The Brexit Arms

[BrexitArmsLandlady]

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The Brexit thread.

By Brexiters, for Brexiters.

Remainers welcome, but gobshites & goadyfuckers are encouraged to take their business elsewhere.

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Sorry Bear, I'm not going to start interacting with Faith as she's clearly just a wind up merchant, with no real desire to actually debate things.

I did answer it: without knowing what the future relationship will encompass, there is no way of figuring out the specific implications for Ireland, NI & the border.

faith I'm astounded that you honestly believe that.

What do you think the future relationship 'could have been' then?

What agreement, other than the cake and eat it one, would have allowed for no hard border?

This really isn't a difficult concept.

We want to leave SM/CU.

If we do so, there is no agreement possible that avoids the need for a border.

This is why trade negotiations etc should have been occurring in parallel from the beginning - the EU dropped a bollock in this respect imo, in their efforts to project superiority.

Barnier/Tusk is basing the EU position on the guidelines issued by the democratically elected leaders of 27 member states. The Commission will ensure these are in accordance with the treaties and the legal framework on which the EU is based.

You wouldn't really want it any other way, would you. Then it would just be a undermining the EU framework. It may not prevent a deleterious effect in Ireland, but at least any roguery won't be rewarded.

It is interesting how something agreed last year is causing such a backlash.

To be fair cardinal I think faith has been engaging more lately. I'm just astounded that she and others still think there was an alternative solution.

I guess it's all part of the 'nasty EU bullies' narrative.

Hmm. And still no basis for sweeping statements.

JWIM, you appear to still not have read my words correctly in that post.

Yes, I said 'if it had been done properly from the beginning, then' (paraphrased), but I also maintained that the only way to reach a solution for the border is if the EU stops the dogmatic insistence that the border is addressed first.

I know why they are doing this - they want to force us into SM/CU.

Sadly, they are using Ireland, NI & the GFA as political pawns to achieve their goals.

It is interesting how something agreed last year is causing such a backlash.

What is even more interesting is that all the problems manifesting as a result of that decision were flagged up at the time.

Well Bear, the original comment that I replied to was so astonishingly arse-about-tit that I don't think she's actually engaging at all, merely spewing DM style rhetoric to annoy people.

After all, only in Brexiteer land could making sure something is settled as a priority be considered not recognising it's importance!

Sorry Bear, I'm not going to start interacting with Faith

Please stick to this.
That would be awesome.

Wouldn't it just...

Hmm. And still no basis for sweeping statements.

With regard to the subjects I specifically engaged with you on?

@FaithHopeCharityDesperation

By "they" in relation to your last post do you mean the Republic of Ireland or all EU 27? Or the aliens being "they"?

Sadly, they are using Ireland, NI & the GFA as political pawns to achieve their goals.

You're not NF or related to NF are you? The baiting.

if the EU stops the dogmatic insistence that the border is addressed first.

The EUs "dogmatic insistence" (as you put it) is not some arbitrary taking sides just for the sake of it. It's a position borne out of the fact that Ireland is an EU member state and one of the things EU member states get as part of their EU joining pack, is the backing of the EU when negotiating with other countries.

How about we replaced the incorrect and inflammatory "dogmatic insistence" with "treaty-based obligations" ? Which is the truth. The EU is a guarantor to the GFA, and is now taking that obligation seriously.

It's a little worrying that some UK citizens seem to find the idea of a country sticking to an international treaty as a caprice. Not that it's never happened before. But generally countries that renege on treaties end up in a bad way.

But Faith whether or not there might have been another way to organise the negotiations and what was discussed/agreed, in what ever order, and whether or not this is because the EU was being a bully or the UK Govt poor in it's decision making in engaging with the EU, we are where we are, so is it now agreed that the only solution to the Irish border issue is the UK to remain in the SM/CU?

spewing DM style rhetoric to annoy people.

You're not NF or related to NF are you? The baiting.

It shouldn't come as a shock really, but I never ceased to be surprised by the deliberate goadiness of the hit squad.

Oh, the irony

There was no engagement. Just google it. And throwing a few headline words out.

Specifically, the non benign stuff. I am interested.

Why? NF said the same thing you said to Leo Varadkar at the EP? I was just wondering. It is not made up.

Maybe British people think it is a fair statement. But it is obvious baiting. For reaction.

Rephrase that. NF said the same thing to Leo Varadkar at the EP.

Specifically, the non benign stuff. I am interested.

Me too.

*There was no engagement. Just google it. And throwing a few headline words out.

Specifically, the non benign stuff. I am interested.*

It's a huge subject.

I'm not going to attempt to précis it for you in a MN post.

If you're seriously interested, I gave you a load of keywords to use in searches - there's a fuckton of articles, critical analyses, discussion & debate around the subject going back years.

I know it's folklore on MN that leave voters are 'daily mail spewing', 'alt-right website quoting', 'Nigel Farage types' (all descriptions taken from this thread) who are restricted of intellect (from previous thread & other threads across the EU Ref board) - but being folklore doesn't make it true.

I am one of those leave supporters who have been eurosceptic for years, and have read a lot around the subject.
During the Ref campaign in particular I specifically searched out pro-EU stuff to see if I could be convinced otherwise.
I was not, hence my vote to leave.

You have a differing opinion to me, based on your own conclusions re the EU - we voted accordingly - that's democracy.

alt-right website quoting

Apologies, I think that may have been the previous thread, not this one.

faith what's this magical deal that could have resolved the NI problem if only we'd been allowed to negotiate it?