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Brexit
Original poster

LibDems wanting a second referendum - Please explain the logic

466 replies

optionalrationale · 06/05/2017 15:02

The LibDems believe the UK should remain part of the EU. While they accept the outcome of the the June 2016 Referendum, they also want the final terms of our exit deal to go to a second Referendum in the hope that we say "OK let's Remain after all".

Can anyone explain the logic of this position at this stage of the negotiations? Surely this encourages the EU to make our exit terms the very worst they can make them, basically holding us to ransom until the second referendum would be deliver the capitulation they and the LibDems are hankering for.

OP posts:
Original poster
optionalrationale · 10/05/2017 21:25

Bearbehind
"What that actually indicates is most people arent sufficiently interested to make the effort to go to the polling station"

Bearbehind, we go to the polling station when it makes a difference. I got six Leave voters to the Polling Station at 9:50pm on June 23rd last year.

You are right that I can't be arsed to vote in an election for MEPs beacuse you and others would take this as a signal that I actually took that JOKE of a parliament seriously - even if I spoiled my ballot.

The EU Council don't even have to comply with it. Meanwhile we pay for the whole sorry circus to travel (with dozens of trucks full of files and paper) between Bressingham and Streatham every fourth week

OP posts:
Anon213 · 10/05/2017 21:26

Nearly a year on and there are still no answers, still no promises, still no guarantees Because the negotiations haven't started been concluded, never mind implemented or had time to make a difference. Come back in 5 years. Like I say to my children, just wait until we get there. Learn some patience.

Kaija · 10/05/2017 21:28

"FFS UKIP won the last EU election and it had ZERO affect on changing the EU"

Have a look at UKIP MEP's voting record and you will see one reason why.

Original poster
optionalrationale · 10/05/2017 21:28

Brussels and Stratford

OP posts:
Bearbehind · 10/05/2017 21:28

anon you are blatantly just a goady fucker, trying to pick a fight somewhere, given you flit between defending comments the OP makes like 'A low turn out is a better indication of EU disgust.' to then completely counter that by saying 'which directs away from the reality their vote is irrelevant'

Make your mind up love.

Either it's important to vote or it's not.

Kaija · 10/05/2017 21:29

That should have been MEPs' and records - lost my plurals somewhere. But start with Farage and votes on fishing policy.

Original poster
optionalrationale · 10/05/2017 21:30

BRUSSELS AND STRASBOURG

OP posts:
Bearbehind · 10/05/2017 21:32

OP your obsession with boxes of paperwork moving between locations is beyond boring.

I couldn't give a shit about that against a back drop of uncertainty, inflation, strangleholds on trade and lack of investment.

Please tell me why reducing a bit of bureaucratic nonsense counters the above?

Original poster
optionalrationale · 10/05/2017 21:37

Today 21:28 Bearbehind
"You are blatantly just a goady fucker. Make your mind up love. Either it's important to vote or it's not"

Certanly, Hun, It is important to vote when it matters

OP posts:
Anon213 · 10/05/2017 21:37

Have a look at UKIP MEP's voting record and you will see one reason why

I dont really care what UKIPs voting record is, the UK voted (not me) a party into a 'parliament' that wanted to leave the EU institution and when David Cameron tried to get change from the EU they told him where to go. So whats the point?

Either it's important to vote or it's not

Your bear is up your behind. Voting is important in countries/elections/referendum where it matters, when there is a democracy. Like the UK. In countries like Russia, or a 'state' like the EU its meaningless. The UK doesn't get to vote for who runs the EU, our PM actively tried to stop Juncker being appointed. He was forced upon us, against our will. That is not a democracy.

Original poster
optionalrationale · 10/05/2017 21:40

Are you getting cwoss Bearbehind? Because you are starting to use rather a lot of four letter words. I was berated for using an F word up thread because I now realise how sensitive you Snowflakes are to bad words

OP posts:
Bearbehind · 10/05/2017 21:43

I wouldn't be surprised if anon and the OP are stooges of TM in some capacity.

That fact they are both more than a bit shit at arguing their point says all you need to know.

Anon213 · 10/05/2017 21:43

Please tell me why reducing a bit of bureaucratic nonsense counters the above?

Because its one symptom of the massive disease called the EU. If we cant even address one bit of the EU gravy train obvious bureaucratic nonsense we haven't a snowballs chance in hell of addressing all the others.

Some might call it MPs expenses a bit of bureaucratic nonsense, others will call it corruption.

Anon213 · 10/05/2017 21:45

I wouldn't be surprised if Bearbehind worked for the EU in some capacity.

Kaija · 10/05/2017 21:46

Berated for using swear words, optional? I don't think you were actually.

Anon213 · 10/05/2017 21:46

The fact she is more than a bit shit at arguing her point says all you need to know.

Bearbehind · 10/05/2017 21:47

OP, Really, Don't think you making comments about my language detracts from the fact you can't defend your viewpoint without deflecting/ detracting/ ignoring- it really doesn't.

twofingerstoEverything · 10/05/2017 21:48

China's 50 cent troll army

Kaija · 10/05/2017 21:49

Why oh why are those poor UKIP MEPs just not managing to exert their influence. If only there was something they could do...

www.google.co.uk/amp/www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/ukip-meps-attend-the-fewest-european-parliament-votes-of-any-party-in-the-eus-28-countries-10316962.html%3Famp

Anon213 · 10/05/2017 21:49

LOL, you know you are winning when bear behind calls the kettle black.

Original poster
optionalrationale · 10/05/2017 21:50

Today 21:20 Bearbehind
Nearly a year on and there are still no answers, still no promises, still no guarantees

Bearbehind - what other aspect of your life is governed by answers, promises and guarantees?

How do you cope when these are not immediately forthcoming?
Where should they come from?
How will you cope while you are waiting for them?

OP posts:
Bearbehind · 10/05/2017 21:51

anon yet another example of why you need to give your head a wobble.

Why would you mention MP expenses corruption in virtually the same breathe as giving them all the power to make decisions on our behalf?

Kaija · 10/05/2017 21:54

"Bearbehind - what other aspect of your life is governed by answers, promises and guarantees?"

Well you know, little decisions - buying a car, signing a job contract, even buying a sandwich in the reasonable expectation that it won't kill you.

Perhaps you feel EU membership is less consequential than these.

Original poster
optionalrationale · 10/05/2017 21:56

Today 21:47 Bearbehind
You can't defend your viewpoint
I think I can... along with 52% of the British electorate who could be arsed to vote on June 23rd, 2016.

OP posts:
Bearbehind · 10/05/2017 21:57

what other aspect of your life is governed by answers, promises and guarantees?

Pretty much every aspect of my life is determined by weighing up the pros and cons. The sums don't add up with Brexit,

How do you cope when these are not immediately forthcoming?

I wouldn't make a decision that will affect the rest of my life until the answers were forthcoming.

Where should they come from?

The people responsible for implemtening it.

How will you cope while you are waiting for them?

Don't burn your bridges in the meantime.

None of this is rocket science.