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Brexit

Westministenders: Back to School

999 replies

RedToothBrush · 30/08/2018 13:01

No, I'm not referring to the start of a new parliamentary season, I'm referring to the number of politicians who need to literally go back to school. Its embarassing, and worrying.

Anyway, here is a slightly lengthy, end summer news round up for you.

The Brexit Headlines
It seems to be Cabinet Office policy to push for the Chequers Deal or for No Deal Even though Macron has very firm, plainly and clearly said "non" in no uncertain terms. Its significant because its come from the official Brexit Department and not from a sweating Dominic Raab at Dexeu.

He has however delivered the first batch of the Brexit Untechnical Papers which are supposed to advise what to do in the event of No Deal. In reality this is a PR exercise, which makes the assumption that some sort of minimual deal will have been done, rather than no deal at all, combined with a very practical plan for 'a wing and a prayer'. Which is a bit of an issue if we decide that we really are going to stick to the line that its Chequers or no deal.

These untechnical papers are ludicarious shallow, which some having the audaciency to say "plan for the news rules, but we haven't actually decided what the news rules are and we'll get back to you as soon as we've made them up". The completely skirt the entire subject of NI, saying merely, more or less "oh that one will just work itself out". Despite the untechnical papers don't include the crucial aviation one, which apparently was held back because it was regarded as 'too shambolic' which is quite the statement, if you've read any of them. Nor do they include details of the contract for hundreds of portaloos to line our motorways so that lorry drivers can still take a pee whilst they are stuck in queues for days. They might starve and no one else will have any food because all the lorries are stuck, but hell they'll be no exposure on the M20 to offend you.

Its not quite as bleak as it sounds though. The Chequers Deal is a vision of our future relationship with the EU. Its not the Withdrawal Deal. And the Withdrawal Deal (and backstop) is the thing that needs to be done in Oct / Nov. Which then will lead on to talks about the Chequers Deal. You can't talk about Chequers without having ALREADY agreed the Withdrawal. Which is very important to keep in mind as its continuely being lost in the media coverage. Could it be that all the sudden noise from the Cabinet Office, is an attempt to distract in the short term to protect the Withdrawal phrase?

Also as an alternative to Chequers, Macron is reportedly expected to propose something akin to an 'associate member' style agreement for the UK with a vision for the EU and its allies to form a series of "concentric circles", with Britain closely tied to the 27 "core" EU member states. If this sounds familiar it is. Guy Verhofstadt has been banging on about this as an idea since before Brexit. Its also a plan which has long been muted by Barnier too. It will probably go down like a lead balloon here, but there is a political will in the EU for a deal. There just isn't in the UK.

More generally in UK politics
Jeremy Corbyn has had a nice relaxing summer but after the hard upcoming weeks ahead, I think he'll still be looking forward to his holiday plans for the Autumn Break, when he visits Israel to profess he's still definitely not an anti-semite, because look he's visiting the evil Zion and talking to Jews. He will spend the next few month telling us that No Deal is a Very Bad Idea, whilst also trying to get his MPs to vote in ways that are a Very Bad Idea. Meanwhile the rest of Labour will indulge in a very public slanging match which most normal people have long since stopped caring about in anyway because they are so bored and disappointed in how far heads have been inserted up backsides.

Theresa May, has been in Africa, where she is trying to get trade deals with lots of countries we already have trade deals with through the EU. She's also in the midst of a fight with Spreadsheet Phil who has been busy telling her to butt out of the budget and realising information to undermine the 'No Deal' narrative all week. Oh and trying to persuade beg Mark Carney to stay another year at the BoE cos no one wants his job. Rees-Smug has been up to his usual English Gentleman Act where he replicates the MPs of the Victorian Era who were into fucking those from the colonies whilst stripping them for asserts, with impecable manners. Boris Johnson is looking for his next photo op where he can look zany and drop a headline grabbing offensive comment. If it winds May up, so much the better. The Tory Creche outing to Birmingham looks like its going to be a scream.

I should say something about the LDs here, so here's a tumbleweed for you.

Back to Brexit
The fishing wars have started. Michael Gove has yet to be sighted in a souwester though (give it time). The Scallop Wars are an insight into why we need a relationship with the EU. It turns out that the French are pissed because we've been using these big fuck off ships which dredge the sea bed and are a ecological disaster and haven't observed a break for a 'breeding season' this year, whilst the French are forced to do so by law. We had been observing an informal agreement where we stick to the same rules, but for some reason this year, some bright spark though it was a bad idea for us to do so. So the French have got a bit shirty in response. Gove is spitting the dummy and saying we will do something. The reality? Well what exactly can we do apart from go to the EU and use the EU courts apart from patrolling the seas with a lot of customs boats and officials we don't have? Cod Wars III here we come!

We've also announced plans for brand new white whale money pit satellite to circle solely over the UK. We aren't in need of coverage for the rest of the world, so we aren't going to waste money on flying over anywhere else who isn't prepared to help contribute financially to its construction. It is going under the draft name of 'Heliocentre'

In other news
If none of this cheers your spirits, then great news; Good Old Nige is making a come back!!! He's dead excited because he's planning his first big Nazi Leave means Leave rally in Bolton where he act out his childhood Hitler fantasy. It'll a cost you a fiver to get in. He's also bored and worried about his income, as he's now considering getting pasted in the London Mayoral Election for the publicity. So soon his face will be back on your TV boxes for Questiontime. Are you all so happy.

I rather suspect the Greens won't be objecting and will be only too happy they aren't getting the publicity they deserve as the 4th biggest party at the moment...

So the Summer is over and normal service is resuming. I hope you have enjoyed the rest and this post brings you a little up to speed. We have Party Conferences to look forward to in the upcoming weeks. Won't that be a joy to behold? And the resumption of shooting ourselves in the face in EU talks.

Oh and don't forget that Trump fellow too. Its all starting to look a bit tasty over there ahead of the November elections. What happens there in the next couple of months might be very important to what happens over here.

Who is excited?!

I am just dancing to the sound of the South African Beats.

OP posts:
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DGRossetti · 06/09/2018 10:52

We all know that businesses have a plan usually running many years into the future

That's not really a UK thing. Now Dutch companies, on the other hand ... (I have worked for 4 UK companies, and one Dutch, and one Belgian-owned company. The UK ones were the only ones that worried about quarter end ....)

Maybe this was one way the Brexiteers hoped to suck the country in ?

BigChocFrenzy · 06/09/2018 10:55

Even the hard right in the EU are sticking to the EU Commision line over Brexit

Trying to appeal to member countries over the heads of Barnier & the Commission is pointless effort, that would better be invested elsewhere

What the UK don't understand is that the far right is mainly driven by opposition to MENA immigration - not FOM for EU citizens and has almost no desire to leave the EU; very little even to leave the Euro.
They are against concessions to the UK, even though they sympathise with their hard right chums like Farage.

Merkel also has to look tough on Brexit - even when fending off the AfD - because there are no votes in making concessions to a UK regarded as embarassingly batshit & chaotic.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-45409188
…
Last week I travelled around Austria in search of answers to those questions.
It's one of those countries where there is an Anglophile public and a nationalist right-wing coalition that frequently questions EU policies has recently taken power. < so the best bet for useful support >
It currently holds the rotating chair of the Union's various ministerial committees.
As it hosted the foreign ministers get together last week, we were able to canvass opinion.
…
"It is right to be tough," Andreas Rabl, the Freedom Party [hard right] mayor of Wels told us, endorsing the European Commission's negotiating stance.
"If it is possible for countries to exit and enjoy the same advantages as before, when they were still EU members, that would be a fatal signal to all other EU countries".

1tisILeClerc · 06/09/2018 10:57

@Rosstac
While dyslexia may be an issue for you the failure to educate yourself is all your responsibility and refusing to learn is not a 'badge of honour'.

Rosstac · 06/09/2018 10:59

1tisILeClerc Somebody with no understanding of people’s lives

lonelyplanetmum · 06/09/2018 11:03

I'm now very worried that Rosstac is my DH who is also dyslexic and left school at 16.^^

Although DH wouldn't have started mud slinging by saying I'd made a meaningless sound bite (which was addressed to another poster anyway!).

1tisILeClerc · 06/09/2018 11:12

I am not sure what help computers may offer those with dyslexia but the ability to access the internet (proven by your presence here) opens up thousands of years worth of knowledge on an almost infinite range of topics, so failure to read and learn is entirely down to (you).

BigChocFrenzy · 06/09/2018 11:26

Hey, I don't think it's right to pick on someone's grammar, unless maybe they are setting themselves up as a grammar expert.

Especially re dsylexia or leaving school early - my late dad had to leave on his 14th birthday during the Depression, which massively hammered the life chances of a highly intelligent, literate & numerate, bloke.

Even today with greater opportunities, it's easy from a position of privilege to point at those without privilege who haven't managed to drag themselves up by their bootstraps.
I grew up very poor and it took me decades to fully overcome all the disadvantages and catch up to those born into privilege.
Even if computers had been around then, getting on my bike / laptop would still be tough.

Addressing the actual point rosstac raised:
Passport colour seems an emotional issues for some Leavers, possibly because it is the only concrete "benefit" so far of the Brexit vote
I expect it would have long been forgotten by almost everyone if the post-Brexit prospects didn't look so bleak

Mind you, the godaawful Brexit mess we are facing has changed many things:

e.g. if we had been heading for an EEA/ EFTA Brexit with transition period, after 2 years of sober, organised negotiating by the UK govt,
I expect almost all the Remain side would long ago have accepted this and stopped agitating for anything different.

Remainers - and now many thoughtful Leavers - are horrified at the prospect of being driven over a cliff by crazed drivers fighting over the steering wheel & accelerator

Hazardswan · 06/09/2018 11:31

There's someone on the thread engaging and by engagement you learn so to say they are failing to learn is a tad harsh and untrue. Not everyone learns from passive reading but some will learn from reading and responding as that's a different learning style.

And to whoever said it's their pet hate 'may of' and 'may have' I think I get that mixed up to Blush I also get all my there's, their, they're, confused.

Hazardswan · 06/09/2018 11:33

Oh nicely put choc !

RedToothBrush · 06/09/2018 11:38

Laura Kuenssberg @bbclaurak
Karen Bradley statement significant - NI assembly members to have pay cut while Stormont Assembly not sitting

OP posts:
DGRossetti · 06/09/2018 11:39

I am not sure what help computers may offer those with dyslexia

screenreaders ? Of course, if you rely on screenreaders you'll quickly learn that cyber-accessibility is treated pretty much the same as it's real-world counterpart Sad.

DGRossetti · 06/09/2018 11:40

Karen Bradley statement significant - NI assembly members to have pay cut while Stormont Assembly not sitting

Which is how 99% of the public discover that despite doing fuck all, assembly members have been on full pay Shock

RedToothBrush · 06/09/2018 11:43

Kate McCann @kateemccann
RE Jeremy Corbyn visit to Salisbury: He did not notify the MP John Glen as per Parliamentary rules. Seems to be some confusion about when he arrived/how long he was there for.

Harry Cole @mrharrycole
Local council say they were not told either

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DGRossetti · 06/09/2018 11:43

It pays not to be to up your own arse about language and it's use. It's not like we're French Grin.

It's a little like music .... no matter how out of time or key you are, if someone else can quickly get the song you're singing, surely that's the role of communication ?

Then there's Muphrys Law

BigChocFrenzy · 06/09/2018 11:46

A bit OT, but as a scientist, I want to praise the brilliant achievement of a great woman scientist:

Prof Dame Jocelyn Bell Burnell has been awarded a Breakthrough Prize for the discovery of radio pulsars
ThanksThanksThanksStarStarStarStar
AND
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-45425872

One of the UK's leading female astronomers is to donate her £2.3m winnings from a major science prize she was awarded.

The sum will go to fund women, under-represented ethnic minority and refugee students to become physics researchers.

< she had to overcome sex & regional disadvantages herself and has donated this enormous prize to help others Thanks >

1tisILeClerc · 06/09/2018 11:46

By following Westminsterendrs and other threads I have read and gone on to look at other 'stuff' I would not normally interest myself in, such as Gibraltar and Ascension Island.
Accepting that other contributors may not be native English speakers and resultant 'incorrect' spelling or phrasing is not an issue to me and as I don't know where anyone is from would not call them out on it.
I left school relatively early largely because it wasn't teaching me the things I wanted to learn.
The late Professor Hawking had problems with his life but his brilliance and thought is to be truly admired.

DGRossetti · 06/09/2018 11:46

Sometimes, someone else says it so much better ...

Westministenders: Back to School
BigChocFrenzy · 06/09/2018 11:50

DG Yup, my ShockShockShock is entirely that those obstructive buggers have been earning receiving full pay - and allowances ? - for NOT doing their jobs AngryAngryAngry

Although it is unfair on all those who would have loved to participate, but cannot because the DUP says NO
Maybe fairer to call the Assembly together and stop pay & allowances for all those who won't turn up to work.

BigChocFrenzy · 06/09/2018 11:55

.

Westministenders: Back to School
DGRossetti · 06/09/2018 12:01

I wonder if buried in the GFA is a line that makes Brexit impossible without some form of involvement of Stormont ? Possibly in slightly obscure phrasing so that ctrl-F "assembly" or "Stormont" doesn't reveal it.

I think the GFA was very carefully drawn up - possibly to prevent exactly what is happening now.

While it may have been easy enough for Westminster to snatch Scottish devolved powers, it might not be so easy for NI.

Of course, to only realise it now, would be entirely in keeping with the way Brexits gone so far.

Where's a constitutional expert when you need one ?

Hazardswan · 06/09/2018 12:07

Shock an MP appears to be actually working and thinking

mobile.twitter.com/DavidLammy/status/1037370457949962240

Flabbergasted.

DGRossetti · 06/09/2018 12:21

Democracy != Democracy

Mrslifecrisis · 06/09/2018 12:30

mobile.twitter.com/iantheplater/status/1037400385944793088/photo/1

This is from the David Lammy thread. Words fail me.

BigChocFrenzy · 06/09/2018 12:30

DG The GFA has been heavily scrutinised by all sides since at least the EU defined its 3 prerequisites for a WA, which included no new NI border

Unfortunately, those negotiating the GFA assumed that both the UK and RoI would always remain members of the EU,
So didn't specifically state this or define any measures to cope with Brexit e.g. re the border.

Also, of course, any country can choose legally to cancel any treaty, if it is prepared for the consequences

Always a mistake not to nail down any possible eventuality with consequences & penalties, no matter how batshit, when negotiating with Britain / Westminster.
The EU and RoI have certainly realised that now in the WA negotiations; hence their reluctance to fudge the border for a WA and rely on the UK govt's later "good faith"

The DUP always opposed the GFA and they are delighted at any weakening of ties to the RoI - further separation from the old enemy is one of the main benefits of Brexit in their eyes.

The hardliners would happily sacrifice their rural / farming supporters, but it remains to be seen how many votes this will cost them by the time the next GE or Assembly elections roll around

BigChocFrenzy · 06/09/2018 12:33

It's a dreadfully racist caricature, Mrslife Sad