask how I'm managing DP care while laid up...the answer is badly...he's fine though!) But the important thing to remember is...I should have put a bet and I am very sad I didn't.

GeistohneGrenzen · 20/02/2019 15:53

PMK

and TIGGERS always bounce back ?

Butterymuffin · 20/02/2019 15:56

I'm not excited by them, what little of them I've heard and I'm bored

Each to their own. I was excited and cheered to hear them speak.

BiglyBadgers · 20/02/2019 15:58

Is it just me but do the Tiggers remind you of old style politicans even though they are pushing for change?

The thing that I find interesting with the Tigger's isn't the politicians themselves. I don't really like any of them as individuals to be honest though I prefer some over others. It's the potential for a different way of working that I like. I like the fact they haven't left for another party and that they are maintaining their differences while also looking to work together on some issues. I think a parliament of independents and smaller parties and groupings could push MPs into needing to cooperate and compromise in a way that labour and Tories seem increasingly incapable of. It could be the change we need to pull us back from extremism in our politics.

Of course if might not work out like that, but I am cautiously interested nonetheless.

InterchangeableEmma · 20/02/2019 16:00

Thanks again Red

NoMoreMonkeysJumpingOnTheBed · 20/02/2019 16:00

Have lurked on these threads for a long while, thanks to Red and others for continuing to shed light on an incredibly horrible situation.

Have written to my mp to encourage him to follow the other independents, a small glimmer of hope in this complete shower of the proverbial.

Currently watching Blackout on Netflix and my god is it scary, it should be mandatory watching for all those in Westminster who think no deal brexit is the best thing that'll ever happen

Easilyflattered · 20/02/2019 16:01

I'm a Heidi Allen constituent and I have to say I'm impressed with what she has been doing locally. I think she is an intelligent woman, from a strong remain area, who realises the damage Brexit will do to Cambridge and wasn't going to sell out to go along with the party line. I'm pleased that after her saying for months that she didn't support the hard right that she's stuck to her principles.
My daughter is in year 5 and I was surprised she bothered to take the time to meet their school trip to parliament.

I was always a Labour voter too....but if Allen was at the forefront of a new party I would vote for her party.

Skirmisher · 20/02/2019 16:11

.

Original poster
RedToothBrush · 20/02/2019 16:11

Whatever you think about Tony Blair there is no way we'd be in this mess now if he was still PM or indeed if a Labour moderate was Leader, which is why I backed the failed attempt to get rid of Corbs.

I'd disagree, merely because many policies brought in during the Labour years are the ones that are causing problems now because of poor scrutiny and are now being used in ever increasingly authoritarian areas for which they were never intended. These restrictions to liberty are proving problematic and in some cases Blairs policies have fed a backlash against the centre in general.

You can draw lines from seeds in the Blair government to today.

Hindsight is a wonderful thing, but so is context.

Blair was able to do a lot more because he had such a large majority.

Blair is also responsible for PFI and how that has drained resources of local authorities because they were poorly thought out and short termist.

Blair is also responsible for making local government less transparent because of PFI etc.

Blair was a popularist who did a lot of tin can kicking. The Blair / Brown government never had a strategy to build up and protect against a possible recession and give us a cushion against the 2008 financial crisis. They took the line that it wouldn't happen and didn't acknowledge warnings that it was likely to happen (and yes that goes back to Blair and isn't purely a Brown issue).

Blair really did bring spin (lies) into politics in a way no one had done before. He made it harder for politicians to be held to account as a result.

Blairite complacency and lack of foresight (which Iraq really does exemplify in its lack of plan) is something that an historical analysis shouldn't ignore.

We should learn from it instead.

OP posts:
TalkinPeece · 20/02/2019 16:18

I'm an auditor by profession.
Blair and Brown were utter idiots to bring in "light touch regulation"
BUT
It Was Norman Lamont and John Major who invented PFI in 1992
AND
It was Eric Pickles who abolished the Audit Commission
It was Eric Pickles who abolished the Standards Board

so the blame lies across the board.

What I like about the TIGGERS is that they are from both benches into the middle
it makes them a much harder target for the extremist commentators

FishesaPlenty · 20/02/2019 16:18

From the previous thread:

We import 70% of fertilisers and you can't stockpile it

There will be extra costs from import duty (and the falling pound) but I can't see any reason for anyone to be stockpiling it beyond normal needs. Unless I'm missing something?

DGRossetti · 20/02/2019 16:20

There will be extra costs from import duty (and the falling pound) but I can't see any reason for anyone to be stockpiling it beyond normal needs. Unless I'm missing something?

(posted in reply on last thread) (bell ringing ...) I'm recalling something about the security services and fertilizer stockpiling and terrorism ... suppliers of said have their orders monitored to see if anyone is buying more than they need ?