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Brexit

Westminstenders: What The Hell Happens Next?!

996 replies

RedToothBrush · 09/01/2019 14:14

John Bercow has just spent over at an hour dealing with a Points of Order, in which he has argued that he is defending the soverignty of the House of Commons and that is his duty, not to simply to be a cheerleader for the executive.

Taking back control seems to have rather upset ERG Brexiteers.

As Jess Phillips astutely pointed out:
"People only care about procedures, and protecting and conserving the procedures, when they don't like the outcome of the thing that is about to happen and never when it is going in their favour."

And given what we have seen the Executive do over the last few months in terms of trying to use procedure for its own political gain, this is quite a fair point.

There are however certain constitutional questions this is all raising. And we have a very real constitutional crisis here.

Bercow has ruled that he CAN allow an amendment (because the previous vote had prevented only a motion and a debate) put forward by Grieve to go to a vote.

This amendment would - if it is passed by the house - require May to report to the house within 3 days if the WA fails to pass next week.

This would be a significant victory, if it passed because at present the position is where May can delay reporting back to the house until it start to get to the point where politically the opposition can't influence things, and a 'meaningful vote' will in practice be more like a gun to the head by the Executive, rather than the House of Commons acting in a sovereign manner and being free to make its own decisions rather than be forced into a corner by Parliamentary Procedure and the politicking of Parliamentary Procedure to undermine the independence of the HoC.

Allowing more time for the opposition to hold the government to account, does not necessarily change anything. It just means the executive can not just run down the clock in the way it perhaps has been intending.

The HoC could of course, vote against the amendment.

The WA is to come to the HoC next week.

And we have no idea what the hell is going to happen next.

OP posts:
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frumpety · 10/01/2019 13:37

Brexit in the UK appears to be paralysing the country gradually

Does anyone else get this sneaking feeling that we are all missing something big, a little detail that's probably obvious and in plain sight, but we are all so distracted with the Brexit shenanigans that we can't see it. What I mean is a consequence that will seem obvious once it occurs.

Or have I had too much lemsip ?

SusanWalker · 10/01/2019 13:47

Great thread from David Allen Green

mobile.twitter.com/davidallengreen/status/1083290033082249217

thecatfromjapan · 10/01/2019 13:49

frumpety Apart from the rise of the Far Right? Personally, I think that is what historians will look at. My feeling is that, I'm 10 years' time, that is the government we will have - and it will be obvious with hindsight.

thecatfromjapan · 10/01/2019 13:52

Yes. I think that David Allen Green thread confirms my thoughts. ☹️

ThereWillBeAdequateFood · 10/01/2019 14:04

Just popping in to check whether or not Jeremy Corbyn is still an ignorant fuckwit of truely epic proportions. Yep, still a toss pot.

Loving the cat pics. Dh is horribly allergic Sad I’d love a cat.

OhYouBadBadKitten · 10/01/2019 14:05

I had a fun 30 minutes in a taxi with a No Deal taxi driver Confused He started the conversation, not me!

It was actually quite fascinating to just ask questions as to what he though would happen. According to him if we had left the day after the vote all would be rosy by now. Manufacturing would be up because of all our amazing inventors. He reckoned that after a No Deal in March 'Britain would be great again in two years'.

When I pointed out that he was a lot more optimistic than Rees-Mogg there was a moment of silence before he declared he would be dead by then. It was a strange response for someone who had earlier in the conversation lamented the debt his uni kids were in, saying he was scared for them that they'd never pay it off. I reminded him about his children.

And this is part of the problem, they aren't even listening to the messages of their own side. They heard sound bites during the referendum.

OhYouBadBadKitten · 10/01/2019 14:08

bugger, posted by accident...
they heard sound bites during the referendum and those sound bites are stuck in their heads. It's very hard to shift them - it's like the catchy adverts from my childhood (harp, stay sharp, to the bottom of the glass....). Once in there, forever bouncing around.

downthestrada · 10/01/2019 14:12

I've been quietly reading this these threads. Thanks everyone as it's helping me make sense of things and keep up-to-date.

Just watched this and I'm not sure if anybody else has posted it. www.facebook.com/JoannaCherryMP/videos/vb.815273991868910/741782332873152/?type=2&theater

So, it looks like there's a bit more substance to claims that the Seaborne Freight contract was not awarded in line with regs. So, far they are not confirming what the "unforseen event" is. I wonder if anything will happen with this, or if it will just be forgotten about.

Tanith · 10/01/2019 14:14

OYBBK, that's a deliberate ploy. All the Sales training, the Derren Brown-style mind-bending techniques have paid off handsomely.

bellinisurge · 10/01/2019 14:15

@OhYouBadBadKitten - that's an ear worm I can't get rid of.
"Cool fresh flavour didn't waver by a quaver ..."

OhYouBadBadKitten · 10/01/2019 14:21

Sorry Bellini!
It is Tanith.

Oh yes, he also said if we didn't leave there would be civil unrest like the country has never seen before. I asked him who would be doing this civil unrest. Apparently it is anyone who believes in democracy. Confused

I wish I'd asked him what form it would take. That would have been interesting.

He didn't even drop us off where he was supposed to....

TatianaLarina · 10/01/2019 14:38

Any impact on Tory policy (e.g. recent amendments, choice for Northern Irish women) has been made in spite of the Labour front bench rather than because of them.

This is all entirely true but it’s made the Tories reliant on the DUP, and when it comes to votes - every one counts - so the fewer Tories and the more Labour and LD the better.

Ta1kinPeace · 10/01/2019 14:45

NO TO A PEOPLES VOTE
Seriously folks, I'm out and about at work again.
It would be a disaster and people would vote with anger not with thought.

bellinisurge · 10/01/2019 14:48

I also don't want a people's vote for fear that No Deal would be an option. There are clearly people gullible enough to choose it.

Ta1kinPeace · 10/01/2019 14:48

Just to prove there is always light at the end of the tunnel.
I found this cat dying in my compost heap. She weighed 2kg and could not stand.
4 months later she looked like this.
She died a few months afterwards having been Queen of the house in her twilight years.

Westminstenders: What The Hell Happens Next?!
arranbubonicplague · 10/01/2019 14:51

Great thread from David Allen Green

DAG will be on the Remainiacs Podcast later.

mobile.twitter.com/RemainiacsCast/status/1083362631111589889

bellinisurge · 10/01/2019 14:51

Well done @Ta1kinPeace ! What a lucky and lovely cat.

BollocksToBrexit · 10/01/2019 14:52

I don't want a people's vote. The people have already shown how gullible and stupid they are. No, we need the grown ups in parliament to step up, put the children to bed, and then tidy up the mess they've made of the country.

TatianaLarina · 10/01/2019 14:53

There’s no way you could have a PV without a No Deal option and the people who will vote for it are the ones who have zero grasp of the consequences.

Unless - HoC had a vote on No Deal and voted it down after the WA. But then what would you put on the ballot paper?

As long as it’s up to Parliament, No Deal should be defeated, if you hand it to the people things could go very wrong.

Ta1kinPeace · 10/01/2019 14:55

@DGRosetti
This will amuse you ....
www.dailyecho.co.uk/news/17348228.wetherspoon-spokesman-says-southampton-mans-song-about-owner-is-offensive/
Grant is an acquaintance of mine Grin

DGRossetti · 10/01/2019 15:00

@Ta1kinPeace

But now a spokesperson for the Brexiteer, who recently appeared on TV’s Question Time, says Grant’s song is “offensive”.

"...I am offended by that ... well so fucking what ? ..."

Ta1kinPeace · 10/01/2019 15:03

And Grant is getting the Youtube ad money as people queue up to be offended Grin

UnnecessaryFennel · 10/01/2019 15:11

I find Tim Martin pretty fucking offensive, to be frank, but no one seems to be banning him.

OYBBK - I was previously in favour of a PV, but stories like that make me really wary. There's plenty out there that would vote for No Deal. Of course, many of them would now be voting 'to give the Remoaners a bloody nose' Hmm

Anyway, there won't be a PV. There won't be a Revoke. I have a feeling that the WA will squeak through and we'll be stuck in this appalling nightmare for years and years to come. Just getting steadily poorer and less influential and more disillusioned and ironically, less democratic. The world will get bored of us and we'll just slide into frustrated, impotent insignificance.

not with a bang but a whimper.

frumpety · 10/01/2019 15:13

Cat no that wasn't where my train of thought was going, I was thinking more tech,GDPR, satellites something a long those lines.

TatianaLarina · 10/01/2019 15:16

I have a feeling that the WA will squeak through

Yep, that’s my fear. The day of the vote will be shit.

I want to believe that the headbangers will stick to their guns on the backstop but faced with a possible GE they may vote to save some form of Brexit and their jobs.

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