A Brexiters chat with a German on a Portuguese beach.

[themueslicamel]

Just got back from Portugal and when there was on s beach where I left my shoes on s rock, s nice German chap brought them over and asked me where I was from (London) and how I voted in the referendum.

I was honest and told him I backed leave and we had an interesting conversation.

I told him my reasons for doings so, pro Europe, anti EU and confirmed I was for immigration, just having controls over who we let in and in what number.

I said we should and will take our share of refugees however I did not like the way the EU was going with the EU army on the horizon and feels we should look to trading freely with the rest of the world too.

He said many Germans feel let down as they need us as an economic powerhouse to pay in and we should close the borders with Africa and send all of the migrants back.

Some of his views seemed to be along the lines of what is often thrown against brexiters, and I appreciate it was a lone view but closing borders and sending people back seemed at least to him to be the way forward.

Not sure where I am going with this, just thought it may be of interest on this forum and provide an alternate (albeit limited) prospective.

We should ignore the scientists, the economists, the business people, the academics, the ex politicians, much of the world (excepting Trump, Putin and ISIS) and listen to the wisdom of privileged baby boomers, Farage, and a racist on the beach.

I understand now.

We should ignore the scientists, the economists, the business people, the academics, the ex politicians, much of the world (excepting Trump, Putin and ISIS) and listen to the wisdom of privileged baby boomers, Farage, and a racist on the beach.

I understand now.

Not all scientists, economists, business people, academics and politicians are in agreement.

Their opinions need to be checked for conflict of interest, as a fair few of them have their noses in the trough.

My parents are baby boomers, and worked bloody hard, often in jobs without sick pay they are certainly not "privileged".

So no, your sweeping generalisation show that you don't understand now.

Fuck me the EU really must be paying all of its budget to bribe people that it is good in that case.

Instituions that say remaning was the best idea.

IFS
IEA
LSE
Oxford Economics
SSMT
CBI
Almost all FTSE 100 CEOs
All University Vice Chancellors
Almost all MPs
IOD

Wow so that's virtually everyone in business, economics, science, politics, and education?

Wow now I know where the EU budget goes.

Fucking hilarious.

BTW also Baby boomers are the most privileged generation ever, indivduals may have had difficult times but as a generation they have far more privilege than those who went before or after.

Who mentioned bribes?

Funding and business interests are not bribes, and by the way I work in wealth management, I am very aware of the benefits baby boomers have received, DB pensions, MIRAS, LAPR, the list is endless.

Most have grabbed it and are now passing it on sensibly to children and grandchildren hardly selfish and entitled is it?

When you accuse people of having their noses in the trough it implies they are being bribed, or that they have vested interest because of money.

I was pointing out that the vast majority of instituitons and businesses in this county backed remain so if you are accusing them all of having vested interests because of EU money you are being ridiculous, there isn't enough.

Didn't say they were selfish and entitled, but it suggests a reason for voting leave if you and yours are insulated against the economic risks ( or you think you are, you definately aren't).

themueslicamel Wed 16-Aug-17 11:48:02
I work in wealth management, I am very aware of the benefits baby boomers have received, DB pensions, MIRAS, LAPR, the list is endless.

It does seem like you do know quite a lot about snouts in the trough.

Leaving the EU is undoubtedly a systemic risk, but we need to take a systematic approach to disentangle ourselves, hence the cancer analogy.

We are going to go through economic and political surgery and chemo for some time undoubtedly, and as I can personally attest it will be painful and won't be pretty, but once it's all gone there is life after.

I have no issue with being European, I don't think the EU in its current form is the answer.

Funding and business interests are not bribes, and by the way I work in wealth management, I am very aware of the benefits baby boomers have received, DB pensions, MIRAS, LAPR, the list is endless.

I knew it! I know lots in private banking who are Brexiteers, I called your tribe earlier in the thread didn't I?

So I am going to start a thread titled "A remainers chat with a Brexiteer on Liverpool Street (or Cannon Street) Station" . Don't worry you don't need to contribute, plenty more in the tribe, but not really representative of the Brexit vote, let alone the UK as a whole, eh?

I do not work in banking, and never have.

the muesli You have clearly not been mutilated, poisoned and burned to treat your Cancer. I have, I nearly died. Not just that but there was no guarantee it would work, I had only a 60% chance of surviving in spite of the treatment.

Cancer is the result of the cells in a body mutating and instead of contributing to the healthy working of the body they embark on a project of self interest. They don't do it in any organised way, they just multiply and behave like a gang of disorganised hooligans that overcome the organised response of the body's immune systems to resist. You can chop them out, flood the body with poisons that kills the healthy cells as well and send in the flame throwers in the manner of Danerys in the last episode of Game of thrones. However the crude attempts to wipe them out may not work, they may regroup and kill the patient in the most painful ways imaginable anyway. Nobody has any way of predicting if the treatment will work.

I think your analogy is tasteless in the extreme but is this what you really mean?

But you work in wealth management, which is similar.

Brexit is a fuck up for the city too, it will however benefit cash rich people like me when assett prices drop, I still voted to remain.

I am sorry you have suffered with your treatment, and unfortunately so have I.

I only know too well what cancer is and how it works.

Been there, done that, in remission, got the scars.

bath what are you doing sitting on a pile of cash with all that currency exposure when you could have been making 20% on the ftse or investing in a start up in the resurgent rEU?

Who says I haven't? But as everyone does who has cash I hedge my bets, some is in pounds, a substantial amount in dollars, and in euros. Much of it aquired when it was beneficial to do so with the £.

Had a conversation with someone who thought that leaving the EU would bring down property prices and make it easier for first time buyers. It really only makes it easy for people like me, who have access to cash, or can leverage easily.

But you work in wealth management, which is similar.

No it's not.

Helping average people with modest savings make the best of them is not the same as bankers, who are a bunch of risk taking selfish twats fucking the system with as much decorum as shit slinging apes comparing penis sizes with our money.

Then expecting tax payers to bail them out when it all goes to shit, again.

Rant over, as you can see, I'm not a fan.

Themuesli Then I am sorry to you too but surely you realise your analogy is stupid. I should add that it is scientifically proven that attitude has nothing to do with your chances of survival through this and horrific and potentially lethal treatment, positive or negative, so no point us remainers getting behind Brexit is there?

Helping average people with modest savings make the best of them is not the same as bankers, who are a bunch of risk taking selfish twats fucking the system with as much decorum as shit slinging apes comparing penis sizes with our money. So you voted for undoing the EU regulation that was designed to control the dick swinging. The Brexiteers defence of the impact of the city, I can quite Gove, Hammond, Brokenshire, Mogg etc. etc. etc. quite specifically, is that the City will be able to swing its dick so much more effectively in future without those constraints. Talk about turkeys voting for Christmas. You won't find any risk managers / compliance people/ regulators in the City thinking that is a good idea, I promise you.

bath put your money where your mouth is and stash it all in Spanish property. South of England, and probably most of the UK, looking like a strong downward bet for the foreseeable if you are right.

Disclaimer: I am not an international property investment specialist.

I worry that failure to unite as a country will create a self fulfilling prophecy.

I understand the remaining point of view, I really do, leaving was not a conclusion I came to lightly (although George Osborne's daily fear mongering helped, together with Mark Carney discrediting his neutral office ) and having that war criminal Tony Blair on your side must be a burden.

At no point have I used terms like "remoaner" either, they are inflammatory and unhelpful.

The reality though is we are leaving and going into the negotiations with the shower of shite we have, while ripping ourselves apart is not where either side wants to be.

Whatwouldrondo

The great repeal bill will remove the European committees act 1972, then convert EU law into UK law before allowing MP's power to amend them through normal channels in the future.

We do not need a return to the bad old days of an insufficient regulatory framework.

Howabout.

Its a waiting game, I have a particular set of assets in mind and if the price falls to the right level I'll buy, keeping the cash free till then is a good move as it means there is flexibility if unforseen opporuntities arise.

There has already been investment in the South East and London since Brexit, but that was more to do with the stagnation and falling prices in the high value property market due to stamp duty.

I agree that the division is a bad thing, especially when it is tribal. However how on earth do you expect to unite a country behind a "shower of shite" embarking on an act of self harm. One that in part arose from the same feelings of negativity towards other sections of society, be it Immigrants, foriegners, bankers, London. Brexit sowed the division, sold to people with chips on their shoulders (in part justified) like yours towards bankers, as a cure all, with the blame shifted on to the EU. The EU was not the problem, in fact it was often part of the answer, see regional investment, the GFA, Science, the knowledge economy. There are answers to creating greater equality and fairness in society and reducing these divisions, but it isn't Brexit. It will only make things worse, including dick swinging bankers. People will unite behind a project they can see has a chance of making things better for most of them, not one that will harm most of them as is becoming glaringly obvious to more and more people.

Wonderfully put Bear.

themueslicamel I can quote you the exact regulations that Gove and Hammond etc. propose to change, though I am sure they understand diddly squat about the consequences beyond what has been whispered in their ears by hedge fund managers (the biggest of the swinging dicks) intent on a beano. The changes are built into the contingency plans of the banks with a high degree of probability of happening, the same plans that will see a lot of us in the city moved overseas, taking our wealth and contribution to the economy with us, and which have an increasing degree of being triggered in the coming months. Actually it would be wrong to say triggered as a single event, decisions are being taken on the basis they will be all the time.