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Brexit

Westminstenders: The beginning of the dictatorship and the end of Boris?

999 replies

RedToothBrush · 09/09/2017 10:55

Brexit is being fought in the UK media and parliament on the premise that the EU is being difficult and obstructive.

The fallacy can not be understated.

What the UK fails to understand is the right of the EU to put their own interests before the UKs. It doesn't under that our demands cannot be met even if the EU wanted to for practical and legal reasons - not political ones because our understanding of the situation and law is so poor.

The net result is the slippage of the next phase of Brexit talks being pushed to Christmas by the EU due to lack of progress by the UK. Barnier is open to more regular and intense talks but this is bad news for the UK with the a50 clock ticking.

The main stumbling block is NI a with Barnier warning not to use the border as a way to test EU resolve. Brexit always about the NI border. The UK have never provided a solution to the EU that does not produce a hard border. The idea being pushed by the UK will create one despite claiming it won't. The reality is the only viable solutions are either staying in the single market and customs union or NI being granted special status and being different to the rest of the country. The former is opposed by the government, the later opposed by the DUP.

The DUP are getting a taste of their own medicine. They have been warned that Assembly Members might have pay frozen and if they don't reform Stormont they won't get their Billion Pound Booty. Plus Ian Paisley Jr just found a new scandal for the party.

May is trying to channel Venezuela by getting rid of democracy when it suits. The Great Repel Bill (aka as the Withdrawal Bill) faces it's challenge. The much feared Henry VIII in clause 9 are not only facing criticism from Remainers but also from the secretive crackpots of Tory Bastard Club (aka ERG). The TBC want hard cliff edge Brexit. May seems to support given her goodwill burning interference at the Home Office which seeks to discriminate against all foreigners and make them sign a register. The visa system and how it will attract much needed staff for the NHS makes the mind boggle.

The Repel Bill also could end the possibility of transition due to clause 6 which requires us to leave the ECJ. Given the May's ambition to make EU citizens display their stars in job applications this is totally unable to the EU. If it passes the chances of transition drop dramatically. Bye bye Smooth and Orderly.

Then there is the May-Bot paradox: the one were she gives a friendly speech to the EU and a nasty on to the Swivel Eyed Loon gathering. As if neither will be reported to the other audience.

On top of this May is attempting the Parliament Rigging Act as she has a 'majority Government'. Yep I know, this is the general election version of 'will of the people'. The Rigging Act seeks to stack parliamentary committees with Tory majorities so they can stop any bill they don't like getting anywhere need the main chamber this limiting the power of opposition to irrelevant. Sadly I think this one will get through due to maths of the HoC atm.

We shouldn't forget the role of the HoL though and the lack of a majority government (why do you think May is saying majority government? It's down to the Sewell convention and trying to make the case it applies when the argument is it doesn't for a minority government).

The other development is the rumours that Boris is for the boot. And Rees-Mogg might get a promotion.

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woman11017 · 13/09/2017 21:29

petition.parliament.uk/petitions/200004
Petition for final referendum.

If MPs aren't allowed to vote anymore, I wouldn't hold my breath about us proles being allowed near a voting booth. Grin

Badders08 · 13/09/2017 21:30

Thanks
Signed

woman11017 · 13/09/2017 21:36

Probably the best twitter account around atm:

@manwhohasitall

CONGRATULATIONS to the 6 men appointed to the Welsh Affairs Committee @CommonsWelshAff for getting there on merit alone. Well done mates.

DividedKingdom · 13/09/2017 21:54

I see James Chappers is back in twitter-town Grin

Badders08 · 13/09/2017 21:55

Any clue where he was???

missmoon · 13/09/2017 22:03

Yes! Just seen that he's back.

lalalonglegs · 13/09/2017 22:18

I'm glad he's back... but he's got some explaining to do Hmm.

BigChocFrenzy · 13/09/2017 22:30

Vanity Fair sees the lurch to the right very much as the last desperate gasp of a post-imperialist older generation, singling out the 7 Labour rebels who defied the whip to vote with the Tories:

"These seven Labor members—Ronnie Campbell (age 74), Frank Field (75), Kate Hoey (71), Kelvin Hopkins (76), John Mann (57), Dennis Skinner (85) and Graham Stringer (67)
have an average age of 72,
< that is actually interesting >

which underlines a truth about the Brexit vote and the lurch to the right in Britain.

They are the product of something profound going on among an older generation, even among some left-wingers.
These people yearn for a past that does not exist and they do not give one solitary damn for the future of young people who will be forced to inherit the economic mess.

< several of us here are getting on in years, but I agree the great majority of age 60+ were the Brexit core vote >

Motheroffourdragons · 13/09/2017 22:38

This reply has been withdrawn

This has been withdrawn by MNHQ on behalf of the poster.

Motheroffourdragons · 13/09/2017 22:41

This reply has been withdrawn

This has been withdrawn by MNHQ on behalf of the poster.

thecatfromjapan · 13/09/2017 22:44

BigChoc I agree with that. Sadly, I think they stand a good chance of irrevocably fucking things up for the younger generation. It really think a lot of Brexit is driven by a desperate envy of youth.

Peregrina · 13/09/2017 23:10

I normally regard Dennis Skinner as a man with principles, as well as being hard working, but reading his autobiography recently, I couldn't help feeling that he was getting out of touch. He belonged to the time of heavy industry and that's gone now. I do think he cares about young people, and on this I really would have expected an abstention.

BigChocFrenzy · 14/09/2017 00:17

The UK’s high street banks are an accident waiting to happen
and could struggle in another financial crisis
< like Brexit ? >
according to a report published on Wednesday to mark the 10th anniversary of the run on Northern Rock.

www.theguardian.com/business/2017/sep/13/uks-high-street-banks-are-accident-waiting-to-happen-says-report

RedToothBrush · 14/09/2017 06:18

A tweet and a reply that should scare you

Paul Waugh @ paulwaugh
V signif. Tory sources say their MPs will not be expected to vote on ANY Opp Day debates for rest of Parliament

Robert Peston @ Peston
Goodbye democracy

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woman11017 · 14/09/2017 06:29

Yes^

RedToothBrush · 14/09/2017 06:33

Next after democracy comes Freedom of speech. Thats your social media and may has her eye on that to a stop 'terrorism'. Just a timely reminder that your average dictator views terrorists as pretty much anyone who disagrees with them. Repel has clause about individuals and companies not being able to challenge government too. No justice for the 96 there. And more to the point for Grenfell. After freedom of speech comes your human rights. May isn't too keen on these. Think she can't go full on Erdogan? Well what IS she doing to stop abuse at immigration centres and just how long has that been going on under her watch?

How far will may go?

I would suggest after this week that all bets are now officially off.

Our slide into darkness may be quicker than the US.

It is staggering how many say this is hyperbole and everything will work out just fine.

We have already crossed that threshold of a slip into Decline.

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woman11017 · 14/09/2017 06:38

This thread will be shut soon:

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/3032967-Conservative-Woman-Blog-takes-pop-at-Mumsnet-written-by-a-man?watched=1&msgid=71902394#71902394

And Labour are collaborating.

Spain has some lovely deserted villages being bought up by eco warriors, anyone fancy a change?

woman11017 · 14/09/2017 06:47

www.theguardian.com/world/2017/sep/14/thursday-briefing-yard-and-beeb-put-trolls-and-abusers-on-notice

I'm sure trawling for abuse, won't be used as a smokescreen for freedom of speech shutdown. Hmm

These trawls will notify employers of posts.

www.techdirt.com/articles/20170517/15232937397/bbc-says-it-may-contact-your-boss-if-you-post-comments-it-finds-problematic.shtml

Peregrina · 14/09/2017 07:14

Goodbye democracy

So just when are some of these noisy Tories going to start putting actions to their words and begin to rebel? Is May's Dictatorship really what they all believe? Not just the right wing idiots?

When I was telling at the last election, alongside elderly Tories, I couldn't help thinking, that they were decent enough people, and that they would be horrified if they stopped to think what their party now represented. One of the problems was that they don't stop to think.

RedToothBrush · 14/09/2017 07:20

Tim Walker @ thattimwalker
I accused someone today of 'Soubrying.' This is the new word for making a big fuss about something, but doing absolutely nothing about it.

Mark White @ MarkWWhite1960
^Harsh but, regrettably, fair.
Still better than Hoeying. Pretending to belong to one party, but actually belonging to another.^

Howard Wilde @ HowardWilde
One session of Soubrying is divided into several parts, called Chukas.

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DividedKingdom · 14/09/2017 07:22

Think she can't go full on Erdogan?

That's exactly what I've been saying for a while now. It's absolutely horrifying and I find it hard to see how this could turn around peacefully Sad

TheElementsSong · 14/09/2017 07:28

Now now, as so many of our wise and knowledgeable Brexit-voting friends have explained to us: We're just moaning minnies getting worked up about mere trivialities when we should be rejoicing in our newfound sovereignty! In fact, we should take a good hard look at the state of our mental health Hmm

MsHooliesCardigan · 14/09/2017 07:34

www.google.co.uk/search?q=kate+hoey+nigel+farage+boat&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&hl=en-gb&client=safari#imgdii=drlcbLlELp68DM:&imgrc=y1AHBOItBb4qxM:
Kate Hoey is a disgrace. Her cosying up to Fromage made me feel sick. Even Bojo and Gove tried to distance themselves from him.

Peregrina · 14/09/2017 07:35

We're just moaning minnies

That seemed very much to be the tone of the Tory Lords reading the link to the Hansard debate posted yesterday. The rest, cross benchers, Labour, Lib Dems all made sensible points. The Tories mostly spouted the party Tosh.

RedToothBrush · 14/09/2017 07:54

Poor mental health can be the result of bullying and not being respected by others.

Just saying.

It would be nice in the drive for improving mental health if we had a look at causes of poor mental health. This is why I believe that May's drive on mental health is utterly nonsensical.

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