Have your frienships and family relationships suffered as a result of Brexit?

[Wormzy]

Just that, really. If friends and/ or family members have clearly voted differently to you, has it changed the way you see them or interact with them? Have friendships broken down?

I haven't been able to vote, but the outcome of the vote affects me disproportionately. Family members have voted Leave. There have been arguments, also between friends, some ended in loss of contact.

I wonder how the Brexit vote has affected others on here?

Maybe not but it is quite substantial and this is based on what people admit too!

www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/british-people-admit-racially-prejudiced-white-black-asian-muslims-brexit-more-leave-voters-remain-a7973751.html

Bit of a derail, but could somebody point me in the direction of evidence that the weaker pound has indeed led (or will lead) to an export bonanza?

More subtle is the number of companies switching away from sterling - whether as customers or suppliers - which will impact further on sterlings stability, and which may not be captured in "headline" statistics.

I know there's been a steady move by some suppliers - certainly of non-UK based services - to start charging in Dollars or Euros in order make the customer cover the instability of the pound. The weaker the pound, the more this will cost them. A real doozy is where things such as licenses are involved (e.g. medicines) as having to pay increased licensing fees can make some products unviable.

We are all immigrants though aren't we ? Some may not have emigrated here in recent times , but when push comes to shove, somewhere down your family tree , someone did !

Absolutely Frumpety.
Mostly from Europe somewhere.
Although as DGR pointed out the other day, some of the 'guardians' of Hadrians wall were from Iraq and Syria.
OK guys you are off to the Northern 'borders', take your woolly tunic, you will need it!

Sadly I think promotion of idealistic open borders thinking led in part to the distrust of the EU. See Merkel making up policy on the hoof then expecting the rest of EU to fall in behind.

Sadly I think promotion of idealistic open borders thinking led in part to the distrust of the EU.

The origins of FoM lie in the fact that 1933-1945 millions of German Jews were trapped in Germany, unable to move to another country. If FoM had existed, they could have fled Germany (raising the interesting point that FoM is as much about allowing people to leave as it is allowing them into another country).

It wasn't intended as some utopian "we are all citizens of Europe" type hippy-drippy tosh.

But returning to the original aim is why FoM is a pillar - indivisible from the others. Once again, the UKs experience of the war - although leading to many successful films - isn't the same as the rest of Europe. (Which is one reason why the tendency to bang on about it can grate).

In some respects the world does not need borders. Everyone who carries a smartphone is tracked to within 10 metres permanently.
The raw 'data' of where all phones are is already 'out there' but may or may not be being analysed at this moment.
Mrs Merkel acted in a humanitarian way and was a but too 'ahead of the curve'. With the huge numbers of people attempting to escape the fighting in their own country, should the various armies of the countries with coasts where they arrived have shot them all?
The UK is whinging about a tiny fraction of those poor people who were fleeing for their lives. It is all very well to criticise, but how would you handle it?

The UK is whinging about a tiny fraction of those poor people who were fleeing for their lives. It is all very well to criticise, but how would you handle it?

Stop bombing them ? And stop selling bombs to other people who them bomb them ?

Well that would decimate the very lucrative UK arms trade.
A portion of the UK contribution to the EU is used to try to stop the wars in North of Africa and other places with the hope of getting some stability and safety in those regions so the peoples will not feel the NEED to escape.

A portion of the UK contribution to the EU is used to try to stop the wars in North of Africa and other places with the hope of getting some stability and safety in those regions so the peoples will not feel the NEED to escape

What they really need is stability to build an infrastructure that allows them to farm and feed themselves. Properly managed, the land around lake Victoria could (or so was told when I stayed with a friend in Kenya) feed all of Africa, with surplus.

One of the most eye-opening books I've read this decade is "Prisoners of Geography" which explains - with irrefutable logic - why Africa is as it is, why civilisation flourished in Europe, and why the US got the winning lottery ticket in life. As well as explaining Russia-Ukraine, and why in 100 years time we'll all be speaking Chinese.

Not bad for a dead-tree book I bought in a hospital WH Smith.

Well actually, most of the Merckel immigrants were young men and economic migrants. That was her error.

She should have accepted whole families genuinely in need and directly from the source of the problem.

Instead she ends up with hoarded of young men, who had travelled far for a better life who are utterly disaffected and unhappy and causing havoc

Sadly the two words, 'properly managed' are a serious issue.
Typically white farmers have the right idea about commercial agriculture but the traditional subsistence farming of individual families is deeply ingrained. A 'happy medium' between the two is needed.
Uganda's soil is very fertile and in many places poking a stick into the ground and it will grow.
The Chinese have moved in 'big time' so that part of your book may come to fruition faster than anticipated.

That’s clearly unworkable. How would they choose which families were ‘genuinely in need’? How many of these families would they take? Should you walk into a country and remove their citizens? The policy adopted was one of a number of actions attempting to deal with the situation of the time. Other actions have been successful and the number of migrants arriving has dramatically reduced.

I’m always amazed that Mumsnet’s armchair policy makers can find such simple solitions to such complex issues

Who and wherever the migrants were/are from they are not strictly Germany's problem as Germany does not have a Mediterranean coastline and is not the first 'landfall' for migrants.

Well properly managed certainly does NOT mean opening your borders to male economic migrants.

This has led to the surge in the far right and its outrageous

There were thousands of Syrian women and children in refugee camps to choose from for a kick off

Funny how yet another Brexit thread ends up talking about unwanted black & brown people

raising the interesting point that FoM is as much about allowing people to leave as it is allowing them into another country

Yes. And that's another thing the right-wing Tories don't like. How can you exploit your workers properly if they can just up and leave?

They want us out of the EU so that they can change employment laws.

And they want us out of the EU so that a brain drain becomes more unlikely because FoM has gone (some people can still move but they need to have a skill which is very sought after to allow an employer overseas to offer them a job over a local/EU candidate). So to all intents and purposes, people are trapped.

The only possible silver lining is that if we don't let people in, either, employers will have to invest in people better, because they won't be able to simply recruit from overseas.

The main reason the right wing Tories want Brexit is nothing to do with sovereignty and trade deals and blah, it's purely and simply about making sure people can make lots of money at the expense of the plebs.

I've read Prisoners of Geography too. I noticed the author has a new book out, I can't remember its name but was planning to pick it up next time I am in a bookshop.

"Instead she ends up with hoarded of young men, who had travelled far for a better life who are utterly disaffected and unhappy and causing havoc"

That's funny because 2017 saw Germany having the lowest crime rate that it has had in 30 years.

2016's crime rate increased slightly, but those committed by new immigrants tended to be things like petty theft, or travelling on public transport without a ticket, and the increase down to these numbers was low.

On the note about "economic migrants" its a right wing trope, young men tend to make the journey first because they are the strongest and most able to do it, they send for the family later.

So the entire post you made was drivel.

Male (or it could equally be female) economic migrants are often those that are picking fruit and veg that is too 'difficult' for those unemployed in the UK but are 'happy' to take the state benefits.

The only possible silver lining is that if we don't let people in, either, employers will have to invest in people better, because they won't be able to simply recruit from overseas.

You'd be surprised .... one law for us, one law for them.

My view of the ultimate Tory wet dream is an imported educated class, that can be kicked out without due process (the Home Office has been trialling this bit for years with great success) allied to a supine bread'n'circuses indigenous population that just let their betters Do What They Want (also known as "The Good OId Days").

This has the enviable qualities that the people making the money (imported labour) can piss off after their 10/20/30 years having paid a kings ransom in taxes that they will never see a penny of. Coupled with the added advantage that they won't claim any pensions either.

This isn't 1950s, or 1850s. This is 1250s - feudal England at it's finest.

MeganBacon, I didn't actually vote Remain to keep my EU citizenship rights. I thought at the time that even if Leave won, we'd end up with a Norway-style agreement (as suggested by Nigel Farage, amongst others).

Before the vote, I looked at how Brexit would be likely to affect various aspects of the UK, including the economy, defence, the NHS, our international standing and influence and our laws, including those related to environmental protection, employment rights, food safety and consumer protection etc. I did a lot of reading and tried hard to find unbiased sources and hard facts.

I came to the conclusion that although I had misgivings about the EU, Remain was the only vote that made logical sense. I honestly believe that the referendum result was a triumph of emotion over logic.

Nah, I don't discuss it with friends and family, my political views are personal, like religion.
Those two always end in argument, so best keep your views to yourself, if you don't want to fall out with folk.

We will likely have an increase in Roma from January, from any of the european countries.

We will likely have an increase in Roma from January, from any of the european countries.

Because?

I just wish someone would tell me what they think GB will be like if we just let hoardes of people in from Africa and the Middle East and the rest of the World.
Where does it end?
Would we carry on letting people in until we literally sink?
Where would we house them? What about Schools and the NHS?
The cracks are showing already and the madness has only been going on for a few years.
What will this country be like in 20/30 years with uncontrolled immigration?
Just answer me that, will you.