Leaves, EU immigration/FOM what is it you actually want?

[fakenamefornow]

Tourist visas?
Working visas?
No visas, just no work?
Maximum length of stay?
Funded how?

I am really clueless about what exactly you want.

Would you still ask them to pay the same taxes as British citizens?

Others can decide that clearly. I am just giving my views on post FOM.

Trying, presumably you will be happy to put me up if I lose the right to live abroad? And my family? I am one of the hypothetical millions of immigrants living in another EU country. What if we have to move back ask for housing and benefits as we become homeless and unemployed? The sheer fact that most people seem to ignore that FOM is RECIPROCAL makes me furious. What about my pension, earned over 3 EU countries to date? How will that work? Bet you have no idea. I have done nothing wrong and worked hard all my life. But you can fuck with all my life plans and dismiss the worries and concerns of millions of people because you don't want forriners? Makes me sick to my stomach.

Benefits too are reciprocal you know. You can't just rock up and claim unemployment anywhere. Working benefits are the responsibility of the country not the EU. If there were no tax credits in U.K. Because they were not needed, forriners couldn't claim them either. It is NOTHING to do with the EU.

Marcia, of course I wouldn't dream of putting you up.
Why do you spell foreigners like that?
I am not responsible for your life choices or your pension.
Tax credits are for UK citizens as far as I am concerned. The problem is that the EU has ensured that other EU nationals (those that you call forriners! ) are also entitled to them if they live here. The UK Government IS doing something about it. They are taking us out of the EU.
Stop blaming others when your life choices don't go according to your plan.

Don't be furious. I am fully aware that FOM is reciprocal and I am not ignoring it.
However, if you choose to leave the UK then you have to take the consequences.
Why on earth do you think you are my responsibility?

It does not make me feel anything.

Oh puh-lease. You've been consistent on many of these threads with your views about immigrants and "changes to the culture" and "local people not feeling at ease."

Now you're getting all coy about the specific wording by which you want immigrants to clear off: wanting British-born children to leave the only home they've known just because they had the gall to be born to foreign parents is A-OK, wanting families who have built their lives in another country (whether foreigners in the UK or British citizens abroad) to be thrown into turmoil is just what they deserve for "not having the same investment" is A-OK...

But only A-OK by murky, underhanded poisoning of the social/political climate for migrants.

Actually saying "bugger" or "fuck", well that's just beyond the pale!

Stop blaming others when your life choices don't go according to your plan.

Hardly a fair comment when other people have moved the goalposts

elements

Did someone say fuck?

I am going to have to read that thread now

Marcia you have my sympathy. I'm a EU national in the UK, similar situation and I'm terrified. Concepts such as solidarity, openness, tolerance and human rights, those that we've taken for granted and make life worth living, are being erased before our eyes. I'm horrified at the response you've got here, for example. Do they realise they sound like small minded, resentful little bigots?

Aaah i see now elements

I was hoping that the thread hadnt descended that far

Like I said Trying, I have done nothing wrong. My life choices were sensibly planned according to rights laid down which some people now seem to be determined to erase for no good reason apart from bigotry (though that is my own opinion I hasten to add) Ditto for many UK citizens living abroad and EU citizens in the UK. And you might have your own reasons for wanting to leave the EU, fair enough, but you seem to have NO CARE for anyone else. I am a British citizen. If millions of us all turned up needing housing and benefits and doctors appointments, now that would be something to worry about. not the 300k net migration figure.

trying the arrangement you so loath also benefits (disproportionately, some could say) British "expats" who live in EU and are old and fragile, needing much health care provided by French, Spanish, Italian, Greek health services. It is reciprocal, but I see that you'd like to see people staying in the place where they were born or face the consequences. Nice.

Well we might come back and take a house, jobs, doctors slots, school places etc that we are not currently taking up. Maybe some tax credits, child benefit etc. We're getting on a bit now, so more likely to need to some health treatment, screening etc. If my EU pension is buggered presumably will need some more state support. Us and many like us. Be careful what you wish for (as you have no clue)

And as there are NO plans in place to cover any of this, please don't say it won't just happen. No one has a fucking clue what will happen.

Jaws and Marcia.
Look at the title of this thread. It is asking for Leavers to say what they would like in place of FOM.
As usual it has degenerated into name calling of Leavers. And Marcia is saying I have to put her and her family up if they have to return. Absurd.
At no point have I called you nasty names.
I have never accused anyone of being a "strange foreigner". I have said that some people feel uneasy in their locality and I do not like the way our culture is changing. The Prime Minister said this last evening in her speech at the Mansion House.

Marcia. I'd refer you back to your reciprocal. If we get you back it would surely mean we'd lose another.

Marcia. I am careful what I wish for and I certainly DO have a clue.
I would never say it won't happen. Oh no. I am wishing for a "hard" Brexit.

I'd refer you back to your reciprocal. If we get you back it would surely mean we'd lose another.

Huh?

If we get you back it would surely mean we'd lose another that's xenophobic. You should have a good look at yourself.

I am grateful that Charles Goerens (MEP) is putting forward a motion to allow Brits who do not want their EU citizenship stripped from them against their will to retain it - I'm happy to pay additional tax for this, and leavers can opt out.

From quite a way back in the thread.

This has made me lol the last couple of days.
It's hysterical (and wholly unsurprising) how quickly the liberal handwringing over The Poor! Who Will Be Further Disenfranchised And Put Upon By Evil Brexit! have been cast aside like a used tissue now that there may be a sniff of buying one's way into the bountiful & loving embrace of the EU.

This thread hasn't had the usual that are usually abundant, so I'll throw one of them in for good measure.

buying one's way into the bountiful & loving embrace of the EU.

What do you suggest people do about it? Should everybody forgo anything that not all can access? Or perhaps the government should pay the cost of accessing EU citizenship and its benefits for those who need assistance - they could send an annual subscription for this...

"It is about the very basic changes to our society, our culture and our communities. "

You do realise that so many of us were knocked off and knicked from before mass immigration right? All these things were said about various ethnic European groups to justify invasions, genocide, creating cheap labour etc. Just 10% of my people can speak their native language thanks to policies like these. All the insitutional abuse from the church and the military..Yet we're supposed to just forget all that and believe that you want the best for our communities .... like you did before? hmmm, right.

YOU make the basic societal changes when EVERYONE YOU DON'T LIKE KEEPS GETTING CALLED TERRORISTS, THEIR COMMUNITIES ARE TARGETED AND WIPED OUT, SURVIVORS ARE HANDED A BIBLE AND TOLD JESUS LOVES THEM!!!