The Brexit Arms. For all those who like a good drink, a good flounce, & a bit of trickery.

[surferjet]

Pull up a chair & relax......

Mango, I remember wondering why they accepted the irreversibility point but I think - hope - they are just working through all options and flushing the other side out.

Most of the MSM are Remain so it would not be in their interests to flag up that position.

Winter, the other thread today had a poster saying 'oh if we do this the leavers will think' etc - in fact I think you commented on it - but you know that MN thing 'when someone tells you who they are, listen'? They are not listening. They are not hearing all the voices, growing in number, saying we'll step off the cliff rather than be tied to the morass that is the EU.

Not in their interests to flag up that point -

I think we need to stop pussy footing around I think we need all the best heads in the UK to get on board with this now, and stop messing around with interpretations.

We need the whole gov on a war footing. This is in the best interests of the UK, its shame acts against brexit cant be seen as treason

Yes the think comment I only had a quick cursory glance over there TBH, but that think really annoyed me.

You see I see staying with the EU as the stepping off a bloody cliff!

I See cutting ties as the safe and stable option, because we are an advanced liberal and capable country.

Ok, so you're basically saying whatever the cost 'it's' worth it then.

There's no arguing with that when you can't begin to define what 'it' is outside of 'leaving the EU'.

Bear its an odd argument to have because when anything in life breaks down or separates, how can you argue for staying or leaving?

We all know if this was a MN should I stay or LTB thread, it would be a unanimous leave, whether the person should leave because things are so bad - or should they stay because life really is so low and appalling and desperate that staying really is an option.

The UK is not desperate and the EU really is that bad.
Should a woman stay with an abusive partner because she doesn't know what life without him is like?

I think we need to stop pussy footing around I think we need all the best heads in the UK to get on board with this now, and stop messing around with interpretations.*

The 'best heads'? What ... like, experts?

Peter Bone. What. A. Card

Oh haha experts.
We all know what Brexiters think about experts...

Tee hee, conspirital mirth, insert the following as appropriate:
...turkeys...Xmas...schrodinger's immigrant...forriners...Big Red Bus...unicorns...blah blah blah

Tedium.
As per.

Mango. Fancy a game of rummy?

Well, who are these 'best heads' then?

If the referendum result was to be binding then a bigger majority would have been sought eg 60/40 or 67/33, so I don't think that argument is a goer as the majority was too slim.

There is no if Marmite we either live in a democracy or we don't. The voting populace were asked do you want to Leave or Stay there were no conditions it was a straight question that got a straight answer. I get that you dont like the result but take the tin pot dictator hat off for a minute and think through the consequences of overturning the Referendum. People will stop voting, will lose all faith first in the political class, then with other authorities there will be a massive divide on our country and a breakdown in law and order. Democracy, the best possible political system is a privilege to live under but it sometimes means accepting a majority decision you personally dont like.

Should a woman stay with an abusive partner because she doesn't know what life without him is like?

This analogy might make some sense if anyone could actually articulate ways in which the EU is 'abusive'. As it is, it's in pretty poor taste because this situation is nothing like a wife leaving an abusive marriage.

The contradictation in the minds of Leavers never cease to amaze me. On one hand we have 'we shouldn't stay just because we don't know how things will work out outside' and on the other hand we have the 'short term pain for long term gain/ it's for the greater good'

How are those 2 arguments compatible? How can you know it's for long term gain when you've no idea what's going to happen?

Interesting no one answered my question about what they think about continuing to pay into the EU for access to the single market.

Is it too early for a drink to celebrate the result in Richmind Park?. Well done Lib Dems . Teresa May will I imagine be rather worried this morning as she represents another Remain area - Maidenhead. I don't feel an early general election coming any time soon.

Oh and InfiniteSheldon, we live in a Parliamentary democracy, where parliament is sovereign and not the people. The referendum was advisory only and MPs have to vote in what they believe to be the best interests of their constituents.

Richmond Park.
Failing to see what the shocker is tbh.

Shock!
In a by-election that was 'all about Brexit', an area that was one of the dozen lowest in terms of Leave votes...... expressed their wish to Remain.

The real shocker is, that the Remain vote was in the 70%'s but the 'vote for Remain, vote for lib dem' garnered under 50%.

Would have expected it to be higher really.

As strange as it may seem, a wealthy London constituency doesn't 'speak for the uk .

(Screenshot is of 2014 incomes - probably higher now).

I'll have a celebratory tipple with you, Marmite! Delighted to see Goldsmith ousted.

In other news... David Davis' announcement about paying to join the single market is headline news in several papers today.
The DM and Express have kept it off their front pages and chosen to go with more of their screaming anti-migrant headlines. Brexit looking like it might be too soft? Let's frighten our readers with immigrant stories.

Fab to see the back of goldsmith and a sliver off TM's already pretty small majority.

I think the most pertinent point is that Heathrow runway 3 will probably go ahead now because there is one less person on the government's benches opposing it.

Not sure what the fuss is about LD victory. Their total vote was less than ZG's majority at the GE. My interpretation as an ex Londoner is that this was far more about people being very very turned off by ZG personally given his divisive mayoral campaign and his arrogance in purporting to stand alone on Heathrow. If I were TM I would not be sorry to see the back of him as he is damaging to any political brand atm.

People will stop voting, will lose all faith first in the political class, then with other authorities there will be a massive divide on our country and a breakdown in law and order.
There already is a massive divide. Maybe leavers are less aware of this than remainers. I don't know. But we have seen a huge increase in divisive hate speech since 24th June. Only today, someone has tweeted SOMEONE JO COX ANNA SOUBRY PLEASE
Also, many of us lost faith in the political class a long time ago and have had that feeling well and truly consolidated both in the lead-up to the referendum and subsequent to it.

I've put the Dom Perignon on ice incase Zac pops in later for a quick one.

Strongly suspect Zac will already have been up a while celebrating his loss surfer

"I think the most pertinent point is that Heathrow runway 3 will probably go ahead now because there is one less person on the government's benches opposing it"

What are you taking about? The Lib Dems are opposed to the third runway.

Not sure why remainers are celebrating this tbh, the Richmond vote changes what exactly?

I honestly wish we could round up all these idiots and arrest them for treason.
Or just ship them off to Greece.

Ah so you suspect like me missmoon that given half a chance the LDs would rejoin the Tory government's benches - Tory majority slim and slip them a fig leaf over single market access.