The Brexit Arms. For all those who like a good drink, a good flounce, & a bit of trickery.

[surferjet]

Pull up a chair & relax......

I think that is the estimated cost.
The actual cost is not 'known' at all is it?

Happy to be corrected obviously.

I think it is the cost on which this budget is based, so in practice the same thing, really.

Can't imagine any difference is going to have much impact, once we're talking tens of billions of £ though, is it? It's not going to turn out to be free, or leave us with that lovely money for the NHS, is it?

But of course, Leave voters never believed that for a moment. They thought we had too much cash floating around spare, which we should spend on leaving the EU.

I think it is the cost on which this budget is based

Correct

so in practice the same thing, really.

Incorrect.
An estimate is not an actual cost.
A forecast is always just that: a forecast.

But of course, Leave voters never believed that for a moment. They thought we had too much cash floating around spare, which we should spend on leaving the EU.

That mythical homogenous, Borg-like mass that is the 'Leave voter' again.

I must have missed the sign up sheet.

Th sign-up sheet was that bit of paper in June where you had to tick whether you thought we should leave the EU or stay in the EU.

It is a forecast upon which this budget is predicated: as such it is having a significant impact on spending on everything else. If you have a forecast for heavy rain and cancel sports' day, sports day remains cancelled even if the rain turns out not quite so bad as was forecast.

So yeah, it might turn out to be £56 or £65 billion, and you're right, this is a prediction - but in practice the distinction is meaningless, because a) it's already in the ballpark of tens of billions and b) this is the figure that everything is based on.

I am sure many, many Leave voters knew all along that this would be the case, and of course not all of them believed there would be spare money. I'm utterly convinced of it. It does beg the question of why on earth they thought it was a good idea, in that case, though. At least the muppets who thought we'd have extra money had a valid, if utterly unsubstantiated, reason for their decision.

Doesn't really matter if you're a homogenous mass or not - the collective result is the same, thanks to all Leave voters whether motivated by racism, disgruntlement, some kind of genuine feeling about something, or love of 'sovereignty'.

That's just what they expect it to cost the Treasury (i.e. the country) of course, it doesn't include the potential cost to people and businesses.

in case you haven't, the cost of Brexit is £59 billion

Well that's interesting, considering we don't even know what type of Brexit we're getting.

It's another load of scaremongering shite. < yawn >

Worth every penny of that hypothetical made up amount

In fact I don't care if it costs twice that the long term benefits are worth it. I voted Leave expecting there to be a short term cost but as net contributors to the EU there are going to be savings and benefits that will offset some/all but honestly I don't care we need out of that unelected, wasteful tyranny so keep calling me stupid Seek . Until you can open your mind enough to see the other side name calling is probably all you have left.

Was just about to say, if it costs 100 billion it'll be worth every penny.
You beat me to it.

I wish these remainers would give up whinging.

Worth it to whom? All families will be worse off: the poorest third hit worse of all. And you honestly don't care?

I'm trying to open my mind to see how it would feel not to care about that, but I find it requires a concerted effort to close, rather than open, my mind.

The money that is going to have to spent on rafts of civil servants to organize this - and they will be unelected! Does that concern you?

You're going to be poorer. You're going to have this Brexit, hard or soft, negotiated by people you didn't elect. And yet nobody on this thread has anything to say but that it's 'worth it'. Since, as you say, we don't know what kind of Brexit we're going to get (though I suspect we have little choice), how can you possibly be so confident about that?

I don't care we need out of that unelected, wasteful tyranny so keep calling me stupid Seek

I actually didn't call you, or anyone else, stupid. So accusing me of 'name-calling' is a bit..... well, something.

Reread your 11:58 post it ooses out of every word.

I can't pretend I find the position an intelligent one .... so maybe you did detect some 'oosing'. However, I have not called anyone stupid, so although I realise there's a risk that post will go in the list of 'REMAIN VOTERS COME AND HURL ABUSE', it's wrong to say that I was 'name-calling'.

It's an awfully good way of refusing to engage with any of the actual issues, though, isn't it?

Worth it to whom? All families will be worse off: the poorest third hit worse of all. And you honestly don't care?
I'm trying to open my mind to see how it would feel not to care about that, but I find it requires a concerted effort to close, rather than open, my mind.

You do realise that there were 'poor' people who voted to leave, don't you?

As one of them, I am heartily sick of the head tilty caring.

Several people don't seem to apply their caring rhetoric when it comes to slinging out:
Stupid
Racist
Xenophobe
Bigot
Bully

But then again, perhaps if I was properly playing the part of the 'poor' I'd be doffing my cap to all those clever, caring types that are so magnanimously looking out for my welfare (nothing at all to do with furthering their own self interests or virtue signalling at all...)

So you're basically saying we should never have been given the choice whether we stay or leave, because staying was really the only sensible option?
That's not really democracy is it.
And I know that word 'democracy' has been totally worn out since June 23rd, but democracy is a core British value and one we should all defend.
Saying democracy doesn't really apply here because it will cost too much is ridiculous.

Of course Brexit will cost money, who said it wouldn't? but the cost will be worth it in the long run.

Oh, haha at pointing out a spelling error.

There have been a few by Remainers that I have ignored because, well, it's a bit pathetic and sneery to point out spelling errors, but apparently it's considered ok to be such a crushingly patronising pedant (so long as you voted the 'right' way).

Mango.
They only care about us when they're in charge, ( or pretend to care ) when we start to get a bit of power we're all thick racist idiots.

Have noticed Surfer.

It's tedious.

Surfer - So you're basically saying we should never have been given the choice whether we stay or leave, because staying was really the only sensible option?

I didn't say that, 'basically' or otherwise! You're just making stuff up about democracy now.

Mango I absolutely know there were poor people who voted to leave - lots of them! I doubt they did so thinking the result would be that they would be poorer, though!

This cap-doffing thing, I don't know where it comes from to be honest. Do you really think people only vote to further their own interests or virtue signal? Did you?

Oh Surfer, have a laugh that's not remotely tinkly. You haven't 'got a bit of power'. None. Nor have I, but please don't think you've won something here.

If someone's a thick racist idiot, they're a thick racist idiot whether they're rich or poor. I despise Donald Trump as much as any poor thick racist idiot.

Actually, for the first time in a very very long time, the forgottan, ignored, ordinary, person has got power.
We are changing the course of history for this country - if that's not power I don't know what is.
Which is why the rich elite just can't cope with it.

Well, no - because you don't have any say on when, or how, it happens, or whether it will be any good for you. You mandated a change in an advisory referendum. It will be organized by 'the elite', and indeed, more of the elite will now be employed specifically to implement it - all the unelected civil servants.

We all get our chance to have our say every four years, however ordinary, forgotten, rich, or poor, we are. That's been the case since the beginning of the twentieth century.

Are you suggesting only the rich elite wanted to remain in the EU? Because it's been argued a number of times on this thread that votes on both sides covered all classes, incomes, backgrounds, locations, hasn't it?

I didn't see the rich elite on the protest march I went on, that's for sure!

Someone who can afford a £165 bottle of perfume is rich elite from my perspective.

Surfer can you check the pub's sound system please? All I'm hearing out of the jukebox is 'moan and groan, doom and gloom, blah blah.... ad infinitum ' when it should we Queen's We Are the Champions - most disconcerting. Thanks

PS Also very happy if Brexit costs £100m - worth every penny.