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Brexit

Westministenders: The Tory Civil War – The Knives Are Out Again. A Big Battle Looms.

999 replies

RedToothBrush · 12/11/2017 13:56

Today has seen the publication of a story about how Johnson and Gove are holding May hostage in a ‘soft coup’ and have made various demands over what they want for a hard Brexit. The letter which was for May’s and Barwell’s eyes only has some how leaked. Don’t forget how Gove has just joined the Brexit Cabinet.

It comes at a time, when the Observer is also leading with an editorial demanding Johnson goes over his handling of the Nazarin Zagheri-Ratcliffe case as well as his long list of poorly judged comments which have had diplomatic consequences and another newspaper is leading with a story about how 40 Tories are ready to no-confidence May.

It all smacks of a personal battle between May and Johnson to govern the party, which has been playing out publicly for some time, most noticeable in the parallel Tory party conference leadership speeches and Johnson’s freelancing.

Johnson also seems to be potentially caught up, with what happens in the Mueller investigation due to a photo and lying about having met Misfud which could be politically damaging.

Priti Patel’s –sacking-- resignation also fits in neatly with the story. The Foreign Office were not informed and there is the curious side story that May DID know various details but told Patel to keep quiet, so not to embarrass the FCO. Or more to the point, be seen to be undermining Johnson.

Whether this is true or not we don’t know. It does have implications if its true, but it also says something if its not too. Why leak the story at all? Once again its about the Johnson v May dynamic.

As it stands, if Gove and Johnson have been leading May then why would they decide to ditch her and go for power without her?
Notably Gove has the best satisfaction scores of the Cabinet amongst Tories on Conservative Home too. He has had a lot of favourable comments over his statements over pesticides. The pair seem to have put differences aside and are working together. And May has become more and more of a liability. Johnson, also came second favourite to be Tory leader amongst Tories (if you discount don’t knows and none of the aboves). Maybe they fancy their chances…

Or it’s a last ditch attempt to cling on to that power as threats that Johnson might finally get the boot – if Zagheri-Ratcliffe does have her sentence extended and Johnson’s position is no longer tenable for even May’s self-preservation. Whilst much has been framed about it being about May’s political survival, its definitely not just her whose future is in doubt. Who was the ‘dead wood’, that young Tories demanded be ditched in a reshuffle to bring in young blood? Either way, Gove has firmly hitched his wagon to Johnson's effectively repeating Johnson's dismissal of Zagheri-Ratcliffe's case.

Anyway another week and another set of high political drama is a foregone conclusion.

A round up of other developments this week:

Tory Party / Government

  1. May announces intention to enshrine Brexit leaving date in law to force rebels to tow the line. This has many implications, not least tax related and putting more pressure on the UK government. It’s generally regarded as a desperate move by anyone sane.
  2. The Impact Assessments were a dogs dinner that was done at the last minute, and were not worth the paper they were written on. There was no detail to them.
  3. Priti Patel’s –sacking—resignation after having undocumented and unauthorised meetings with a series of Israel ministers. And then lying about it.
  4. Penny Mordaunt, who lied about the UK not having a veto to stop Turkey joining the EU, replaced Patel.
  5. Damien Green Porn. Another ex-policeman is backing the story that it was found on his computer despite Green’s denials.
  6. The ongoing Zagheri-Ratcliffe story with Iran and Johnson’s gaff and none apology
  7. Photograph of Johnson with ‘The Professor’ Misfud has been found. This links Johnson to how events in the US might pan out. If there are lots more revelations in the Mueller inquiry about him, then that might reflect on Johnson and make him subject to some difficult questions. Politically this might be problematic for Johnson.
  8. Claims that the whips office leaked the name of someone who reported allegations against Nigel Evans which occurred 6 months after Evans had been cleared of rape and the sexual assault of six men
  9. Suspended Tory MP Charlie Elphicke has complained that he is yet to be informed of what he has been accused of.
  10. Young Tory MPs issue threat to May that she brings in young blood and gets rid of ‘dead wood, who do nothing but screw up’. Give her until the New Year to do so.
  11. 40 Tories apparently ready to no confidence May.
  12. Lord Ashcroft’s latest poll reveals a very small percentage of people want a no deal situation despite all the noise of it being a good idea.
  13. Lord Ashcroft mentioned in the Paradise papers. Reported as domiciled in Belize despite assurances given to parliament that he would give up his non-dom status and pay tax in the UK as a Lord.

Parliament / Opposition both inside and outside parliament
14) May facing a possible revolt over Universal Credit. MPs due to vote on reducing wait times.
15) Talk that there are enough Tory Rebels prepared to back a Dominic Grieve amendment to force a meaningful vote on the Brexit Deal.
16) May under increasing pressure from business leaders to make a deal after a meeting with them at no. 10.
17) Lots of distraction in the Paradise Papers generally which raises the question over the power and influence of the super rich versus the poor. This plays well to Labour’s narrative and against the idea of a low tax post Brexit Britain.
18) Lord Kerr, author of the a50 clause states that May has misled the public and insists that it is reversible.
19) New Money Laundering and Sanctions Bill in the Lords. Government looking to omit 4th EU directive on tax avoidance. Naturally raises questions about whether UK would adopt new rules due to come into force the week after Brexit Day.
20) Money Laundering Bill also has lots of overlap with immigration and home office operations, raising some rather sinister questions over who could be affected and why. Potential for abuse seems to be huge.
21) Leave leaning Cornwall and Grimsby seeking special status in the face of Brexit – in line with remaining to preserve business / economic interests
22) Suicide of Welsh Assembly Labour member who was under investigation for sexual harassment
23) A Labour MP accuses the already suspended fellow Labour MP Kelvin Hopkins of inappropriate behaviour.

EU
24) Ireland demands the UK stays in the customs union.
25) Brexit talks have not progressed at all despite apparently being speeded up. Barnier saying that progress in December only possible if UK makes moves on the settlement deal. Prospect of stage two being delayed until March being raised. This leaves just 7 months to come to a deal, which plays to the No Deal Crowd’s interests.
26) EU believe the UK are not working in the best interests of the UK and there is a failure by May and Davis to understand the process or what No Deal will mean.
27) EU signalling that there is no bespoke transition. Only available options ae EEA or EFTA fudges.
28) Increasing view in Brussels that No Deal likely. EU think May hasn’t got the authority to come to a deal and its easier for her to drag UK off the cliff. Though they have doubts she will survive much longer.

World
29) Trump sides with Putin above the US Intelligence Community over the Russian election interference. On Veterans Day.
30) US’s Wilbur Ross said UK will have to dump European food safety standards and that losing our passporting rights to the EU would harm our interests with the US.
31) Developments in Lebanon, with it being said that Saudi Arabia said to have declared war. Many would consider this to be a proxy war against Iran. Crown Prince has purged political opponents including several with significant Wall Street interests. Eight died in a helicopter crash.
32) Large scale far right march in Poland as part of their Independence Day.

OP posts:
Thread gallery
50
prettybird · 21/11/2017 07:51

I noticed that the BBC didn't mention the confirmed new locations of the EBA and EMA in either of the main news bulletins last night unless it was just in passing and it washed over me Hmm

nothing to see here, move along, move along Sad

PurplePillowCase · 21/11/2017 07:53

they have a teeny tiny mention on the 'business' page. no mention on breakfast tv so far...

mrsreynolds · 21/11/2017 07:55

I’ve been pointing ds1 in the direction of my old history a level texts

OliviaD68 · 21/11/2017 08:02

@prettybird

Have to wonder what our TV license fee is for. Has the BBC become a propaganda arm of the state? I wonder if the BBC would report on this if the EMA and EBA we're moving to London.

Eeeeeowwwfftz · 21/11/2017 08:21

I noticed that the BBC didn't mention the confirmed new locations of the EBA and EMA in either of the main news bulletins last night

BBC News at 10, 20th Nov 2017

www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b09fx60c/bbc-news-at-ten-20112017

8:40 footage of Matti Maasik announcing Amsterdam and Paris.

Yes it was a bit blink-and-miss-it, as it wasn't discussed further.

OliviaD68 · 21/11/2017 08:23

@Eeeeeowwwfftz

Do you know if it's on the website? I did not see anything about EBA/EMA there.

Lico · 21/11/2017 08:24

Was announced over 15 hours ago

prettybird · 21/11/2017 08:55

I did wonder if it was so brief that I missed it! Grin

But I agree with Olivia - if they were moving to London, there would have been major fanfares.

I'm all for trying to concentrate on the positive in the news - but we also need to acknowledge the negative things that are happening. Even if we were to rescind A50, these agencies are gone , together with all the economic activities around/to support them Sad

ElenaGreco123 · 21/11/2017 09:01

DS loved Peabody and Sherman, and despite not understanding any of the historical references at the time, he can actually quote it. So I decided to watch the French educational series Once Upon a Time... Man with him. I loved it when I was little and gives you the impression that you are part of something bigger than yourself.

I am a little bit in love with Helle Thorning-Schmidt. I know nothing about her politics, but her instructions to Stephen Kinnock in the documentary last night were fantastic.

TheElementsSong · 21/11/2017 09:03

but we also need to acknowledge the negative things that are happening

Not since June 2016. Didn't you get the memo?

thecatfromjapan · 21/11/2017 09:04

If we had a truly responsible television media, there would be a slot on the nightly news to examine how things are going with the biggest change to our social, economic, political situation in a generation. There would have been a serious examination of - apart from anything else - the fact that all those EU trade deals are not being replaced. There would be a serious analysis of rising prices; of the effects of no bank perspiring; or agency relocations; of the US position as regards trade deals (there will be none). There would be serious, searching interrogation of key Brexit figures as to what, exactly, has been accomplished and what hasn't.

None of this is happening.

Our media is utterly, utterly failing us.

OliviaD68 · 21/11/2017 09:06

@thecatfromjapan

How true.

Do you think the British public wants to hear it?

thecatfromjapan · 21/11/2017 09:10

Probably not, Olivia. But they need to hear it, don't they? Or at least be given the option to, in a widely-available, non-specialist form. That is, surely, the right and the duty of being a citizen in a democracy. Sad

OliviaD68 · 21/11/2017 09:18

@thecatfromjapan

I agree.

I suppose the resistance might be commercial - would it sell? - and for some outlets political/ideological - our owners don't want it.

I would certainly watch such a programme.

Even a section in a newspaper would be good. Make it free.

Eeeeeowwwfftz · 21/11/2017 09:29

Olivia: www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-42050742

Again, TBF, not easy to find (in the Business section behind a sign saying "beware of the leopard" and not linked to from the Brexit page). I only got there by doing a Google search on "site:bbc.co.uk EBA".

I agree that more could be said about the challenge we now have to replace these institutions.

OnTheDarkSideOfTheSpoon · 21/11/2017 09:31

The reluctance to delve deep into effects of Brexit are no doubt connected to the similar reluctance to investigate this.

Carole Cadwalladr‏
@carolecadwalla

IMPORTANT: every single aspect of Leave campaigns now under investigation...except one. The central role of Robert Mercer.
I laid out documentary evidence in this article. I submitted written evidence.
So many questions to be asked...& none of them are.

www.theguardian.com/technology/2017/may/14/robert-mercer-cambridge-analytica-leave-eu-referendum-brexit-campaigns?CMP=share_btn_tw

OliviaD68 · 21/11/2017 09:33

@Eeeeeowwwfftz

As a country I don't think we need to replace the EBA. PRA and FCA are pretty good. What's bad about the EBA leaving is regulatory influence. But since we are leaving the EU I don't know it matters. Or does it?

I don't know enough about the EMA to say. Loss of influence probably not good.

Any thoughts on replacement? What am I missing assuming we do actually leave of course.?

PattyPenguin · 21/11/2017 09:45

Why there will no longer be a UK judge on the ICJ. Because India.

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-42063664

Some snippets from the BBC story:
"This is how it happened. Five of the 15 judges are elected every three years to ensure continuity. Britain's judge, Sir Christopher Greenwood, was hoping to win re-election for a second nine year term. He is a highly distinguished lawyer and former professor in international law at the LSE.

But there was a hitch. Rather unexpectedly, Lebanon's former ambassador to the UN put his hat in the ring. So instead of there being five candidates for five places, now there were six.

And the former ambassador, having spent many years at the UN, had enough friends to win the election. He won one of the slots reserved for candidates from Asia. This meant the Indian candidate - Dalveer Bhandari - had to try his luck for a slot normally reserved for Europeans and in this case that meant challenging the UK."
...
"The Indian government was working hard, twisting arms, lobbying furiously, pulling in favours. The Indian newspapers were full of accusations that the British were using "dirty tricks" to try to win. Some commentators compared Britain's behaviour to its old commander in chief of British India, Robert Clive. Few anti-colonialist tropes were left unused.

In contrast, British ministers made some telephone calls. The British did consider invoking a little known provision in the UN Charter which allows for an arbitration process known as a "joint conference" to try to resolve such an impasse.

But in the end, the UK chose not to use this process, fearing either it would not get enough support in the UN Security Council, or that the competition would become too bitter and potentially disrupt the UK's economic relations with India."

(Sorry about formatting - can't get italic to work.)

Former colonies screwing the UK's standing in the world. Who could have expected such a thing. Going to help enormously when we try to be a global trading power all on our own.

RedToothBrush · 21/11/2017 09:50

Too good not to post. Andrew Neil gets owned:

Andrew Neil @ afneil
Germany tonight in its biggest political crisis since late 1940s. Bigger even than UK’s current ongoing political crisis.

Replies:

Law and Policy @ davidallengreen
The Berlin Wall was constructed in 1961.

Stewart Wood @ stewartwood
Its biggest crisis. Apart from the overnight construction of the Berlin Wall, terrorist campaigns by the Baader-Meinhof & Red Army Faction, a spy scandal forcing Chancellor Willi Brandt's resignation, & the overnight fall of the Berlin Wall

And the truly glorious:

Jon Worth @ jonworth
You have not got a clue.

One of four parties walked out of coalition talks. It might take a while to find a solution.

Big. F**king. Deal.

Andrew Neil @ afneil
Guess you’re not reading/watching German media.

Jon Worth @ jonworth
I LIVE in Germany.
I am a member of a German political party and am a delegate to its party congress.
I follow German politics for my job.

And, just maybe, I might know a thing or two about it?

Chris Hanretty @ chrishanretty
Always, always, always read the Twitter bio...

And the crowning accolade:

Law and Policy @ davidallengreen
#Follow @jonworth for Brexit stuff generally and for topical German stuff in particular.

Great addition to your timeline.

Also see:

Laura Kuenssberg @ bbclaurak
Merkel mess about as helpful to govt as Chancellor saying ‘there is no unemployment ‘ at the start of Budget week

Jon Worth @ jonworth
Misses the point.

No way there was going to be a govt in Germany before December summit anyway. And there was no disagreement in coalition talks about #Brexit.

UK still needs to get its own act together before seeing problems elsewhere.

#Sondierungen

Anyway this is a nice summary:

Faisal Islam @ FaisalIslam
In 4 months, Cabinet Brexiteers have gone from:

1. No Transition to a 2 year transition
2. Parallel trade talks to non-parallel talks
3. No ECJ transition jurisdiction to No ECJ over new rules
4. Go Whistle" to £20bn
5. £20bn to £40bn

The story about the international court of justice seems to be one of loss of international interest too. Convention was the big 5 of the security council always had a judge but it was not enshrined as a rule. The UN has grown in pressure to change this and to look more democratic. The UKs current position meant it was unable to diplomatically keep the position. Thus it withdrew candidate.

Significant. And yes it is related to Brexit.

OP posts:
Holliewantstobehot · 21/11/2017 09:57

So all remain MPs whose constituencies voted leave must vote in favour of the hardest brexit as they must represent their constituency. All leave MPs whose constituencies voted remain must vote for the hardest brexit as they are representing who now?

All this who is voting for what reminds me of the list of people who voted for the execution of Charles 1. They ended up having to go into exile when the tide of history turned against them.

Peregrina · 21/11/2017 10:15

I would dearly love to see people like Redwood, IDS, Gove, Davis, Fox, Farage exiled.

lalalonglegs · 21/11/2017 10:33

I've tried to check how my MP voted for last night's amendment on How They Vote but no information - is there a list of the Customs Union rebels anywhere?

Hasenstein · 21/11/2017 10:34

would dearly love to see people like Redwood, IDS, Gove, Davis, Fox, Farage exiled.

I suspect they (or some of them) may be happy to go into voluntary exile to escape the economic shitstorm which will hit the rest of us stuck here to deal with the consequences of their lies. Redwood has already told clients to move their money abroad - wouldn't be surprised to see him follow the money. And Farage will be off cap in hand to Trump (who's probably already forgotten who he is).

LurkingHusband · 21/11/2017 10:47

So all remain MPs whose constituencies voted leave must vote in favour of the hardest brexit as they must represent their constituency. All leave MPs whose constituencies voted remain must vote for the hardest brexit as they are representing who now?

The problem is the UKs "winner takes all" approach to life. Now apparent everywhere Sad. And winners get to dump on losers. It's a dog eat dog world out there .... which would be fine if people were dogs. Mind you, given the Gove "animals aren't real" stance, I'm not sure I'd like to be a dog in the UK right now.

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