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Brexit
Original poster

"We Are Not Running Down The Clock"

80 replies

MillytantForceit · 12/02/2019 10:32

...We are not running down the clock.

Definitely not running down the clock.

Wouldn't do a thing like that.

Running down the clock.

Definitely not.

Sorry, can't talk. Too busy explaining that we are not running down the clock

....Absolutely NOT running down the clock.

OP posts:
PerkingFaintly · 12/02/2019 12:41

David Davis was the minister in charge of the Department for Exiting the European Union.

He had ONE JOB.

He fucked it up and ran away.

DippyAvocado · 12/02/2019 12:43

They are elected to represent the interests of their constituency.

Quite. What is in the interest of their constituency is not necessarily what the constituents think they want though - the ultimate Brexit dilemma. The constituents want all the benefits of EU membership without the perceived disadvantages as they were falsely promised. That is not available to them. Voters will soon be very pissed off when the economy crashes, their money is worth less and they can't buy stuff in the shops. They will be very quick to blame their MP then.

Let's not forget that half the voters don't want to leave at all. The ones who actually want to leave with no deal are in a considerable minority...

PerkingFaintly · 12/02/2019 12:44

And yeah, Dominic Raab is up there too. He discovers the UK is reliant on the Dover crossing in November 2018. November 2018!!!!

Maybe before the referendum would have been a good time for him to do his homework on UK trade with the rEU?

These are the people who have betrayed Leave voters.

StepLadders007 · 12/02/2019 12:45

What is in the interest of their constituency is not necessarily what the constituents think they want though

FFS!

Orwell's 1984 called, they have a position for you at the Ministry of Truth.

ContinuityError · 12/02/2019 12:47

StepLadders007

The UK public elects Members of Parliament (MPs) to represent their interests and concerns in the House of Commons.

And the key word there is "represent" - MPs are representatives , not delegates, they are not duty bound to follow their constituents' every whim.

Edmund Burke: Your representative owes you, not his industry only, but his judgment; and he betrays instead of serving you if he sacrifices it to your opinion.

And also Churchill: The first duty of a member of Parliament is to do what he thinks in his faithful and disinterested judgement is right and necessary for the honour and safety of Great Britain. His second duty is to his constituents, of whom he is the representative but not the delegate. Burke's famous declaration on this subject is well known. It is only in the third place that his duty to party organization or programme takes rank. All these three loyalties should be observed, but there in no doubt of the order in which they stand under any healthy manifestation of democracy.

PerkingFaintly · 12/02/2019 12:49

So, Stepladders007, how do you feel David Davis did, in his really rather important position as the Secretary of State for Exiting the European Union?

A*, or may B+?

StepLadders007 · 12/02/2019 12:53

Yes, very poetic from a War Time Prime Minister

And the key word there is "represent" - MPs are representatives , not delegates, they are not duty bound to follow their constituents' every whim

The EU Referendum was not a whim.

Look, I appreciate you people are trying to actually re-write democracy but it just won't wash with me.

StepLadders007 · 12/02/2019 12:55

So, Stepladders007, how do you feel David Davis did, in his really rather important position as the Secretary of State for Exiting the European Union

Complete shit show. And?

ContinuityError · 12/02/2019 12:56

So you don't know who Edmund Burke was then?

Guess you might need to do a bit of reading up on how democracy works in the UK.

PerkingFaintly · 12/02/2019 12:57

So, back to your original comment.

Was the problem that David Davis was a person in charge who simply didn't want to leave?

StepLadders007 · 12/02/2019 13:00

Guess you might need to do a bit of reading up on how democracy works in the UK

I'm fine thanks.

StepLadders007 · 12/02/2019 13:01

Was the problem that David Davis was a person in charge who simply didn't want to leave?

You're trying to twist my original comment to suit your agenda. Not an uncommon trait here on MN.

Random18 · 12/02/2019 13:03

^The EU Referendum was not a whim.
^

That’s why it was called when we had such a good plan......................

ContinuityError · 12/02/2019 13:04

So you now understand the difference between a representative democracy and a direct democracy - all good then Wink

PerkingFaintly · 12/02/2019 13:06

You're trying to avoid answering a straightforward question.

Not an uncommon trait among Brexiteers.

StepLadders007 · 12/02/2019 13:06

So you now understand the difference between a representative democracy and a direct democracy - all good then

I understand that there was a vote and stand by my statement of MPs losing their jobs if they went against their constituents, Churchill or not.

PerkingFaintly · 12/02/2019 13:09

BTW, I can see why you're trying to dodge the question.

David Davis, arch-Brexiteer, had the job of doing the actual work of making Brexit happen – and has fucked it up and run away.

He betrayed Leave voters.

As did so many of the Leave campaigners.

ContinuityError · 12/02/2019 13:12

So you think that the UK is a plebiscite rather than sovereignty residing in Parliament.

Glad we've cleared that up then.

Funny, I thought "take back control" was all about the UK parliament being sovereign Hmm

StepLadders007 · 12/02/2019 13:18

Perking,

What is the actual point your trying to make?

SusanWalker · 12/02/2019 13:19

No one can deliver what leavers want, because they all voted for something undefined. The leave campaign deliberately kept the details vague and relied on meaningless slogans.

As soon as anyone tried to say what leave meant they were going to piss off a majority of voters, either because they were remain or because the leave in their head wouldn't match the plan. That's why TM has run down the clock.

The exact same thing would have happened if a brexiteer had been PM. But none of them had the balls did they? I'm no TM fan, but there was a reason she was the last person standing.

There's going to be a lot of anger either way, but it's beyond naive to think that voters who have lost their jobs will shrug and think, well they've implemented what I asked for.

PerkingFaintly · 12/02/2019 13:24

Still not answering the question, Stepladders007?

Don't blame you...

StepLadders007 · 12/02/2019 13:26

I'm not answering because I've no idea what you're on about or what your point is.

PerkingFaintly · 12/02/2019 13:28

The question's just above. I can repeat it for you if you like.

Was the problem that David Davis was a person in charge who simply didn't want to leave?

SisterOfDonFrancisco · 12/02/2019 13:28

We'll get wa, whether we like it or not.

PerkingFaintly · 12/02/2019 13:33

BTW, as a second question:

Do you disagree with me that David Davis has betrayed Leave voters?