Westministenders: Gin O'Clock

[RedToothBrush]

After disaster after Salzberg and a very predictable humilation over the Chequers Deal which the ERG reject, moderate Brexiteers reject, Remainers reject and the EU reject....

May does a press conference...

...which is delayed by a power shortage inside No. 10.

And....

I've heard nothing yet from my tory MP. Hazardswan. Mrs8

Yay! Someone else in the ignored club, I'm not alone

Short shift today for Snowy on the Macron thread, PCPlum .....only 3 hours and probably too much effort to refute (or too obviously ignore) the many intelligent rebuttals and challenges to his/her/their statements I also noticed a change of "voice" although that might have been my imagination

Nothing from my MP as yet Hazardswan but according to his website he replies to all emails - maybe tomorrow. What the heck is going on with the return key?

Forget Macron anyway, I'm actually really shocked that Mélenchon, a french hard left Bolivarian Trotskyist is speaking in Liverpool tomorrow to spew his anti EU bile. Shit stirring from a foreign politician at this precise moment makes my blood boil. He should mind his own fucking business and leave this country alone.

Mélenchon, a french hard left Bolivarian Trotskyist

Also an anti-Semite who tacitly encouraged the "ni ni" movement which promoted equivalence between a neo-facist and a man who once worked for a bank with a Jewish name.

I feel sick. Jean-Luc Mélenchon to speak at pro-Corbyn event in Liverpool

The French hard-left leader Jean-Luc Mélenchon is to appear at a Labour party conference event for the first time, inviting Jeremy Corbyn to join a world club of leftist movements .www.theguardian.com/world/2018/sep/23/jean-luc-melenchon-to-speak-at-pro-corbyn-event-in-liverpool

Yay! Someone else in the ignored club, I'm not alone wink You can add me to the list, too Hazard. Not a dicky bird. (Bugger wanted to say something else, but bloody return key still up the spout). I'll say it anyway: I contacted our foodbank manager about the potential effects of no deal Brexit on foodbank donations/demand/warehouse security. Just heard back that the Trussell Trust hasn't mentioned it at all! She's going to raise it with the Area Manager. I'm very surprised at TT, but then everyone seems to be ignoring the increasingly loud warnings.

I'm a lurker on these threads. Thanks so much to everyone who posts. Can anyone answer a question for me (and apologies if it is a stupid one as I know nothing about driving)? If UK driving licenses would not be automatically valid in the EU, does that mean EU licenses would be similarly invalid here?

Nothing from my mp either. Although he did send a general constituency email supporting a people’s vote, so he is doing some good stuff. Is there still room in the tree?

singing fingers crossed you hear something then. .... insert paragraph..... hasen good on you for pointing it out, I had hoped a larger organisation such as Trussels would be putting figures together and publishing them LOUDLY and broadly. Like a food cost increase would mean X, 000 more people would need foodbanks, redundancies would increase demand by X etc. The economic impact is becoming clearer and I see no ships with unicorns.

I'm out of the tree as Zebedee says it's time for bed. You are welcome to my perch.

Don't know if this has already been posted, but the Beeb finally seems to be willing to expose the hardcore Brexiters' lies: www.bbc.co.uk/news/amp/uk-45625724?__twitter_impression=true (return) Shame it's tucked away on the Business pages, as it's a pretty damning indictment (in economist-speak terms)of their increasingly desparate flailing around for a proper plan.

Regarding the driving licence question, there's explanations in the event of no deal here:

Basically driving licences may no longer be valid by itself when driving in the EU and you may not be able to exchange your licence after the UK has left the EU.

If there is no deal with the EU, you may need to obtain an International Driving Permit to drive in the EU.

If living elsewhere then you may need to take a new driving test in that country.
To avoid this you need to swap your UK driving licence for one from the EU country you move to or live in before 29 March 2019.

EU licence holders can drive on their EU licence for three years after coming to live in the UK.

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/driving-in-the-eu-if-theres-no-brexit-deal/driving-in-the-eu-if-theres-no-brexit-deal

---

https://www.thisismoney.co.uk/money/cars/article-5463877/UK-driving-licences-not-recognised-EU-Brexit.html

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-45512152

@swirlingasong From the UK govt site:

" For EU licence holders who passed their test in the EU or EEA, the UK would continue to exchange their licence as we do currently.
EU licence holders, who passed their test outside the EU or EEA have restrictions on licence exchange, and so may need to take a test to obtain a UK licence."

This is another example of intended consequences - not a deliberate kindness to E27 expats

The hasty need to keep the country running meant that the govt bills that automatically passed over much EU legislation into UK law
sometimes gives more rights to EU than UK businesses and individuals

e.g. EU goods would remain certified and could be sold post-Brexit in the UK, whereas UK goods won't in the EU !
Ditto EU planes would be allowed to land.

This legisaltion is likely to remain after Brexit, or the UK would get into an even more isoltaed mess

I love all the "you may have to"/ "you might have to"/businesses should check for themselves malarkey on these Technical Notices.
Anyone would think they have no fecking idea and want to pass the responsibility on to someone else

Nicky Morgan: Chequers is dead. And the only plan that MPs will now vote for is Norway.

That would be a great relief, if true

www.conservativehome.com/thecolumnists/2018/09/nicky-morgan-chequers-is-dead-and-the-only-plan-that-mps-will-now-vote-for-is-norway.html

The UK govt notices keep saying "Ask the EU" or wrt NI "Ask Dublin"

The govt hasn't a clue, so expects the EU to take over responsibility for advising UK businessesd and individuals.
Was that really what "taking back control" meant ?

woman I read a bit about Mélenchon during the French Presidential elections
He sounds a nasty bit of work.
Reportedly there is quite a bit of voter transfer between the far left and far right, so he seems to pander to / gloss over anti-semitism for political advantage, like Corbyn

There is a lot of crossover between hard left and right in France, and it's a real ideological crossover. I have quite a few melenchonites on my FB and they come out with some shocking stuff. You would be hard pressed to distinguish their views from the NF.

But as I just posted on another thread, it does bizarrely seem like the centre is holding in France. Very roughly LREM (macrons party), FI (melenchon), MoDem (Bayrou) and the FN all have similar amounts of support. Both LREM and MoDem are centrist parties - LREM are new labour with Macron as Blair, and MoDem are the LibDems with Bayrou cast as Paddy Ashdown. Of course the UK parallels only go so far but the electorate is more moderate than you'd think.

the electorate is more moderate than you'd think This is not being reported in english press. The funding of Labour Leave This thread on the labour leave meeting. They make no sense at all: <a class="break-all" href="https://twitter.com/AdamBienkov/status/1044267358523719680www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2018/sep/25/europe-labour-left-alt-right-corbynites-steve-bannon" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">twitter.com/AdamBienkov/status/1044267358523719680www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2018/sep/25/europe-labour-left-alt-right-corbynites-steve-bannon

Longtime Leaver RNorth highlighted something today which makes a nonsense of core govt assumptions:
without a WA, the UK will likely NOT be allowed to roll over ANY of the EU's trade deals with other countries

http://www.eureferendum.com/blogview.aspx?blogno=87004

"Vienna Convention on Succession of States in respect of Treaties ,
...
in all the cases where the UK wants to roll over bilateral deals with countries where there is an EU FTA, the EU would, perforce, be one of the parties from which consent would be needed.
...
In the event of the UK leaving the EU without a Withdrawal Agreement – a "no deal" Brexit – it is highly unlikely that the EU will give its consent to the UK's continued participation in its external trade deals.
With no consent, the treaties simply cannot be rolled over.
"
The UK would have to start again, and negotiate new treaties from scratch."

< Now chant again "they need us more than we need them" 🤦🏻‍♀️ >

I think France is very polarised by region. If you look at the Pays De calais department, in the last election they voted majority National Front. That helps skew the reporting as I expect it's as far as many Uk reporters travel in France.

I think France is very polarised by region. If you look at the Pays De calais department, in the last election they voted majority National Front. That helps skew the reporting as I expect it's as far as many Uk reporters travel in France.

There is some polarisation by region, but I think the British press goes looking for what will support the British press's preferred narrative.

And often there is polarisation even within a region or department, with educated/younger voters in cities voting very differently to the surrounding countryside,

I agree with people in France been moderate. And tbh they’ve always been. Melanchon is charismatic which has helped him a lot too.