to warn of possible grounding of passenger flights and air freight from 29th March

[Clairetree1]

In order for any plane to take off or land in the UK from the 29th March, we need either

a) an agreement that we can still be included in the European aviation safety agreement, including agreeing to be bound by the European courts.

or

b) The UK civil aviation authority needs to set up its own safety agreement, write all its policies, establish it rules, negotiate with approximately 25 separate governments to come to an agreement that these rules are acceptable for planes flying into and out of their countries ( including the EU and USA), recruit and train several thousand staff, buy and adapt premises, put maintenance and safety procedures into action, to the satisfaction of said 25 governments, under go and pass international inspection and get underway.

My friend in civil aviation has been shouting louder and louder about this for over a year, as time ticks by and nothing whatsoever is done to make progress towards either a or b.

He tells me there was an article about this on the BBC website earlier, but it appears to have been taken down now, at least I can't find it.

Anybody prepared to buy air tickets for April 2019?

I got paid a lot of money for putting plans in place for a major bank for Y2K - we spent a lot of time, money and resources on it, it was a major endeavour not just in terms of computers but resources to be able to get the bank up and running ASAP in an emergency scenario (I was working for Facilities management at the time)
Just because people didn't see anything, didn't mean an awful lot of prep hadn't happened beforehand.
My bonus for the works put down a deposit on a house.

Tokyo, it's because although he's against EU membership he's spent literally years researching the best way for the UK to leave the benefits of EU membership without completely trashing its economy, and he is 100% pro-EEA membership. He is very aware of how bad no-deal or "Canada+" would be and is basically tearing his hair out over what a complete fuck up the Brexiteers are making of his life's dream.

I love the naivety of those who k think it'll all be fine as the government will swoop in, kiss it better and make it all ok

Francine does make some interesting points, of course before 1973 or rather 1992, our airlines enjoyed access to and fro most world destinations, using agreements from as early as 1908.

Unfortunately, we are now party to those agreements and newer ones, through our EU membership, something that will end next year, with no deal.
The UK hasnt sought to replicate these agreements yet.

But where i do take issue with her (and here she is clearly totally batshit) is Agincourt, any rabid racist brexitier would know that it was the Treaty of Amiens, signed on the 25th March 1802 that stopped all UK flights over France (and vice versa) how the fuck can you have a reasoned debate with some idiot who doesnt know that basic FACT ?

@scaryteacher "well-placed sources" - well it must be true so

@jasjas1973
Treaty of Amiens, signed on the 25th March 1802 that stopped all UK flights over France

I stand corrected. It was actually Napoleon that banned all flights to and from the UK and mainland Europe in 1812. Nothing changed until the EU brought peace, harmony and Open Skies in 1973

We CAN'T GO BACK TO THOSE DAYS!!!
STOP BREXIT NOW!!

The UK's Civil Aviation Authority is making it pretty clear that they don't want a No Deal that turfs them out of the European Aviation Safety Agency (EASA), too:

www.caa.co.uk/Our-work/About-us/EU-exit/

Jasjas1973

Francine does make some interesting points, of course before 1973 or rather 1992, our airlines enjoyed access to and fro most world destinations, using agreements from as early as 1908

It is actually very irresponsible if you to suggest that ANY flight was possible before the EU came about and solved EVERYTHING

I work in aviation, for a major U.K. carrier in a senior operational role.

We, and many other airlines, have been asking the department of transport for the last two years for clarification and guidance on what preparations and contingencies we should put in place effective 30 March 2019, but they have given us no information or guidance whatsoever.

Our view is that this isn’t because they don’t want to tell us, it’s because they don’t know.

We are currently taking bookings for our published schedules as normal for the Summer 2019 season but as things stand, we have NOT received official confirmation from the U.K. government or CAA that we will be permitted to operate flights either from U.K. airports to EU destinations, or vice versa, or between EU destinations post Brexit.

It really would be quite useful if the politicians got their act together at some point in the next few months......

Bonnie what is your take on the EU “bare bones” offer in the event of No Deal?

That's pretty worrying BonnieF, though from the research I've been doing not surprising - I keep hearing variations of that from a lot of different sectors.

@FridayThirteenth

Just to correct you, the document I posted (posted again below) was govenment analysis, not industry analysts.

publications.parliament.uk/pa/cm201719/cmselect/cmbeis/380/380.pdf

Bueto If a ‘bare bones’ arrangement is significantly more restrictive than the framework within which the industry currently operates, it would cause major disruption to travel betwen the U.K. & the EU. It would also cause disruption where UK airlines operate within the EU and where EU airlines operate within the U.K. (eg Ryanair from Belfast to Stanstead).

Pineapple Indeed, other sectors are likely to face major issues. The people trying to run car factories, aircraft factories or retail chains will have my sympathy if the politicians can’t sort out a workable deal.

We are currently taking bookings for our published schedules as normal for the Summer 2019 season but as things stand, we have NOT received official confirmation from the U.K. government or CAA that we will be permitted to operate flights either from U.K. airports to EU destinations, or vice versa, or between EU destinations post Brexit

Just as I suspected.
FURTHERMORE, no UK government or CAA source is willing to guarantee that British planes won't fall out of the sky on 30th March 2019 - a date we should actually be calling BREXMAGEDDON !!!!! !!!!! !!!!!!!

@bonnieF

what does airfreight consist of? I understand it to be partly fresh fruit and veg, is that correct?

Clairetree1
The Battle of Agincourt was about 500 years before flight, wasn't it?
That's just what the Daily Fail and the Putin chat bots want you to believe!

Clairetree1
what does airfreight consist of? I understand it to be partly fresh fruit and veg, is that correct?

Yes.

It also includes ALL medicines, water and oxygen.
Electricity and ALL food!!

It really is going to be pretty goddamn inconvenient - even if only for a few weeks.

SToP BREXMAGEDDON now !!!

Airfreight is cargo, which travels in the hold of the aircraft, underneath the passenger cabin.

It can be literally anything that businesses are prepared to pay to be transported quickly. Often it is perishable stuff like fresh food or flowers. We also carry valuables such as cash, jewels, paintings etc. Sometimes we carry live animals, eg cats, dogs. Anything that will fit in the hold of the aircraft!

Specialist cargo airlines, eg DHL, UPS, FedEx, carry very large amounts of stuff in huge, specially adapted aircraft. The global e-commerce industry has caused a massive boom in this part of the industry.

Francine You’re embarrassing yourself now. Reading your posts is like watching somebody who is drunk at a works do and thinks that they’re being totally hilarious when everyone looks on thinking what a complete twat they look.

Francine

You are very fortune to be able to treat this as a big joke.

I can assure you, however, that in reality it is most definitely not.

Somehow I’m not feeling that there’s a lot of confidence in the Grayling plan of relying on the EU offer of a bare bones / retain connectivity plan

Still, given Grayling’s outstanding management of the new rail timetables I’m sure it will all be just fine. Who needs trains and planes anyway.

I realise that being a Remoaner I am completely biased, but I do wonder, to a completely blank slate lurker, what the actual effect of the single-sentence “hysterical scaremongering/ it’llbefiiiiiine” posts would be. Does it have the intended anaesthetic just-lie-back-and-accept effect? Or would it actually make you more concerned, seeing these abrupt, angry and essentially content-free ejaculations amid the other posts which have paragraphs of information.

(I’m assuming that nobody is persuaded by the infantile nonsensical postings, cathartic though they might be for diehard Leavers).

I think Francine has slipped his/her handler and gone rogue.