Westministenders: Money, money, money

[RedToothBrush]

The big developments are that the government have signalled they are prepared to pay more and to involve the ECJ when it comes to citizens rights on condition that we move to talk of trade. But no apparent progress on NI. Which is significant with Ireland threatening to veto.

The EU has not changed its stance at all. Since Day 1.

There is always a worrying omission and lack of commitment to retain the Charter of Fundamental Rights. The bonfire begins.

Talk is of Green still going in a reshuffle, possibly with Gove replacing him as Deputy PM.

Coalition talks in Germany have broken down, and the British have got excited about it, whilst the German response have largely been a slight shrug.

Its been a much quieter week, despite the budget. Thank goodness. There are lots of outstanding issues that are lurking in the background like the Green one though.

The main message coming from the budget, has not been any new policy, but the dreadful economic forecast for the next few years.

Oh yes I have heard of her. It couldn't happen to a nicer person. 😀

Oh, when you said journalist I didn't think you meant 'journalist'

@sturdyAlex
1/11 Remoaner Traitor Thread Trigger Warning: The UK gov't is being thoroughly dishonest on the Irish border issue in four fundamental ways.
First, this issue hasn't "only now emerged". It was one of the key direct effects of leaving the EU. Entirely predictably so.
2/11 Second, refusal to go on to trade negotiations is reasonable. A month after the UK's Art. 50 notification, on 29 April 2017, the Council agreed a phased approach: Progress would have to be made in key areas, one of them being the Irish border, in order to move on to trade.
3/11 On 19 June 2017, the very first day of negotiations, the UK formally agreed to this phased approach (having, incidentally, prepared no counter-proposal). “It’s not how it starts, it’s how it finishes that matters,” declared glibly David Davis. Well, this is how it finishes.
4/11 Third, progress to trade talks is not witheld lightly. The member state whose trade most depends on a good deal with the UK is the RoI. Notion they're holding up trade talks to somehow vex the UK is fanciful. The stakes are as high for the RoI as for the UK; perhaps higher.
5/11 Fourth, Liam Fox's protestations that "we can’t come to a final answer to the Irish question until we get an idea of the end state" are entirely bogus. Nobody is asking the UK to "come to a final answer". What is required -and what the UK agreed to- is progress on the issue.
6/11 What would represent "progress" on the Irish border issue? Very simple. There are only four basic scenarios: 1. UK stays in both SM and CU; 2. UK stays in CU but not SM; 3. UK stays in SM but not CU; 4. UK out of both with a bespoke deal; 5. UK out of both with no deal.
7/11 All the UK would need to do is submit broad proposals on what their plan would be for the Irish border under each of those five scenarios. It's really very, very simple. But there is also a very simple reason the UK gov't hasn't done this:
8/11 The reason is because they know they have no answer for scenarios 3, 4, 5 that keeps their "invisible border" promise, does not threaten to bust their 'Confidence and Supply" deal with the DUP, expose Brexit for the clusterfuck it really is and, probably, cause an election.
9/11 These are the sorts of issues that were blithely waved away by the Leave campaign before the referendum with an "it'll be alright". I had foolishly assumed this was because they were difficult issues for them. It turns out that they had genuinely not given a thought to them.
10/11 In a negotiation where your declared aim is to maximise your global advantage, protect your citizens and strengthen your border, it is entirely reasonable for the other side to do the same. The idea of a border that's airtight one way but permeable the other way is fiction.
11/11 British exceptionalism is not a serious position. Hasn't been for many decades. It's encumbent on the UK to solve problems caused by its leaving. This gov't decided to notify under Art. 50 having done no preparatory work WHATSOEVER. It, alone, is the architect of this mess.

Is it the well-known Troll, who didn't speak at Lewes the other night, woman? Hatie KKK?

Oh, when you said journalist I didn't think you meant 'journalist'
sorry Hashi I don't quite know how to refer to her. BigChoc give us a good long german word for her.

The very one cat:
www.theargus.co.uk/news/15684255.Katie_Hopkins_talk_in_Lewes_cancelled_after_protesters_call_for__no_hate_speech_/

I'f failed you, woman
My German friends and I are simple folk: we'd just say Arschloch

(paywall) Keir Starmer gives Theresa May two weeks to save Brexit talks — and her job

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/keir-starmer-gives-theresa-may-two-weeks-to-save-brexit-talks-and-her-job-t9cgm8cxv
…
Sir Keir Starmer, Labour’s Brexit spokesman, issues a coded warning to the prime minister today,
hinting that his party could trigger a vote of no-confidence in her Brexit strategy
unless she succeeds in moving the talks on to trade and transition.

In an interview with The Sunday Times…
“She has two weeks to save herself, save Brexit and save the economy,

Getting on to agreeing sensible transitional arrangements is the single most important issue facing our economy and so the next two weeks are critical.
Failure to do so would be a very, very serious failure for the prime minister.

Hundreds of businesses have been talking to me about the fact that they have been making contingency plans.

They need to know whether there are going to be transitional arrangements
and on what terms
and they need to know pretty early next year,
so this is absolutely crunch time
and is a huge test of the prime minister’s authority and her ability to negotiate.”

Companies have started moving jobs across the Channel and cutting UK recruitment in the absence of a transition deal.

According to the Confederation of British Industry (CBI),
1 in 10 have “started to reallocate employees [and] replan their investments”.
By the end of the year the figure will be 1 in 3
and this rises to 6 in 10 by the end of March.

However, 75% of big businesses told the CBI they would put the plans on hold if a transition deal was agreed.

Leslie Galloway, chairman of the Ethical Medicines Industry Group, which represents the UK pharmaceutical industry, said drug companies were becoming nervous.

“Many need at least a transition deal agreed by the end of the year, otherwise they will be forced to activate plans to move jobs and investment abroad,”

A financial services company with more than 100,000 employees said:

“Without clarity on the end state or transitional arrangements,
we will need to start implementing our contingency plans by the end of March 2018
to ensure we can continue servicing client contracts from 11pm on March 29, 2019, even in a hard Brexit scenario.”

Starmer:
“There does come a point where if we miss this deadline
— after missing the first deadline in October —
then it raises the question of whether the prime minister has the authority to negotiate on behalf of Britain
and if the answer to that question is not then she should expect some very, very close scrutiny.”

that will do nicely thanks bigchoc. I need a new name. Arschlochhopkins would do nicely.

I'd have gone for Hate Mongerer but in fairness that doesn't narrow it down at the fail either

Whatever you do, don't Google "Brexit stockpiling" and select "news", unless you have a lot of (home made) wine in store.

There's never been a better time to be a home distiller .

The Tories have never considered the NI border issue because they know that the only ways to avoid a hard border would bring down the govt:

. either the while UK stays in EEA / EFTA - the Ultras bring them down
. or just NI does - the DUP bring them down

They hope to either bully the RoI into submission, or that the EU will eventually do it for them
Fallback if neither works:
divert the blame for this Brexit disaster onto the EU & RoI

The Uk govt should study history:
The Anglo-Irish Trade War 1932 -1938 happened when Ireland preferred to suffer hardship rather than back down to British bullying demands.
This time, the RoI is not fighting the big bully on its own: it's part of a 450 million pop. bloc, which dwarfs the Uk

If the EU sticks to its principles and supports the RoI veto, then imo the vast majority in the RoI would blame Britain for any economic damage
However, if the EU put trade first and lean on the RoI, then the EU would probably share at least some of the flak.

The idea that the EU would just leave its UK border open in the absence of a deal, which would be against WTO rules, is a ridiculous non-starter
As is the idea that they would just give the whole Uk a unicorn cake deal - which under Most Favoured Nation rules would mean giving magical cake to all those countries who have an EU trade deal containing an MFN proviso.

woman Something better for Katie
"pissnelke" = "piss-carnation"

and maybe for the govt as a whole:
"stinkstiefel" = "smelly boot"

I suggest using this for DD as it is more satisfying somehow than "lazy bugger":
"ein fauler Sack"

What is really yuk is that one term for male masturbation is:
< avert your eyes, LH >

"den Trumpf in die Hand nehmen"

The expression "Arsch mit Ohren" doesn't work, as it means "walking arse with ears" and this govt doesn't listen

Maybe my own invention "Arsch ohne Ohren" = " walking arse without ears", for whichever minister is trying to steamroller the RoI

Lewes and Katie Hopkins , not a combination I can honestly see working ever , imagine she would go down like a cup of cold sick !

Poor Hopkins. Losing her radio show and her Mail column, combined with that whopping payout to Jack Monroe...it's just too sad.

Food for thought BCF thanks!

What is going on at the Daily Mail? Sorry if it has been already posted.

Putin's link to Boris and Gove's Brexit 'coup' revealed: Tycoon who netted millions from Russian gas deal funds think tank that helped write the ministers letter demanding May take a tougher stance on leaving th he EU

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-5117547/Putins-link-Boris-Goves-Brexit-coup-revealed.html

Also why can't Gove and Johnson write a letter on their own?

Also why can't Gove and Johnson write a letter on their own
Someone's trying to change the narrative before the food riots?

Daily Mail has a different editor to the Mail on Sunday. The Mail on Sunday editor hates Dacre and will often take the opposite editorial line. Just because. The Mail on Sunday was pro Remain.

I wouldn't trust them to go to the toilet on their own
... or with anyone else

One thing Owen Jones got right:

"It’s like Night of the Living Dead meets Fawlty Towers, where the politically undead govern with an almost unwatchable level of farce."

Rumour has it JC has changed his mind on brexit

www.independent.co.uk/voices/kezia-dugdale-im-a-celebrity-get-me-out-of-here-jungle-jeremy-corbyn-brexit-changed-his-mind-a8076806.html

Like the supposed rebel tories, I'll believe this when I see it. Labour really are crap atm.

I won't hold my breath
because I'll go blue and die

MrsR. Please don't go blue.
Jo Cox honoured in France.

I think Arschgeige (arse violin) or Rotzlöffel (snot spoon) would be possible options too.

Gehirnverweigerer (a person who refuses to use their brains) would describe most of the current government.

German spoils one for choice.
Anne Soubry, freedom fighter and ex barrister on her votes and the European Court of Human Justice.

Im not really sure how that's him changing his mind though? Its pretty much what he was saying during the referendum campaign (on the few occasions someone let him be involved). Positively eurosceptic but not to leave how it was being done via referendum, etc. Though his appearing in the immediate aftermath calling for instant call was a bloody stupid bit of politicking. Either that or he now believes what he was saying, which I suppose is possible.