To be completely cheesed off. More F-ing brexit chaos

[Theworldisfullofgs]

The European Medical Agency left their London offices today to relocate to Amsterdam.
900 jobs. Lost our leading role in evaluating medicines.

No clear pathway forward.

What they should of written on that bus

Step forward into chaos, we have no idea and we're just telling you what you want to hear: Vote Leave.

yes. Please remember that.

Jasjas and Boris,

Nor did I ever say that gdp grew during house price contractions. Almost by definition it doesn’t. This is a huge straw man.

You have both implied that rising house prices are a good thing.

It is becoming increasingly clear that replacing inflation with asset bubbles is not a good thing.

It’s peoples REACTION to Brexit that’s the problem

It's people's REACTION to being stuck in a burning house that's the problem

Business do actually use other events to increase prices and hide bad news.

It happened with the introduction of the Euro. It has happened with several other EU related issues.

So when do we believe and when do we realise we are being manipulated or realise we have been manipulated in the past?

You have both implied that rising house prices are a good thing

Larry, i suggested no such thing, i gave a solution to rising house prices.

Brexit will cause a recession, job losses, inflation, falling wages & a tightening of lending, communities affected rarely recover ..... all of which always affects the poor the hardest.

Its one reason i'm so pissed at Labour, they are not providing leadership and telling their core vote why we need to stay in.

First step to avoiding manipulation is to turn off the BBC and go to Reuters for news.

Jasjas,

To be fair, you did suggest an alternative, although I am not sure how possible it is.

I am not going to keep reiterating the same points but I guess to sum up my views:

Leaving under the current deal is foolhardy and we would be better staying.

However Brexit is not a war or famine (and we even recovered from those). It is a moderately disruptive event.

Negotiations will continue post Brexit and we will formulate trading relationships with the EU and the rest of the World.

I cannot say long term whether it will be better or worse.

Trying to discuss this in a few paragraphs with people who have already made their minds up is pointless.

@larrygrylls how long does it take to strike trade deals on average?

However Brexit is not a war or famine (and we even recovered from those). It is a moderately disruptive event

Brexit is self inflicted, wars and famines are (usually) not & cost huge numbers of lives and take decades to get over.

Brexit is a global economic event - if we leave with no-deal, moderate with a WA.

We built 100s of 1000s of council housing post ww2, no reason why we couldn't do it again.

Funny how you accuse others of having closed minds but are oblivious to your own intransigence lol!

I don’t think people are saying that rising house prices are always a good thing (though many in this country do think that because historically property is a reliable investment long term, why else do most people want to get on to the housing ladder?).
What they are saying is that a sudden collapse in house prices may well benefit nobody.

@larrygrylls , I have moved (albeit reluctantly) from Remain to WA. How is that not compromising?
Theresa May will get no version of WA that doesn't include a backstop. In fact, given recent shenanigans, would anyone trust the UK not to renege in its GFA obligations to Ireland?
So it's going to be accept WA or don't Brexit. Leavers will be left with that choice.

Live the idea that the UK has moved on from war and famine so it will move on from Brexit deal or no deal.
The people who survive war and famine move on often deeply damaged by their experiences. The displaced literally move on. The dead, well I am sure you could call that moving on too.

I'm just about over Thatcher

I'm just about over Thatcher

You think you are but just wait till you see a clip on the telly and it all comes rushing back.

“What they are saying is that a sudden collapse in house prices may well benefit nobody.”

It doesn’t, in my humble experience, and I’ve seen a few over the years.
The last big one I remember was the early 90s. Many people couldn’t sell their properties due to negative equity - their properties were worth less than what they paid for them. Those that could were unable to find buyers well off enough to afford them, even when mortgage companies offered 0% mortgages and interest only mortgages - and we know how that all turned out with the endowments failing to pay enough.

At the height of it, I remember going to work along roads lined with For Sale signs. No-one was buying.
People were taking 2nd and 3rd jobs cleaning or in pubs or stacking shelves in order to pay their mortgages. Some simply posted their keys back through the mortgage company’s letterbox...

@bellinisurge - agree WA is better than no-deal but think that Brexit in any form is still worth resisting. The case for Brexit delivering a bright future for our DCs has not been made beyond bringing the UK a greater degree of autonomy. The risks and disadvantages look high in the short, medium and long term economically and its not clear how greater autonomy can be used to mitigate these.

Why willingly accept a worse future for all our DCs when a 2nd referendum is justified given the deal we're actually being offered is so different from the one articulated during the referendum?

@indistinct , take your point but because I don't trust other people to deliver options for my dd, I'm getting Irish citizenship for her so she can get a passport and make her own choices.

@bellinisurge - pleased for you that you have that option. Even if I had that option, reluctant to abandon friends, family, neighbours, community, country to a bleaker future based on a referendum result driven by misrepresentations of the EU, our power and influence within it, and an unrealistic assessment of our prospects outside it.