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Brexit

Westministenders: Stalling for Time

963 replies

RedToothBrush · 12/05/2018 14:32

After 14 defeats, the Withdrawal Bill exited the Lords. In much worse condition than anyone dared to predicted.

Now we have those who were viciously against Lords reform, all of a sudden shouting about how much we desperately need it. Well fancy that. Tradition isn't so attractive if you aren't getting your own way.

Daniel Hannan has suddenly admitted that Brexit is not 'going to plan' (there was one?) and Johnson is still his weekly resignation threat.

It now throws things back into Corbyn's court. The Tory Rebel Forces think that they have the numbers to stay in the Single Market, but are blocked by Corbyn's opposition to it.

The decision on the customs union has effectively been pushed back to the Autumn by May, but we have to make a decision about the Irish border by June or trade talks won't go ahead as planned.

The trouble is that the Cabinet can not decide on which option they want to take, but neither is particularly viable anyway. Max Fac means a border in the Irish Sea which the DUP won't like and the Customs Partnership isn't acceptable to the Empire Tories. In any case it seems unlikely that either option could get through the Commons in their current form due to the growing number of Tory Rebel Forces.

May also has a problem with the grass roots. It is more or less impossible for her to deliver the Brexit they desire whatever she tries.

The growing backlash about the hostile environment also undermines the point of Brexit in reducing immigration. Its is growing apparent, WHY we need immigration and that the people who are being targeted for deportation are simply the easiest to pick off and not the ones that people see as 'a problem'. Indeed you have to wonder about how many immigrants ARE a problem. The idea to control immigration after Brexit was not through the border but through the hostile environment, yet this seems now to be something that will be impossible to continue with politically.

Leave.EU have now been referred to the police for breaking Electoral Law. It also turns out that they found numerous ways to beat the spending limit legally. The female data controller has also been found to have data protection law. Meanwhile Banks and Wigmore as well as Nix (CA and SCL), Cummings (Vote Leave) and Silvester (AIQ) have all been summoned to appear because the Culture, Media and Sport Select Committee. Zuckerberg also does not appear to have completed his answers to the committee as Facebook have had their homework deadline extended to Monday (and has been asked to appear by the 24th May whilst he is in Europe).

Culture, Media and Sport Select Committee Dates
Electoral Commission - Tuesday 15th May
Silvester - Wednesday 16th May
Cummings / Nix - Summoned to appear Tuesday 22nd May
Banks / Wigmore - Tuesday 16th June

Also in parliament in next weeks is and interesting looking ten minute rule bill named 'Representation of the People (Gibraltar)' - Tuesday 15th May

Anyway, we are all set for the predictable 'who blinks first' brinkmanship with the UK aware that if the EU don't blink we go over the cliff and parliament aware that if May delays long enough she bypasses parliamentary democracy or put it in a position with a gun to its head.

Who is looking forward to this year's 'row of the summer'?
It could be a long, hot summer.

Anyway, I want France to win Eurovision and the UK to get some points and not come last. Its not going to happen is it?

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HesterThrale · 18/05/2018 19:12

Pickles was a Remainer at the time of the Ref:

I voted Remain, so I was obviously disappointed by the decision to leave the EU. The beauty of a referendum is everyone has an equal vote. My vote had no more importance than yours. Locally the vote was resoundingly for leave, as I suspected, but I would not be much of an MP if I tailored my views to what was popular rather than what I actually think.
Democracy demands that I accept the will of the people and get on with dismantling our membership with the EU. I have received many letters from constituents demanding a second referendum: some claimed that they had not understood the full impact and regretted their decision.

ericpickles.com/2016/06/

EmilyAlice · 18/05/2018 19:16

I think he should be Lord Pickles of Branston. 😊

SwedishEdith · 18/05/2018 19:26

have received many letters from constituents demanding a second referendum: some claimed that they had not understood the full impact and regretted their decision.

I don't understand Pickles' point. He was a Remainer. He has Leave voting constituents who are regretting their vote. And yet, suddenly, he wants full Brexit?

DGRossetti · 18/05/2018 19:35

I don't understand Pickles' point. He was a Remainer. He has Leave voting constituents who are regretting their vote. And yet, suddenly, he wants full Brexit?

What are his views on a second referendum ?

woman11017 · 18/05/2018 19:37

There are two answers to that one Swedish : and only one is legal. Pickles and his poll tax (amongst other) history has disappeared from the interwebs. He's quite a character.
www.thetimes.co.uk/article/the-week-theresa-may-picked-a-side-on-brexit-bgb0zr66f

woman11017 · 18/05/2018 19:41

@Andrew_Adonis
No Labour leader criticising the Tories packing of the Lords. Has my front bench stopped being an Opposition?

Imagine if there was an opposition.

Icantreachthepretzels · 18/05/2018 20:04

I hope adding these ten new peers galvanises more peers to rebel. But one bill they defeated by a margin of 75. What does ten new peers actually achieve, other than make TM look shabby and underhand and tone deaf? Especially as one is a DUP peer, and therefore if anything she wants requires a border in the sea, then she can forget about his vote.

BigChocFrenzy · 18/05/2018 20:19

Adonis is correct:
Labour under Corbyn were never an effective Official Opposition,
but for several months now they have not been an Opposition at all

What are they playing at ? Confused

RedToothBrush · 18/05/2018 20:36

And yet, suddenly, he wants full Brexit?

I read that as
And yet, suddenly, he wants full Breakfast?

Gets coat

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okdok · 18/05/2018 20:47

Corbyn REALLY wants Brexit. I think he wants to weaken the country with a view to a massive shift to the left.

okdok · 18/05/2018 20:56

We're just playthings to these people.

BigChocFrenzy · 18/05/2018 21:05

Is this coincidence or planning for post-Brexit ?
Concerning, but still too little, too late.

Gov publication: New plans to keep Kent moving during Channel disruption

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/new-operation-stack-plans-to-keep-kent-moving?utmsource=c13fafd9-c1e0-4561-8e46-8b34dc73b6ac&utmmmedium=email&utmcampaign=govuk-notifications&utmmcontent=immediate

Plans to improve overnight lorry parking and to ease traffic in the event of cross-Channel disruption announced.

Roads Minister Jesse Norman said:

We’ve seen the severe disruption that people in Kent had to face in 2015 when there were hold ups across the Channel.

This interim planwill help to minimise that disruption and mean people will be able to go about their everyday lives, seeing friends and family or going to work, as well as businesses being able to get to their customers.

A public consultation on a permanent solution to Operation Stack, led by Highways England, will be launched shortly.
This will include asking residents, businesses and the freight industry whether they would rather see an on-road solution or an off-road lorry park.

BigChocFrenzy · 18/05/2018 21:09

They want a_ dog's Brexit_

That is, disaster capitalists
and disaster socialists

both want / need disaster & chaos, in order to be allowec to do what they really want

woman11017 · 18/05/2018 21:14

@DavidLammy
The Home Office asked to come to my constituency surgery. They asked me about their “outreach strategy” to people who are too scared to come forward. Then they arrested my constituent and put him in prison. He went for his passport and left in handcuffs.

woman11017 · 18/05/2018 21:41

"'Room on the broom': did any parents or grandparents reading it not understand the message of kindness,solidarity and friendship?"
nosycrow.com/blog/no-room-broom-axel-schefflers-acceptance-speech-inaugural-illustrator-year-award-british-book-awards/
And Judith Kerr.........

Dobby1sAFreeElf · 18/05/2018 22:27

woman that brought a tear to my eye. I took my DC to a production of that last year, it was wonderful. We spend our time teaching children so much about inclusion yet we forget this often as adults Sad

DGRossetti · 18/05/2018 22:30

I wonder if Theresa Mays stance of "protecting the Union" is being pushed from on high Hmm ... (or if she's hinting it is ?)

RedToothBrush · 18/05/2018 22:35

Newsnight: Damien Green, Justine Greening and Amber Rudd have a plan to prove that the Conservatives Parliamentary Party has enough support for a soft Brexit and are on manoeuvres...

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RedToothBrush · 18/05/2018 22:36

I wonder if Theresa Mays stance of "protecting the Union" is being pushed from on high hmm ... (or if she's hinting it is ?)

You mean Queenie...

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Arborea · 18/05/2018 23:20

Any good news about Brexit?

According to the Today programme, there's a multi-million pound dividend in the form of the saving we make by not having to hold elections to the European Parliament any more.

I would be interested in hearing mathanxiety and Somerville's views, but I think the DUP would opt for a Corbyn government over any differentiation between NI and rUK any day of the week.

prettybird · 18/05/2018 23:42

Following that argument to its logical conclusion, why not save money by banning elections altogether? Confused

Or, if that's a step too far Hmm, given that the Government doesn't listen to anything the Opposition says, or abstains and thereby nullifies amendments Confused (unless the Opposition uses a "humble address" Confused) - on those occasions Corbyn the Opposition actually bothers being an Opposition Angry - why not just have an election, and then whoever wins, send everyone else home as they can't do anything to change Government diktats policies, so why should the public be saddled with the cost of their salaries and expenses Hmm

Dobby1sAFreeElf · 18/05/2018 23:52

Does this count as good news?

@andrew_lilico
Since it appears we're no longer leaving the EU for 10yrs or more I'm ceasing all discussion of Brexit on twitter unless & until we go back to leaving (who knows - we might, any time), or until we come to Brexit2 discussions in a few years' time. Bye bye FBPE-ers. It was a blast.

BigChocFrenzy · 19/05/2018 00:04

Arborea Corbyn has campaigned for a united Ireland his entire career,
so him becoming PM would be an extinction level event as far for the DUP
He would hand over NI in a heartbeat, to get a better trade deal

imo, the GFA prevents Irish Nationalists forcing a United Ireland, but didn't really consider a future in which rUK would be hamstrung and seriously disadvantaged by being joined to NI

Corbyn could argue that rUK would have a right to independence from the UK, i.e. from NI

BigChocFrenzy · 19/05/2018 00:12

GEs cost £140-150 million
I don't see why EU elections in the Uk would cost significantly more
So cost would be very dodgy grounds to argue against continuing to elect MEPs.

What is a ground - and in fact reality - is that the EU parliament want rid of UK MPs,
who are mostly very negative, hard right & lazy / absent

and they have already reallocated the UK seats after 2019

  • so it is almost certainly too late to regain them.

It has been proposed that they may be allocated directly via an EU-wide vote by every EU citizen.

BigChocFrenzy · 19/05/2018 00:16

iirc the refurbishment of Parliament is costing £7 BILLION pounds
That's the equivalent of about 50 GEs , or 250 years worth !

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