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Brexit

Westministers: Boris and May give us the Brexit Leeming Plan.

995 replies

RedToothBrush · 17/01/2017 15:17

Theresa May has made a speech.

It’s a wish list for hard core Brexiteers. It’s a large corporate executive’s wet dream for exploitation.

Even requests for a white paper as recommended by the Brexit Committee have been ignored. Thus meaning there is no chance for proper scrutiny. Plus whilst on the one hand parliament have been told they will have a vote on the end deal, this is merely slight of hand, with Davis stating that if parliament vote against this, then we will leave the EU without a deal in a chaotic exit. Thus making the vote an exercise with a gun to parliament's head.

Workers Rights and the Welfare State die with Brexit. Even the precious NHS. Especially the precious NHS once its been stole off to the highest American bidder.

May is being lobbied by her hard right and to save her next she listens only to them. She has no interest in listening to anyone else. The demographic and voting patterns favour her to head this direction. There is nothing to be gained for her personally by doing anything else.

She is already laughing her head off in glee at the collapse of the NI assembly. It plays right to her agenda.

Under the wheels of the bus go the JAMs, under go the disenfranchised who rarely vote but came out in force for the referendum, under go single mothers, under go the disabled, under go those with mental health concerns who struggle with already bureaucratic systems set up to ‘catch them out’, under go the EU immigrants especially those who have families here and may not have equal rights in future, under go British Citizens living abroad who might find themselves without healthcare or pensions, under go our Human Rights and any chance of challenging the state’s authority and interference in our every day lives, under go small business who will drown in red tape, under go Scotland and NI.

Yet this is ‘for the children’ or ‘the grandchildren’. Its spineless and cynical and offers nothing for those currently able to vote but under the age of 40. Won't you think of the children? Its fine if you are already retired and have a nice little pension isn't it?

The National Interest? This is a foreign concept. Probably an EU one.

The Baby Boomers are net beneficiaries of the welfare state. The young are unlikely to have a welfare state in a few years and are already net contributors. They have now been robbed of the choice over their future and in patronising tones effectively told they are irrelevant.

And of course Uncle Donald is a fan. You can almost see his vampire fangs reading to get his teeth into the UK and suck the life blood out of it.

It is a horror show.

Its all about selling Theresa May to the Express and the Mail and they love it. Her speech is to set the scene of how committed she is and to lay the blame at anyone who challenges her. It attacks the EU and paints them as the aggressor who are there to prevent poor little Britain from getting what it wants. If Brexit goes wrong, it was all an anti-British plot. Not a collective self inflicted brain haemorrhage. She's gone full on Farage and out Farages Farage.

This all comes perhaps a week before the Supreme Court Ruling.

Funny timing eh? No not really.

It’s a pre-emptive strike.

What on earth will they say? Will this merely allow May to dismantle our current legal system by gathering support for a General Election Manifesto that outlines its demise? Thus extending the mandate for Brexit even further. Probably.

I fear that the courts may only serve to strengthen May in the long run due to the lack of opposition and a Labour party that is imploding, with dozens of its MPs being rumoured to be looking for employment elsewhere. I fear that without a media able to effectively hold May to account in the face of her media baron supporters.

Our only hope really lies within the Conservative party itself and whether May is able to keep a lid on the various on going power struggles. The only trouble is that one of those challengers is a certain Brutus in the form of Mr Gove. I struggle to work out who would be worse; Gove or May. And of course this only highlights the issue that who else is there with in the Conservatives who isn’t a reptile? Even Arron Banks commentated that during the referendum he found Labour MPs nice people and the Conservatives unpleasant almost to a man. High praise indeed.

Meanwhile in America, NATO is obsolete and so Europe will have to consider an EU Army and Russia is firmly getting its claws in. And yeah, just Donald Trump. That Project Fear thing was just fake scaremongering wasn't it? Right? Right?

sigh

What on earth can possible stop this insanity? Not necessarily stop Brexit, but at least stop the PURE INSANITY.

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RedToothBrush · 19/01/2017 00:20

Let's hear this good news and exactly what all these opportunities are. I've not heard anything apart from this rather vague 'its going to be better'. Better how?

Sell it to people. Put in the pitch. Quantify it. Paint the rosy picture of the future.

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Suppermummy02 · 19/01/2017 00:23

Tell me, what opportunities for the young does Brexit give?

Why does Brexit just have to benefit the young, why can't it benefit everyone?

A democratic UK able to do do deals with the WHOLE world will benefit EVERYONE including the young.

Walk towards the light.

RedToothBrush · 19/01/2017 00:35

Well because the young are going to be the ones who have to live with it longest for starters. Because so far all the promises seemed to be aimed at older people saying it will be better for their children and grandchildren. And because there is a real danger of a lost generation being the result of Brexit and this generation didn't vote for it.

I have no problem with it being for everyone.

That's part of my point though. It's offering nothing for the young.

So sell it to the young rather than trying to dodge the question by repeating yet another slogan. We all know the slogans.

Why is it better for the children and grandchildren? Can you reassure those afraid they will be the lost generation by telling them how they will benefit?

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RedToothBrush · 19/01/2017 00:37

Walk towards the light and shout hallelujah praise the lord. Yep that solves my financial worries.

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Suppermummy02 · 19/01/2017 00:43

Yes I can sell it to the young. They will be able to decide their own laws, instead of being forced into a United states of Europe.

We wont be saddled with the debts of Greece.

We wont have to take unlimited migrants.

We wont be smothered with ridiculous regulations.

We wont have to pay for a ridicules gravy train.

We have won freedom for our young to choose their own destiny. They can still have a gap year in Europe or America or China.

Why settle for the EU when you can have the world?

whatwouldrondo · 19/01/2017 00:58

My DD travelled over the summer, and she is like Red heading for mid twenties, met all sorts and she did indeed travel to China, she speaks Mandarin , as well as the rest of Asia, Australia, NZ, Fiji and the USA. She still thinks Brexit is a really stupid idea and so did everyone she met. Even a Korean taxi driver in New Zealand, who hardly spoke English was aghast at what the UK had done to itself.

Still it is all going to be amazing, the 52 % are right and the rest of the world apart from Putin and Trump are wrong.....

RedToothBrush · 19/01/2017 01:12

Why didn't the young buy it and vote leave then?

There is no appetite for a united states of Europe from Europeans. It was never happening.

The debts if Greece are down to the eurozone and in some ways a red herring. If Greece has further economic problems we are still exposed due to how much Greece owe and how the economies of other nations would be affected by that. It's not something you can just avoid. It's contagious due to trade being linked globally. If Greece goes tits up, Germans would be able to buy less jam from the British.

As for immigrants, goes controlled migration of non EU citizens going? The numbers are going right down aren't they? The system we have in place already isn't achieving so why do you think controls of EU citizens will fair better. The best way of reducing our immigration figures is to scare people off from coming and create a brexit exodus of talent as jobs leave. Very global as Mrs May says.

Winning freedom to choose own destiny? Is that an ironic statement or just one that completely lacks self awareness.

We won't be smothered in ridiculous regulation. Nope they have won the right to eat chlorine washed chicken and loose their workers rights. Whoop.

That gravy train? Meh who needs that when you can prop up a low tax haven instead.

They can still have a gap year, if they aren't destitute.

Why settle for the EU when you can be Trump's gold mine.

Yep. Hallelujah. Impressive.

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caroldecker · 19/01/2017 01:14

NRTFT, but not sure why Trump comments on here - Brexit and Trump are totally different nd anyone who thinks they are linked is deluded.
On May's speech - there i no point leaving the EU and remaining in the singe market or customs union. The only way to get any benefits is to be free to do deals around the world. Remaining in the single market or customs union keeps the worst part of the EU with none of the benefits. Anyone who voted Leave but wanted to stay in single market or customs union was bonkers - access yes, member no.

Mistigri · 19/01/2017 04:53

Some extraordinary facts on this Twitter thread by @jonlis1:

twitter.com/jonlis1/status/821618541279477764

  1. Germany invades a lot less but trades a lot more than UK, even w/ C'wealth. It exports 133% more to India and 250% more to SA than we do.
  1. Even NZ, our new FTA partner, imports 44% more goods & services from Ger than UK. There are reasons for that; EU red tape not one of them.
mathanxiety · 19/01/2017 05:19

WOWWWWW

What a slapdown by JP Morgan. The language was so blunt and so critical.

They excoriated the government and singled May out in particular.

........

I wonder how Peter King (R - NY), effectively the voice of Irish American opinion, and close to Trump, sees developments in NI.

mathanxiety · 19/01/2017 05:30

www.4-traders.com/GOLDMAN-SACHS-GROUP-INC-12831/news/Goldman-Sachs-Finance-industry-s-worst-case-on-Brexit-spurs-contingency-plans-23707829/

Further news of GSachs' intention to move some operations to Frankfurt, NY and Warsaw, halving the London workforce.

May gave few details on how ... a transition would work or how long it would last for and lawyers advising firms in the financial sector said firms would be unwise to rely on hopes of a staggered exit period given that lack of clarity.

"We have a real concern that firms may be relying on the government delivering a transitional deal that simply won't be possible in the time that we have," Polly James, a partner at law firm Berwin Leighton Paisner, said.

"We are therefore continuing to advise our financial institution clients to keep developing their contingency plans for securing post-Brexit access to the single market in financial services," she added.

Mistigri · 19/01/2017 05:43

The best way of reducing our immigration figures is to scare people off from coming and create a brexit exodus of talent as jobs leave.

Ideally you need a recession too. Economic slowdown is the best way of discouraging people from coming, and encouraging people to leave. Auf weidersehn pet and all that. In fact a recession is probably the only way of getting migration figures down to the tens of thousands (that, or changing the way the figures are calculated to exclude specific sectors which rely heavily on imported workers).

Londoners and London businesses pay nearly a third of UK tax. Wilfully trashing the tax-take will have an impact on growth and will help with those pesky net migration figures.

larrygrylls · 19/01/2017 06:04

'Slap down by jp morgan'

Oh dear, I am sure May is quaking in her boots! How about you have a look at some jp Morgan reasearch from late 2008 regarding the stock market trajectory....or, if you can find it, some research from pre Euro on the impact of the Euro on Italy (seem to remember that they were v bullish).

Economists always sound convincing.....until you back test their forecasts. Jp morgan is, to be fair, one of the best, but the forecasters are still disciples of a 'science' which has been shown to have zero predictive powers and they are also incentivised on selling things, not being right.

missmoon · 19/01/2017 06:39

Red, you asked for positive political news, and this isn't quite that, but I've been reading the EU referendum blog by Richard North, a Leaver and proponent of the Flexcit approach (I think he was mentioned earlier in the thread). Anyway, it's been very interesting to read, particularly the comments from other Leavers below his post. It's the first time I've read something from a Leaver that made sense to me, and that I could agree with. So maybe there's hope? See here: www.eureferendum.com

woman12345 · 19/01/2017 06:55

And similar commentary on 'Today' programme on her potential reaction at Davos.
I understand picking off disabled, women workers, low skilled workers, women pensioners, EU citizens, strategically if not morally, but doing the same to the companies we need, seems politically unwise.

"I wonder how Peter King (R - NY), effectively the voice of Irish American opinion, and close to Trump, sees developments in NI"
Another thread is following the very physical dangers of pushing through a hard border in NI, when people might need passports to get over the border to get to the dentist. Modest example, but not one that 100 years of conflict would seem content to accept.

HPFA · 19/01/2017 06:57

We wont be smothered with ridiculous regulations.

Care to give us a list?

woman12345 · 19/01/2017 07:03

No taxes=no public service. No public services = what to NI economy?
Bad move

HashiAsLarry · 19/01/2017 07:07

Why didn't the young buy it and vote leave then?
All the young people I know weren't swayed by the immigration rhetoric put forward by vote Leave. Even from my somewhat backward isolated home town, a higher proportion than even my time have grown up with friends who had a foreign background so don't view them as anything other than people. An age where they have information literally at their fingertips, they also have a more acute need to fact check and possibly a better bullshit radar.

TheElementsSong · 19/01/2017 07:10

remoaners are a load of fuckers.

I'm sure Wrong will be along to tell us how poor the tone of this statement is. Oh wait, is this another irregular verb? They are worse than 10000 Hitlers for uttering such vile insults against the noblest people ever to walk the earth, You are unjustified, offensive and plain wrong to express your opinion, We are bestowing pearls of wisdom and pure truth upon those who should be grateful to be bathed in our light Grin

woman12345 · 19/01/2017 07:13

HashiAsLarry agree. Everyone under 25 have spent their lives actually playing with kids from all over the world online, they are a generation of gamers. Football kids are also steeped in internationalism. Working and living with people from all over is just being a human to them. It's like an argument between dinosaurs to them.

WidowWadman · 19/01/2017 07:14

That article is a) 3 months old, so long before May delivering the UK's suicide note and b) warns of negative impact of Brexit.

Mistigri · 19/01/2017 07:17

I've been reading the EU referendum blog by Richard North

North was incensed by May's speech this week and is aghast at how Brexit is turning out. It's certainly not what he voted for.

Indeed, most of the proponents of Brexit - including most of the official leave campaign shills on here - were rather clear that brexit did not mean leaving the single market and a bonfire of worker rights. Shame that's what you're going to get.

woman12345 · 19/01/2017 07:20

616 Women's marches across world now. 14 in Britain. Includes Cayman Islands and Iraq. Started by grandma in Hawaii in FB.

TuckersBadLuck · 19/01/2017 07:23

That article is a) 3 months old, so long before May delivering the UK's suicide note and b) warns of negative impact of Brexit.

And more importantly it's predicting that the UK will be (or will have been now) the fastest growing of the G7 leading industrial countries in 2016 - last year - followed by the prediction "that the economy would eventually suffer from the shock EU referendum result".

www.theguardian.com/business/2016/oct/04/britain-fastest-growing-g7-economy-imf-international-monetary-fund-brexit-vote

Suppermummy is like a particularly inept Daily Mail headline writer.

woman12345 · 19/01/2017 07:23

Paul Mason ‏*@paulmasonnews*
Lab-Lib-SNP-Plaid-Greens - co-operate where possible to stop it in detail. Lords, committees, streets, by elections.