Have your frienships and family relationships suffered as a result of Brexit?

[Wormzy]

Just that, really. If friends and/ or family members have clearly voted differently to you, has it changed the way you see them or interact with them? Have friendships broken down?

I haven't been able to vote, but the outcome of the vote affects me disproportionately. Family members have voted Leave. There have been arguments, also between friends, some ended in loss of contact.

I wonder how the Brexit vote has affected others on here?

Oh, and what does it achieve ? (Got swept up in my own rhetoric )

If nothing else, it keeps the spotlight where it should be. Also, it provides a psychic energy to deal with the emerging shitstorm. Because calm and zen ain't gonna cut it when the real damage emerges.

All I was doing was asking why people are cutting ties with friends, and in some cases family, over politics. Yes i understand your concerns but your responses comes across as bitter and preaching. For the record I voted remain.

I don't think anybody intended this referendum to damage friendships and family relationships, but unfortunately that is just what has happened in some cases. It has divided the country down the middle. And unfortunately, the result means that some people are very gravely affected by, for example, loss of free movement rights, the effect of Brexit on the industry in which you work, or the prospect of shortages or rising prices in essential supplies of food or medicine.

If you work in an industry which relies on the UK being in the single market and your job is under threat because of Brexit (or perhaps you have already lost it), or your partner is from an EU country and living in the UK, it's not hard to see why you might find it difficult to forgive a parent or sibling or close friend who voted leave when they knew or should have known how badly leaving the EU could affect your life. And it's not hard to see why you might feel increasingly angry now if they are still wanging on about immigration and the NHS and sovereignty and "not being bullied by the EU" and all that crap, even in the face of all the evidence that they were lied to and manipulated.

It's not realistic to expect people in that situation to just say, "Never mind Dad, I respect your views", when you don't respect those views at all, and those views are currently fucking up your life quite seriously.

I don't think anybody intended this referendum to damage friendships and family relationships, but unfortunately that is just what has happened in some cases.

It was widely discussed before the vote ... it may not have been intended. But it shouldn't have been a surprise.

It was widely discussed before the vote ... it may not have been intended. But it shouldn't have been a surprise.

I agree. The Tories took a divisive issue and made everybody pick a side.

I'm barely specking to my racist mum because of it. I don't even think I need to mention which way she voted, the fact that she's racist gives it away.

The Tories took a divisive issue and made everybody pick a side.

This is the problem really.

A lot of people didn't really care that much either way. A third of the people who were entitled to vote in the referendum couldn't be bothered, and I suspect that substantial numbers of those who voted leave or remain were really not that fussed about it. Some people have admitted that they voted leave to give David Cameron a kicking (so it was about not liking him, rather than feeling particularly strongly about the EU either way). Some people have said they voted leave because they thought it would be good to have an extra £350m a week for the NHS, which means that for them it was a money issue and if they'd been told that leaving the EU would mean less money for the NHS/other things they think are important, they probably would have voted remain.

The number of people who felt very strongly about it either way before the referendum campaign kicked off is quite small. But there were an awful lot of ordinary, not particularly well-informed people who felt like they were being forced to take a view one way or the other and just went with whatever they thought seemed best at the time.

And now as a consequence we've been forced into warring leave and remain tribes.

And now as a consequence we've been forced into warring leave and remain tribes.

And that, my friend, is how civil wars start.

I know four people who voted Leave. One person's reasons were frankly, barking. Two others were ill-informed, and one of these cheerfully said that she didn't really know anything about it. I don't know the fourth person's reasons.

Have I fallen out with these people? No. Do I think less of them? Yes, in varying degrees. I don't really think less of my lovely colleague who hardly knew anything about the EU. She shouldn't have been asked to decide, any more than I should be asked to vote on changes to the Highway Code (I can't drive).

I haven't forgiven those who knowingly voted to strip others of their EU citizenship rights. It's hardly a case of agreeing to disagree. As for those who voted Leave while making sure they'd have Irish passports (or similar) themselves, words fail me, except to say that I will never, ever forgive them.

Quite an eloquent statement of how deep this sodding referendum has cut ...

The Tories took a divisive issue and made everybody pick a side.

It was already a divisive issue and had been since the 1970s. I'm glad the country got to decide. Even if I disagree with the results it was still a vote that had to be taken.

It wouldn't have been necessary if the government had addressed issues such as inequality and worked to make a better and fairer society for everyone, and it won't solve any of the issues that gave rise to people thinking it was necessary.

I'd like to think that after Brexit people will finally realise that the EU was a convenient scapegoat for the government refusing to fix any of the structural issues affecting the UK, but I'm sure they will still find a way to blame people in Brussels rather than looking any closer to home.

@mellongoose
The main 'problem' with this is that the EU was not the original 'problem' but a catastrophic failure of many UK governments for 45 years to actually use EU membership to it's full potential. They have dithered around in a half hearted way for so long on many subjects and not implemented things in the UK that they had complete freedom to do.
The government and 'the people' are blaming the EU for things they refused to sort out.

All I was doing was asking why people are cutting ties with friends, and in some cases family, over politics

no you weren’t. You think we can’t read your posts now?

Yep...FYI I'm an ardent remainer.

My brother works in banking. Day after result was announced, his company said they were shutting his division, so he could either move to Canada or take redundancy.

Bearing in mind he voted for brexit, when I asked him why he decide to move instead of stay and live the brexit "dream", he replied that the future is brighter for his two kids outside of the uk - we don't talk much anymore.

My parents, who also voted for brexit (their sole news source is the daily express) have lost two grand children to it, but refuse to acknowledge brexit was at fault.

Brexit has also outed a few of my oldest mates as out and out racists, and some who just refuse to listen to facts and prefer daily mail style shouty headlines.

The company I work for (about 800 employees in the UK) has around 20% of its employees from the EU. Ranging from skilled data analysts, software developers, marketing and sales professions, facilities staff etc etc. There is now a steady trickle of those people leaving and going back to either their own countries or elsewhere in the EU. Huge loss for the company, the country and I count many of them amongst my buddies. I can't blame them!

So yes, all in all, brexit is a massive pile of w**k. Its rotten, divisive and the worst thing to happen to this country in 70 odd years.

It's going to take a while before I think "we're in it together " about idiots who voted Brexit. I'm angry with them and disappointed that they have so casually tried to piss my DD's future against the wall.
Luckily we are all entitled to Irish citizenship so, frankly, feck 'em.

Brexit has also outed a few of my oldest mates as out and out racists, and some who just refuse to listen to facts and prefer daily mail style shouty headlines.

Worryingly enough, through Facebook and LinkedIn I have learned the split between the people I was at Uni with 30 years ago, was exactly as I would have predicted. So much for the idea that we change our views as we get older.

I think perhaps it is indicative of how shallowly some people think about politics as a trivial itsy-bitsy little "team sport" of tiddlywinks-level-importance, whose only significance is the colour of T-shirt (explains how many would vote for a rancid goat if it was wearing the right colour rosette!). If one were of that view, it follows that once the fixture has been played, there are no lasting consequences and everybody just "moves on" - after all, there's not a one of us who wouldn't be and labelling somebody obsessive/petty/bitter/preaching if they hadn't "got over" the result of the National Tiddlywinks Generational Championship, two years on.

The problem is, not all of us agree that Brexit is as insignificant as the colour of team T-shirt worn at the National Tiddlywinks Generational Championship. Perhaps what we need to be properly enlightened by the calm, well-balanced, non-obsessive, un-bitter, magnanimous and not-preachy members of MNdom, as to precisely why and how Brexit is as insignificant as the colour of team T-shirt worn at the National Tiddlywinks Generational Championship and has exactly as few lasting consequences.

And then we'll be able to "move on" and "get over it."

I agree with vdbfamily's point upthread that the EU is a total mess and am amazed that more people aren't asking themselves if that is an organisation we should want to be a part of. Unfortunately, people had a very UK centric view and were very poorly informed of what the EU is doing for our European friends. My dh, who like Wormzy is an EU national and had no vote, is a committed Leaver for that reason.
There were plenty of stupid reasons for voting remain too which are also not mentioned, e.g. "I like my European holidays". Stupid people on both sides of the debate, hopefully they cancel each other out.
I'm also very unimpressed that so many people vote because of losing EU citizenship rights - I appreciate that this is inconvenient for some, but it's a very selfish and short sighted reason to vote. The economy and whether the EU is a sound organisation are the only things that really matter to me because they will impact everyone's quality of life, long term. And I still think those two issues are quite finely balanced, and come to these boards hoping to get better insight on those two to justify (or not) how I voted. Not having any luck with that tbh.

The reasons to stay in the EU go rather wider than some of the more obvious. There is not a cat in hell's chance of the UK making significant headway battling for deals BETTER than it has through being a member of the EU against the likes of the USA, China and Russia.
Whoopee it has made a handful of possible deals in Africa, worth about 0.7 percent of GDP. Africa has very little money, and already it is in serious debt to China.
The EU is not perfect but compared to the other options it would have been far better to remain and fight to put things right rather than surrendering completely to China or America.

It's that defeatist attitude that I can't identify with, yeah the EU has problems so stay and work to fix it. Or leg it like a coward and make yourself suffer.

See that's the problem "the EU is a total mess". I'm sorry but that's not an argument it's just a collection of words. Do you mean the EU as a whole, the democratic structure, the nature of the institution?

If you were my friend I would think less of you because, on an issue as important as this, you put forward a point that is quite frankly laughable.

Put forward an argument that makes sense and you might get a sensible reply .

Total mess - corrupt, undemocratic, ridiculously bureaucratic, expensive, unfair, run by a few for the few, economically unviable

@Calledyoulastnightfromglasgow - is that the UK parliament. Until we reform the second chamber and our voting system, it sounds like it.

Corrupt - link please

Undemocratic- total nonsense it is significantly more constitutionally secure than the U.K. it is a democratic organisation complete with checks and balances.

Ridiculously bureaucratic - it certainly is overly bureaucratic but so is the U.K.

Expensive - doesn't make sense as an argument - do you mean costs a lot to run? If you do then governments cost money, saving money can end up costing money - see Northamptonshire Council.

Unfair - see 'undemocratic' above

Run by the few - please refer to 'undemocratic' above

Economically unviable - the specific institution or the EU as a whole. The economy of the EU will outperform that of the U.K. when we crash out.

The main argument seems to centre around how democratic the institution is. As the U.K. constitution has so many glaring holes in it the irony of throwing stones at another institution that is significantly more democratic is nearly too much to bear.

The economy and whether the EU is a sound organisation are the only things that really matter

And yet every time the Treasury makes a statement about the hit to UK GDP resulting from all forms of Brexit, the Brexiteers rubbish it as “Project Fear”. It’s rapidly turning into Project Reality, but let’s just stick with nonsense sound bites

I'm also very unimpressed that so many people vote because of losing EU citizenship rights - I appreciate that this is inconvenient for some, but it's a very selfish and short sighted reason to vote

What utter bollocks. The removal of my right and that of my children to live and work in other countties is not “an inconvenience”. It could potentially fuck our entire livelihood.