Westministenders: Up Shit Creek without Wifi.

[RedToothBrush]

Theresa May is being held hostage.

There is mounting evidence that all is not as it seems at CCHQ. It makes you don your tin foil hat and ask who is in charge.

Theresa May was a Remainer. She suddenly abandoned that when she became leader. Her proclamation of what would follow next seems directly at odds with her actions. This is not her fault. This is her plea for help and way of telling the outside world that she is a prisoner of Brexit.

At first it seemed like perhaps she had been locked up with Brexiteers for too long. She seemed to be developing a survival strategy which seemed totally irrational to outsiders. The signs of intimidation everywhere though. Instead of criticising those who did this, May joined in with them or was complicit in her silence.

Things are now taking a sinister turn. After repeatedly saying ‘No Election’, May crumbled and called one. She has now not been seen in public since. Instead she is being wheeled out at closed events to the party faithful. They are being dressed as mixing with the people but they are no such thing. The plebs in attendance are set to ‘mute’ or locked out completely.

Behold the coming of the May-Bot. She seeks to ‘prevent tourism’ in Wales. She now no longer knows which town she is currently in. (Much less have a plan for Brexit). She accuses an organisation set up to use its numbers to get better deals, of doing what it is supposed to, except she calls this ‘ganging up’.

May is not transported in a bus. Oh no. Instead she travels by the Bond Villian’s choice of transport; the helicopter.

More worrying still is the mantra ‘Strong and Stable’ repeated as many times as possible. It is almost as if, if she says it enough she might start believing it. She certainly has got her party members brainwashed and acting as if they were Zombies. Who needs ‘Spice’ when you are a Conservative? They ‘Believe’…

The ploy is to hoodwink people into voting for May instead of the Tories. CCHQ have removed Conservative branding from literature and campaigning in the North. The party are still too toxic, but May apparently scores well especially against Corbyn. Ironically however negatively I think of Corbyn he does display something May increasingly seems incapable of: humanity.

Many people might think of May as some sort of dictator figure. Its true. Every vote for her strengthens her hand. But not for Brexit negotiations. Mainly because Brexit is without merit or reward. Not unless you hold power. This is part 2 of the grab for it.

This is May’s power paradox. SHE is not powerful. She isn’t persuasive. She isn’t a healer of divides. She relies on authoritarian measures to get her way. This isn’t a sign of her personal power, but a sign of her personal weakness. She is sly and sneaky in her methods rather than compelling others to come along with her. They are doing so more because they dislike the alternative in Corbyn less.

She is not stable. She has lurched from one drama to the next, and has repeatedly been forced to back down from what she wanted. Nothing says ‘stability’ and ‘good leadership’ like appointing Boris Johnson Foreign Secretary. The lady is not so much for turning and leading, but is already staggering around dizzy whilst blindfolded playing pin the tail on the donkey. And Christ she’s got a lot of them in her Government. Including the numpty who decided to do a live event and broadcast it in an area with no wi-fi. Mind you, that is soon to be the entire country. Or what’s left of it.

She had said she had a mandate for Brexit and did not need this to be approved by the country as she was getting on with the job. This is why we are having a General Election to give her a mandate…

Not only that, but there is a lurking question here that should not be forgotten. Who is pulling May’s strings and making her dance as her actions are not natural? Every puppet show has puppet masters behind the scenes of the stage, hiding in the shadows.

They will dispense with their toy once she has outlived her usefulness like every good baddie.

Is she the one we should be most fearful of?

Hold on tight this is going to be a very bumpy ride over the next two years. Just how many casualties will be sacrificed on the altar of Brexit?

Liam Fox probably has the hubris, arrogance and stupidity ambition to want the role. God help us

My dad's comment about him as a medical student dad was a consultant at a teaching hospital was that he was "mediocre".

Would Hague be given another bite of the cherry? Wasn't he the first ever Tory leader not to win an election? Or was that IDS?

England is now true blue, no doubt.

The voting majority is behind May and a hard Brexit.

Its definitely not a case of "they know not what they do". People want this and lap up the talk of Britsih against the rest of the EU. It looks like Brexit would win with an even higher majority if there were another Ref.

I wonder what the UK and England will be like in 5 years.

I blame Corbyn

Quite large areas with NOC. Including Oxfordshire, unless the 'Independents' decide that they are Tories really.

The BBC is spinning the SNP results as a -7 failure loss. They won 431 seats this time and 425 in 2012 (The reason given for this is boundary changes )

The Greens have gained according to the BBC 5 seats. For the Greens, the BBC- Maths is simple: 14 in 2012, 19 in 2017.

Frank McAveety, former Glasgow Labour leader prior to the elections, also has a challenge with maths. He gave a speech saying how the formerly Yes voting city had comprehensively rejected the idea of a 2nd Referendum, as the SNP had failed to achieve an outright majority. The magic figure is 43. The SNP only won 39 seats. The Greens also pro Indy won 7 seats.

Its definitely not a case of "they know not what they do". People want this and lap up the talk of Britsih against the rest of the EU

I don't disagree, but - why? People weren't massively pro-hard-Brexit before the referendum - it was all "oh we'll still have a good relationship with Europe, nothing bad will happen to the economy, we'll thrive!" How has that turned in so short a time to this war-mongering jingoistic "who cares if it bankrupts us, let's have the Brexitiest Brexit possible, the EU are our worst enemy!" furious mob of a population we have now? It can't all be the tabloids, surely?

53, I think it is the tabloids. They brainwash people who unfortunately believe every word. My parents think the Fail is a great paper because it's won awards and quote it all the time like it's the bible . It's now hidden when I go round. They know my feelings on that facist rag.

I'm not sure of my movements tomorrow and Sunday. I am all over the place so don't know when I'll get chance to get online.

Here's the next thread up and running now as a precaution:
www.mumsnet.com/Talk/eu_referendum_2016_/2921780-Westministenders-Its-WAR-Huh-What-is-that-good-for-Negotiations-apparently?watched=1

People weren't massively pro-hard-Brexit before the referendum

And indeed until about 18 months before the Referendum it wasn't much of an issue for the majority of the population - the 40 or so Tory nutters out of 650 MPs were probably a fair representation of the population as a whole.

I remember readinga poll before the 2015 GE that "the EU" was the most important issue for a whole 4% of voters.

The BNP were devoured by UKIP, who were devoured by the Tory Party, to form May's Barmy Army

the EU are our worst enemy!" furious mob of a population we have now

Arron Banks did the logistics and organised finance.

Freud is quite good on explaining how the other stuff goes on.

And there are so many others, we don't know for whom, it's simply a big kerching.

I'm hoping nanons earlier article bears fruit as we go along on potential conflict of interest re May and her old man.

But in these times who know whose law will win.

pretty, I was just talking about the tiny loss of SNP seats. If any election in Scotland has now has been politicised along a cleavage of Indyref2, it is looking very good for the SNP.

Michael Barnier was on BBC Parliament. Speaking in Florence about Brexit and the rights of Citizens. He was very good. Light years away form the soundbite Tories. Giving examples of the many complex situations which may arise and how they would have to addressed. The layers of complexity. He was talking about how these issues have to be somewhat dealt with for discussions about future relationship. You know, the details. It must have been bonkers with May. Strong stable, chaotic coalition, success of Brexit. Rhetoric and sound bite. No wonder things she has dealt with end up in the courts. With the taxpayer footing the bill. I wonder who is going to be negotiating for the UK? A lot will be in the treaties and things the UK have been signatories/actors to as member. The Commission will have all the paperwork and everything laid out. This is their forte. If May was confident of their stance of not being liable for a penny and can just walk away, we would have the basis of that all over the news from the Cons.

I really don't understand how May seems to say on the one hand that the UK are leaving, but then on the other hand can't seem to understand they are going to be dealt with like a 3rd country. No better party than the Tories for a sense of entitlement, but an FTA with the EU will need pragmatic and cool, reasonable heads. They are not desperate or in a corner and it is has nothing to do May's 'resolve'.

You know that Junker was laughing when he said he was going to make his speech in French because English is losing importance in Europe. It was said as a joke. Yet, it is very hight up on the news in the UK. Bloody hell, the negotiations are going to send the British media into the stratosphere (and their readers who regard their blurbs as gospel along with it). Or an FTA which whispers cannot be as good a deal as membership.

I wonder what May was going on about when she said some in Europe doubted their resolve. The UK gov't's resolve has nothing to do with the price of fish! There will be a little to and fro on some of it. But it could end up in the courts if legally binding charges are reneged on. That is the exit. Then there is the FTA. They have their red lines on what they will offer to a 3rd country. May set hers out with no ECJ, no Customs Union, no Single Market membership and even no Euratom. Why are the Tories even so bothered about having an FTA with the EU? The EU is so dreadful and there have been lots of new planets they can do business with that the EU were preventing them from before

Isn't it ironic that the EU is getting more coverage in the UK media now there has been a referendum to leave it. Do the gov't want to just blame the EU for everything and walk away to save face as they don't have the upper hand? They cannot fix the reality to coincide with the expectations they have created.

Maybe the papers will create anger at the EU if it doesn't give an FTA that is better than membership. Blame them for the UK not getting their cake and eating it. Imagine a future as a non-EU country where shortage of health professionals, school places, housing, lack of good public transport and a healthy economy is still blamed on the EU? Mind you, the results of starving public services and not giving a damn might have found a new outside scapegoat by then.

Wouldn't that be ironic?

With a complete non understanding of the STV system, when I looked at the initial stats that came out I didn't see it as a massive issue for the SNP or massive gain for the Tories. Largely because Brexit and Indy isn't hand in hand, plus also the calls for IndyRef2 should have galvanised some voters. To me, from a purely stats view, the results seemed as expected.

Would that sound right pretty?

cail I imagine the EU will be to blame for everything including how a random person broken their leg through being too drunk for several years, if not a decade after brexit

Whoever it was too lazy that pointed out the incorrect French on the t-shirt. I apologise and totally blame the poor grammar system of the English language that made me forget there's a female version in most other languages

Love this:

Ben goldacre‏*@bengoldacre*

Why you should trust hacked candidates MORE:

1. They're an open book

2. They always seem to be fighting fascists

Stephen Crabb is back??!!

Andy Burnham getting Manchester mayor is not a surprise, but presumably a welcome result for the Corbynistas, as it removes one of the more obvious alternative leadership candidates (or at least makes it more complicated for him to run)

I remember my mum - a true northern Labour supporter through and through - telling me that she didn't think we (our family) could afford a Labour government so she was going to vote for Thatcher. I presume it's a similar sentiment driving voting in deprived areas ow

I can't stand Andy Burnham. He strikes me as someone who's doing an impression of a politician. He will bend whichever way the wind blows.

Lovely eyelashes though.

One commendable thing Andy Burnham did lobby for was the second Hillsborough inquiry. He would have had no political credibility if he didn't though as the crowd had chanted about justice for the 96 as he was giving a speech in Liverpool.

Agree Calleach1 .I can't remember many tories fighting for the 96.

I respectfully disagree with both Cailleach and squoosh. I think AB would still have had political credibility without the Hillsborough inquiry, as he was already a Cabinet minister who was already working on the issue. Hillsborough is a fairly niche issue: very dear to the hearts of people in Liverpool and many football fans, but not the thing that General Elections are won and lost on nationwide.

What the inquiry did do was give him gravitas. And I love the video of him addressing the 20th anniversary service, because you can see in his eyes the moment where he realises he really really has to do something - it's not often these days we see our politicians as real human beings.

I met him when I had a small DC up my top being breastfed - he didn't miss a beat, gave DC's tiny foot a wiggle and then spoke to me as an intelligent adult. Not many people manage to do that to a new mum in the midst of BF, never mind a politician.

He's not anywhere near top of my Shit List or anything but he seems to me like a canny and sometimes insincere operator who is always looking for a camera op. I don't dispute the assistance he gave to the Hillsborough families, but he knew that would win him major kudos in the North. And then I remember his recent comments on immigration, and his abstention on the welfare bill, and I think 'Andy, you're a fake'.

But as I say, waaaaay down my shit list 🙂

I wonder if Andy Burnham is sitting out the reign of Jeremy Corbyn in hopes of becoming an MP again in the future and subsequently Labour leader...

Michael Barnier was on BBC Parliament. Speaking in Florence about Brexit and the rights of Citizens. He was very good. Light years away form the soundbite Tories. Giving examples of the many complex situations which may arise and how they would have to addressed. The layers of complexity. He was talking about how these issues have to be somewhat dealt with for discussions about future relationship. You know, the details.

According to many it was/is a very simple thing though.
Countless posters on these threads, MPs & the HoL repeatedly stated that TM should 'just unilaterally guarantee the rights of EU citizens' at the stroke of a pen, as a show of goodwill with no reciprocity from the EU.

Yet now, because EU representatives are saying it's complex & detailed, suddenly they're the only level-headed people?

So, is it simply a stroke of the pen - or is it layers and layers of complexity?
It can't be both.

(This isn't a picking apart of your post specifically btw Cailleach - I've noticed I quote your posts quite a lot recently - it's just that you tend to put things that are discussed at length very concisely).